Here's a more printer-friendly overview map. I didn't spend much time locating the vents (to lazy to open the map in Half-Life) or visually polishing it, but it should get you from A to B.
This is the first custom ns map i've dled. we are having a poll as to whether to include custom maps over at <a href='http://www.pagn.net' target='_blank'>paGn</a>. Apart from having the poll, i've included a dozen SS of parts of lost in the poll <a href='http://forums.pacific.net.sg/showthread.php?s=&threadid=30144' target='_blank'>HERE</a>. I think they turned out quite OK, with jpeg compression and all.
I dont really have much to add on, since many of the map issues are touched on in the previous pages. But yes, i agree the map lacks ambience.
and oh yeah, i read the hive lift(the one that needed welding) not showing up was fixed? seems like i only see it when it lands at the bottom. i <i>hear</i> it moving up, but cant see it.
That overhead looks pretty cool, Wolv. The only thing that's a little off is the corridor just outside of Alpha Continuum hive. The area above has an area outside the window that extends over the hallway below.
And I realize that the elevator still dissappears. This can be fixed later, but its only a minor bug that won't terribly effect the gameplay.
Just played this map for... 4 hours straight. There were three servers on the All Seeing Eye that had this in rotation, and every time one server stopped playing it, another would be playing it again. This map rocks.
One of the servers I played this on didn't actually have it in rotation, but in fact turned it on in order to boot off a bunch of people who were playing on the server so the clan could get on. Heh. At any rate, that server was not fond of the map. More than half the players there hated it. These were their complaints (and my thoughts on said complaints)
1: It's too big. There's too much distance between hives.
My Responce: Better than having too little space between hives, making a double seige possible. I say "Good Job on making sure you can't double seige! Awsome!"
2: The elevator to equilibrium doesn't work.
My Responce: Apparently, that's a weldable point, so my guess is that the elevator will work once it's welded. It was confusing though, because except as a skulk, I couldn't seem to get into that hive. Looking at the layout, apparently there IS another way in, but I couldn't find it, personally, in the game. That'll just take some more play time though, to learn my way around.
Oh, and that brings me to complaint number...
3: I have no idea how to get anywhere.
My Responce: You pathetic fools. Were you born with the knowledge of how to get around bast? Hera? Caged? Don't tell me that Nothing didn't give you the run around a few times either. Even Nancy, the smallest map, wasn't perfectly clear the first time you played it. And when EVERYONE doesn't know their way around, it's all even. And there's the excitement of exploration! Of course, when 1.1 comes out and this is an official map, I will have a tactical advantage over all the other people playing it for the first time... mwahahahaha!
4: This map sucks.
My Responce: You played it for five minutes and you say it sucks?
5: It's like eclipse. (Implication being that eclipse also sucks)
My Responce: What the heck are you smoking? First of all, HOW is this like eclipse? It doesn't look like eclipse, it has more twisty turns than eclipse, the action is closer and more personal than eclipse, it doesn't even have a similar LAYOUT as eclipse!! Second of all, even if it WAS like eclipse, eclipse ROCKS! And so does this. So there's a similarity for you... both eclipse and lost rock.
I do have a few small concerns though....
Concern 1: Alpha Hive has only ONE marine entrance. This is rather unbalancing. In the games I played, it was unbalancing in my favor (aliens), but it was still unbalancing. That small corridor leading into the hive is INCREDIBLY easy to defend. A gorge can load OTs around the corner, of course, if marines try building there, a few skulk rushes will take it out EASILY, even if they have HAs and build turrets and phase gates and all kinds of nasty things. I know, because they did. In every game I played, in fact. The defenders of that hive can't lose, as far as I can tell. Now, imagine if the MARINES had that hive... I shudder to think how hard it would be to get it back.
