Still Unbalanced.
Mythr1l
Join Date: 2003-01-26 Member: 12772Members
Join Date: 2003-01-26 Member: 12772Members
<div class="IPBDescription">4 months of testing?</div> in matches aliens are far to strong over marines. how did it take you 4 months of beta testing and this game still does not allow the better team to win?
Skulks are far to strong at the beggining, you can see the great teamwork which was encouraged being wiped out by 2 skulks with celerity/silence or carapace. This basically allows any compotent alien team to dominate the map and the rts before the marines get upgrades, either the rines choose to do a very risky quick upgrade strat (in which case any good alien side will destroy the base) or be forced to spend res on turrets (quite hard to do considering you can probably hold 2 RT's at the very most with your vannilla marines), assuming the aliens arnt lieing down and letting you win of course.
on the other hand you could try to relocate to a hive, then phase link the second, that would seem one of the stronger tactics, but good aliens would own your relocate with ease.
What marines do have going for them is the great new heavy armour, which is great if you survive long enough to afford it, let alone kit every member of your team out, only to have 1 redemption onos rush your base, devour a HA, redemp with 100% succsess rate, no matter that 5 HMG's and a Grenade launcher are firing at it.
Really i would have expected more from the long wait we endured during the testing process.
NS 2.0 needed changes, and the aliens were finnally brought up to how they should be, but you made them to strong and marines are to weak. dont give me any of this crap about 'you only played it for 4 days how can you know blah blah'
its blatently obvious.
Now i hope flayra and his Dev team sorts this out, so we can finnally have some fair games in NS, rather than having to hope your opponent makes a mistake on aliens to win.
Skulks are far to strong at the beggining, you can see the great teamwork which was encouraged being wiped out by 2 skulks with celerity/silence or carapace. This basically allows any compotent alien team to dominate the map and the rts before the marines get upgrades, either the rines choose to do a very risky quick upgrade strat (in which case any good alien side will destroy the base) or be forced to spend res on turrets (quite hard to do considering you can probably hold 2 RT's at the very most with your vannilla marines), assuming the aliens arnt lieing down and letting you win of course.
on the other hand you could try to relocate to a hive, then phase link the second, that would seem one of the stronger tactics, but good aliens would own your relocate with ease.
What marines do have going for them is the great new heavy armour, which is great if you survive long enough to afford it, let alone kit every member of your team out, only to have 1 redemption onos rush your base, devour a HA, redemp with 100% succsess rate, no matter that 5 HMG's and a Grenade launcher are firing at it.
Really i would have expected more from the long wait we endured during the testing process.
NS 2.0 needed changes, and the aliens were finnally brought up to how they should be, but you made them to strong and marines are to weak. dont give me any of this crap about 'you only played it for 4 days how can you know blah blah'
its blatently obvious.
Now i hope flayra and his Dev team sorts this out, so we can finnally have some fair games in NS, rather than having to hope your opponent makes a mistake on aliens to win.
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
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this is after playing 5 clan matches, not publics with random newbies. and yes i can see it after 4 days, its right there in front of you.
as for the threat to close this, well im sorry if flayra cant take some constructive critisim, maybe he should listen to it more than the guys who are like zombies saying "yes master we love 2.0".
In addtion, the aliens aren't supposed to be the ones who are teamwork centric, it's the marines. So, if you want to mess up those "one or two skulks", simply move in a group of four or more. One or two skulks won't stand a chance aginst that. If you are still having problems with rouge skulks, upgrade some weapon and armor upgrades - level 1 of each will go a long way in protecting you from the skulk's jaws.
To review the str of a skulk versus 1.04:
Before carapace, skulks are faster and can take more bullets then they could in 1.04. This means the unupgraded skulk is still weaker then the 1.04 carapace skulk, or the 2.0 carapace skulk for that matter.
After carapace, skulks have less health then their 1.04 counterparts, and the slowing effect of carapace makes them equally fast, if not less fast. While the carapace provides some protection aginst bullets, you'll find a un-carapace skulk versus level 0 weapons and a carapaced skulk versus level 3 will survive just about as long.
Concerning celerity, if you can't hit the skulks efficently, upgrade weapons so that you don't have to hit the skulks as often to kill them. If movement chambers are their first hive, they don't have carapace, which leaves them highly vulnurable to increased damage from weapons upgrades.
youre still playing as if it were 1.04
dont relocate to a hive, no one cares if you have a hive.
turret farming RT's is the way to win, prevent them from getting more than one onos ever and youll win.
Skulks are far too strong in the beginning and the alien starting res is insane.
In a clan match you're looking at 3 chambers/3rts within the opening 30 seconds of a match, that's absolutely crazy since marines can no way keep up.
I watched on HLTV last night Exigent vs HAM, two very good us clans and the result was the same as every other scrim I've seen with two good clans, 2-2
Marines cannot keep up with early skulks, especially with upgrades.
A lot of top players I've spoken to feel very similar and comments such as "bring on 2.01" are happening already.
In the end, HAM and Exigent got bored and said they didnt find it even fun anymore so stopped scrimming.
Also to the people saying use teamwork, try playing a top level pcw, team work does absolutely nothing when you cant tech as fast as aliens can progess.
3 carapaced skulks with celerity could quite easily wipe any 4-6 marines on the planet.
After so much PTing, to discover exploits such as eating electric nodes without taking damage and a major balancing issue I'm very dissapointed.
im talking about 2 clans, who are well organised and extreamly skilled, playing each other. the aliens will always win, just like the marines did in 1.4 with their jetpack hmg, there are no rambos, there is plenty of teamwork, the fact is aliens are just better than the marines now.
On even a clan game, a turret factory at base is usually a good investment, and electrified nodes keep the skulks at bay.
And playing with my clan? Haha, my GOD marines dominated. Sure, that damn redemption onos ate a few of our heavies, but it didn't matter. The reduction in gun prices allowed that teammate to spawn back in and go back on the rampage in less than a minute.
In my opinion, things are MUCH closer to being balanced, with marines still being slightly more powerful. If you are having trouble winning, try the resource denial game. If your marines are getting owned by skulks, I don't know how to help you much... I haven't had much trouble with the increase to skulk life. If skulks are truely being a menace, try handing out a shotgun per squad. Sure, 1 marine can no longer kill 3 skulks in a long hallway, but marine tactics need to replace bunny-hopping and 2 man teams if marines expect to win now.
Edit: I see this is concerning clan play. This mod is meant to apease public play first, with balances to clan play to come later. Flayra didn't write this mod so that a few dozen clans would be ecstatic, and all public players would hate the game.
I really suggest you play some ns 2.0 scrims. Early in the game you CANNOT hold out to fastly upgraded skulks. Even if you manage a turret farm, because aliens progress so fast they'll have a 2nd hive and an easy bile bomb clearance.
Clanplay is no guarantee for a balanced match. One of the clans might suck, or one of 'em might rule supreme. A decent marine team still won't beat an über alien team, teamwork or not.
In the end, I think you're just gonna get the "crap" about 'you only played it for 4 days how can you know blah blah', because, well, that's it. No musician, no matter the talent, was born with the ability to rock the world, he still had to practice hard. Same goes for almost everything else, including games. With the exception of vets (skilled clanplayers) and pts (slightly above average pub players in general), we are all 2.0 nubbins. And I can't stand n00bs complaining that a game is unbalanced. Please, if you can still say this in a month's time, I'll listen to you.
Indeed, in public play, I'm already seeing the balance swing a little away from the current alien domination, and that's after four days. I just hope it won't be at the other end of the scale in a month.
what the **** does run of the mill mean ?
Vets and some PT's are saying this now after seeing it played by more people.
Time will not make a difference, look at the PROGRESS structure, it's TOO fast for aliens
Marines cannot keep up
Public play is completely different to clan play since you have random skill levels and usually not much organisation.
I'm tellin you that after playing about 20 ns 2.0 scrims that its impossible for a marine team to win without one major mess up by an alien team.
Aliens are INDIVIDUALLY more powerful than marines.
If the marines were to work together and move as a team, you might get somewhere.
Comparing a few games I played yesterday as marine:
Situation: Marines treat it like 1.04 and all move out in separate directions.
End result: Marines walk into alien ambushes and die. GG. Marines lose.
Situation: Marines move in groups of at least 3 or 4 at all times. Systematically take resource nodes and defend them.
End result: Marines systematically take territory. Hold resource nodes long enough to tech to HA.
Much carnage on the alien side. GG. Marines win.
go play the game more.
and as a side note READ THE FAQ.
flay SPECIFICALLY says not to say anything about balance, there will be no quick balance patches. Play the game.
so what have u been doing for the past 4 months??
ive been reading the betatest forums, looking at all the lovely new things coming in, reading all the posts about how "fair and balanced" the new version is, what did you do for those 4 months? i remember even seeing stickys with matches arranged, why was none of this noticed?
Note to self: Really impressed about people playing 20 scrims in four days. That's an average of five per day. Whoa.
I just had a great few hours on an australian server with some good alien and marine wins. Are australians simply smarter? I don't know, but it's become my new favourite server even though it's on the other side of the world.
You don't have the right to complain about balance for at least 4 months anyway.
and people please read the bloody post, so many people replying saying teamwork and rambos, dont give a crap about that, this is a discussion about balance between 2 teams of compotent players, not idiots u get in publics.
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