As an alien, the other two hives were taken by the enemy in most of the games I played. In each game, it was hard, but we took them back, even though we only had one hive (Alpha). Marines in HA with HMGs would rush Alpha, and we'd kill them slowly, but surely... and then we'd rush Cargo, and rush it and rush it and after I died about 33 times (with only 5 meat kills, but several structure kills) we got cargo, and then getting the other hive was easy. This happened in TWO SEPERATE GAMES, one in which we started in another hive that got taken by marines, but we moved to alpha....
When HA HMGs and JP HMGs can't take your last hive away, you know there's a problem with balance. Or at least, I -think- that's a problem with balance.
Concern 2: The elevator to equlibrium has to be welded to work (I assume, since I've never seen it happen...) and that creates a situation similar to Alpha hive, but not as pronounced. This is a very mild concern. It's probably not a problem enough to warrant fixing it. If you add a ladder, what's the incentive to weld?
Concern 3: Or, less of a concern, more of a wish. I'd love a vent leading INTO the marine start... the marines in two games I played against them loaded something along the lines of 50 mines at both doors, making alien entry completely impossible until we had fades.... I always want a way into the marine base. Being blocked sucks. But then, this could just be a gameplay dynamic...
So anyway, despite these concerns, I had a HECK of a lot of fun playing today... and I'll be sure to play it more. Looking forewards to seeing it in 1.1, thus being on many many servers. Whee!
PhilipKNS2 texture artist (AKA "Blazeeer")Join Date: 2002-11-01Member: 3746Members, Retired Developer
Like it a lot. Original in many parts it seems <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> Great work.
Dude, I was an alien with you in one of those games Fierari. Crazy eh?
Anyway, my thoughts are basically that the marine start needs to be tossed back just a tiny bit. The distance from hive to hive is good, but it just felt like I could get into the marine base too quickly. The solution to the mine problem was fairly simple to me, one guy sacrifices himself, next guy gets a free ticket in.
I found the vent system to be both useful and easy to use, this is always good. Rooms allowed for a good amount of multilevel action, nodes were well placed, I definately enjoyed this map.
yes exelent map greedo <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> and a exelent job on teh wall-O-nubs
We've had this map in rotation on the OSS server for a while, played it there for a while. And well. Marines can't win on this map.
I still haven't figured out exactly why they can't, but its nothing to do with skill. Marines won once when aliens had no clue where any of the hives where, but once aliens figured things out, marines couldn't do anything to keep their resources alive. We tried mining, sparse turrets, nothing worked, eventually we would always have to fall back to equilibrium and get destroyed by fades.
I really hope this map doesn't get put into any official map pack, because even though I guess it looks good (even though it looks like ever other NS map, dark corridors hiding the shoddy HL engine and bare walls, remember darkness doesn't automatically = atmosphere).
So ya, even though I'm sure it was fun to play, wish more planning and play testing went into it, because right now it needs major changes for any marine team to win.
It's funny you should say that, because the games I've played have been pretty much exclusively marine victories, and have been working on making it a tad easier for the aliens to manage a victory. Though, I have also given the marines some new things to help them out.
At any rate, if this map does get into 1.1, the version you have now won't be the one coming with the download.
mmmm, this map is sweet <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
I loved the weldable elevator, such a neat concept <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> Hope this makes 1.1, and I've had no problem winning as marines or aliens.
So, Greedo... will alpha hive be given an extra marine/onos usable entrance/exitway? I know there are two vents, but those are weldable and don't really cut it. I've played a few more games, and if the marines get alpha hive, it's REALLY REALLY REALLY hard to get it back, as I predicted. That one hallway is just far too easily defendable. Mabye widening it would work too...
I've already added a second marine accessible enterance into Alpha hive, but it's a weldable enterance, so it won't be of use to aliens unless the marines open it. Also, only one of the vents into Alpha is weldable as it is, so I'm a bit confused on that part. And btw, the hive room got a makeover, as it was pretty much the ugliest room in the map.
I can't say for certain whether the map will be in 1.1 or not, but it being used to show off the new HLTV integration and the new commander interface are hopefully some pretty good signs.
Other changes since the release include: - approximately 25% brighter (not much, but it helps some, only it may not be enough) - slightly modified marine spawn - access to upper deck in Equilibrium hive for all players now possible - vent system in and around cargo hive added - larger readyroom to accomodate the 16 extra spawn points I forgot to include - some new sounds - various tweaks to further reduce the entity count from its already low level.
Pretty good map. But i don't get why you fellow mappers give areas such weird names! hehe <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
If this makes it into the official maps, it'll be the first time I've ever removed an official map from rotation, one of the hives is WAY to close to the marine start.
EH I found the RR secret <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I installed ns_lost from mayberrygames.com, since the link in the first post doesn't function on my server, but not enough people have the map to play it, so it's not in rotation on 128.119.166.3
Make sure to check out my pretty faec in the hall of nubs, I'm the one with the incredibly huge glasses. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Pfft, Nubford is god among all other nubs.
Comments
I didn't spend much time locating the vents (to lazy to open the map in Half-Life) or visually polishing it, but it should get you from A to B.
I dont really have much to add on, since many of the map issues are touched on in the previous pages. But yes, i agree the map lacks ambience.
and oh yeah, i read the hive lift(the one that needed welding) not showing up was fixed? seems like i only see it when it lands at the bottom. i <i>hear</i> it moving up, but cant see it.
right so tahts it...not much isnt it?
And I realize that the elevator still dissappears. This can be fixed later, but its only a minor bug that won't terribly effect the gameplay.
One of the servers I played this on didn't actually have it in rotation, but in fact turned it on in order to boot off a bunch of people who were playing on the server so the clan could get on. Heh. At any rate, that server was not fond of the map. More than half the players there hated it. These were their complaints (and my thoughts on said complaints)
1: It's too big. There's too much distance between hives.
My Responce: Better than having too little space between hives, making a double seige possible. I say "Good Job on making sure you can't double seige! Awsome!"
2: The elevator to equilibrium doesn't work.
My Responce: Apparently, that's a weldable point, so my guess is that the elevator will work once it's welded. It was confusing though, because except as a skulk, I couldn't seem to get into that hive. Looking at the layout, apparently there IS another way in, but I couldn't find it, personally, in the game. That'll just take some more play time though, to learn my way around.
Oh, and that brings me to complaint number...
3: I have no idea how to get anywhere.
My Responce: You pathetic fools. Were you born with the knowledge of how to get around bast? Hera? Caged? Don't tell me that Nothing didn't give you the run around a few times either. Even Nancy, the smallest map, wasn't perfectly clear the first time you played it. And when EVERYONE doesn't know their way around, it's all even. And there's the excitement of exploration! Of course, when 1.1 comes out and this is an official map, I will have a tactical advantage over all the other people playing it for the first time... mwahahahaha!
4: This map sucks.
My Responce: You played it for five minutes and you say it sucks?
5: It's like eclipse. (Implication being that eclipse also sucks)
My Responce: What the heck are you smoking? First of all, HOW is this like eclipse? It doesn't look like eclipse, it has more twisty turns than eclipse, the action is closer and more personal than eclipse, it doesn't even have a similar LAYOUT as eclipse!! Second of all, even if it WAS like eclipse, eclipse ROCKS! And so does this. So there's a similarity for you... both eclipse and lost rock.
I do have a few small concerns though....
Concern 1: Alpha Hive has only ONE marine entrance. This is rather unbalancing. In the games I played, it was unbalancing in my favor (aliens), but it was still unbalancing. That small corridor leading into the hive is INCREDIBLY easy to defend. A gorge can load OTs around the corner, of course, if marines try building there, a few skulk rushes will take it out EASILY, even if they have HAs and build turrets and phase gates and all kinds of nasty things. I know, because they did. In every game I played, in fact. The defenders of that hive can't lose, as far as I can tell. Now, imagine if the MARINES had that hive... I shudder to think how hard it would be to get it back.
As an alien, the other two hives were taken by the enemy in most of the games I played. In each game, it was hard, but we took them back, even though we only had one hive (Alpha). Marines in HA with HMGs would rush Alpha, and we'd kill them slowly, but surely... and then we'd rush Cargo, and rush it and rush it and after I died about 33 times (with only 5 meat kills, but several structure kills) we got cargo, and then getting the other hive was easy. This happened in TWO SEPERATE GAMES, one in which we started in another hive that got taken by marines, but we moved to alpha....
When HA HMGs and JP HMGs can't take your last hive away, you know there's a problem with balance. Or at least, I -think- that's a problem with balance.
Concern 2: The elevator to equlibrium has to be welded to work (I assume, since I've never seen it happen...) and that creates a situation similar to Alpha hive, but not as pronounced. This is a very mild concern. It's probably not a problem enough to warrant fixing it. If you add a ladder, what's the incentive to weld?
Concern 3: Or, less of a concern, more of a wish. I'd love a vent leading INTO the marine start... the marines in two games I played against them loaded something along the lines of 50 mines at both doors, making alien entry completely impossible until we had fades.... I always want a way into the marine base. Being blocked sucks. But then, this could just be a gameplay dynamic...
So anyway, despite these concerns, I had a HECK of a lot of fun playing today... and I'll be sure to play it more. Looking forewards to seeing it in 1.1, thus being on many many servers. Whee!
Original in many parts it seems <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Great work.
Anyway, my thoughts are basically that the marine start needs to be tossed back just a tiny bit. The distance from hive to hive is good, but it just felt like I could get into the marine base too quickly. The solution to the mine problem was fairly simple to me, one guy sacrifices himself, next guy gets a free ticket in.
I found the vent system to be both useful and easy to use, this is always good. Rooms allowed for a good amount of multilevel action, nodes were well placed, I definately enjoyed this map.
and a exelent job on teh wall-O-nubs
I still haven't figured out exactly why they can't, but its nothing to do with skill. Marines won once when aliens had no clue where any of the hives where, but once aliens figured things out, marines couldn't do anything to keep their resources alive. We tried mining, sparse turrets, nothing worked, eventually we would always have to fall back to equilibrium and get destroyed by fades.
I really hope this map doesn't get put into any official map pack, because even though I guess it looks good (even though it looks like ever other NS map, dark corridors hiding the shoddy HL engine and bare walls, remember darkness doesn't automatically = atmosphere).
So ya, even though I'm sure it was fun to play, wish more planning and play testing went into it, because right now it needs major changes for any marine team to win.
-M
At any rate, if this map does get into 1.1, the version you have now won't be the one coming with the download.
I loved the weldable elevator, such a neat concept <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> Hope this makes 1.1, and I've had no problem winning as marines or aliens.
I'm going to bank on it being in 1.1 so I have a good version that works all over and has all the right fixes. I shant d/l it until I know for sure.
I can't say for certain whether the map will be in 1.1 or not, but it being used to show off the new HLTV integration and the new commander interface are hopefully some pretty good signs.
Other changes since the release include:
- approximately 25% brighter (not much, but it helps some, only it may not be enough)
- slightly modified marine spawn
- access to upper deck in Equilibrium hive for all players now possible
- vent system in and around cargo hive added
- larger readyroom to accomodate the 16 extra spawn points I forgot to include
- some new sounds
- various tweaks to further reduce the entity count from its already low level.
But i don't get why you fellow mappers give areas such weird names! hehe <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
and why not?
so if we say somthing that has already been posted we need to search,
if we try and post in it we get the above statment!
If you didn't find your answers in any of the threads, you make a new thread.
Make sure to check out my pretty faec in the hall of nubs, I'm the one with the incredibly huge glasses.
Make sure to check out my pretty faec in the hall of nubs, I'm the one with the incredibly huge glasses. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Pfft, Nubford is god among all other nubs.