IronHorseDeveloper, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributorJoin Date: 2010-05-08Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
Hayamo res for marines would definitely make AE 35 less of an issue for starting hive.
I will say that when comparing that original layout to the NS2 one, I am noticing a lot more alien friendly hallways. Compare the areas outside of Hamasaki.
I realize that greybox maps typically give an advantage to marines.. but I just wanted to point out that this may not be the case currently and that the broad strokes of rooms and hallways need to be more marine friendly than they are currently, with future geo improvements assisting alien usage. Otherwise, it just continues to be more alien friendly as development goes on.
ZavaroTucson, ArizonaJoin Date: 2005-02-14Member: 41174Members, Super Administrators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
edited May 2016
Yeah. Everything is being redesigned from the ground up. Besides Eastern, which is basically set in stone. Nearly all the hallways have been roomified at this point, and the hallways that remain have been significantly reworked to fit more NS2-friendly measurements.
Currently, though, I've got writer's block on how to redesign Routing (a huge undertaking) Support and AE-35 for gameplay, while translating AE-35's visual distinctiveness into NS2. Hopefully it will be ready for Sunday, though I'm unsure if Reactor can be completed by then.
You'll all also be happy that I managed to shrink everything into a much more tight fit. It's comparable to Summit in terms of size, whereas before it was a bit bigger and the paths required you to extend far out into your cardinal directions.
LokiJoin Date: 2012-07-07Member: 153973Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
edited May 2016
@DrunkenMonkey yes we are but I would prefer to see it as a re-imagining, using both the ns1 and nsl version and well my own ideas
This is the direction Starchild is going, though ive renamed it reactor for now
New update to the map its a halfway house of where we want it to be. Still a lot more work to go in to remaking the rooms etc but an udpate is better than nothing for weeks on end!
pSyk0mAnNerdish by NatureGermanyJoin Date: 2003-08-07Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
edited May 2016
Overall great changes.
I like that you widened and kinda split the entrance to Ae35 from support. Should make for better fights.
The changes to the MS-Reactor-Power-Access area look great too and the way you shifted Pressure Control area on the map.
The big problem tho is Coldturn Monitoring Hamasaki after moving the Pressure Control area.
You basicly turned Coldturn into a 2hive siege spot with res node. The distance between Coldturn and Hamasaki is way too short.
Aliens starting in AE35 are doomed this way.
I propose the following change:
Move the marked map parts to the right.
Coldturn needs to connect closer to Pipeline.
If you dont like the new long corridor at Section Zero / Central Junction you can also close that gap by increasing Central Junction room a bit and making the Section Zero corridor before the S-Curve longer too.
I think this change is helpful anyway, regardless of Coldturn, because you dont want another docking situation, where Marines swarm the middle of the map easily and can quickly pressure alien res towers (Coldturn, Eastern). With the additional distance this problem is decreased.
Maybe you'll need a vent from AE35 or SouthEast to Eastern to improve Eastern defense for Aliens starting in AE.
And come on people, where is the outrage about missing Gorges Hideout
LokiJoin Date: 2012-07-07Member: 153973Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
edited August 2016
A new update to ayumi has been published (yeah its taken a while...)
Routing is now more of a room
New vent routes
Map has been shrunk to "conventional map sizes" yet attempting to keep or increase certain run times across / around the map.
Adjusted many of the RTs to adjust for the timings
New RT in Routing
Map layout
personally i think either monitoring has to go or the link between section zero and eastern entrance
Not a bad idea!
Removing monitoring would make the north even more isolated, but removing that connection seems like a good idea. Maybe make it connect to south east instead. (Otherwise you're giving aliens a free RT.)
KasharicHull, EnglandJoin Date: 2013-03-27Member: 184473Members, Forum Admins, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
edited September 2016
IMO, the issue isn't that you can get from section zero to monitoring or eastern entrance in X amount of time, its the fact that you can get to BOTH from that one room.
I've come up with a potential solution that would add importance to the upper walkway in routing and it would also increase rotation time from marine start to eastern entrance, which is pretty damn fast at the moment.
Red line - the lower floor of routine
Green line - the walkway/bridge in routing
ZavaroTucson, ArizonaJoin Date: 2005-02-14Member: 41174Members, Super Administrators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
Map has been playing a lot better, which is good.
Need the curved halls in reactor to have slightly higher ceilings (150%), and Hamasaki pathways to have been widened a bit on the sides. Still not totally sure about Glass Hallway or AE-35 (considering I'm an idiot and designed those areas). Glass Hallway might need to be restructured such that the RT is in the middle of the room (instead of the side) with some LOS blocks on the Marine side. AE-35 needs to not be a one entrance Hive room, needing some serious restructuring.
I think we can agree that yesterday, the map felt like a map that is balanced but was played by imbalanced teams, but we should test more to be sure.
One thing that bugged me as alien was Eastern entrance. Specifically, how it connects to hamasaki. To enter, you either pick the shooting gallery (corridor), or the vent, both of which are easily covered by marine. And experience shows that you will usually have multiple marines in there. I suggest adding some cover to the corridor, and or expanding the vent to have multpile exits.
LokiJoin Date: 2012-07-07Member: 153973Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
Updated the map today
Changelog (also includes the previous week, forgot to post)
Ayumis RR has had a brushwork make over (No catbus as of yet)
The north of the map has been shifted to the right, should mean it takes marines slightly longer to get to pipeline now, where as cold turn and aforementioned pipeline is now closer to hamasaki
A new vent has been added from hamasaki to cold turn (if it proves to OP or a dumb move it will be altered or removed)
From feedback gathered so far I have begun reworking the basic textures and lighting on the map. So far I have only managed to get oxygen and glass hallway done. (these do not represent the final visual theme of the map).
Improved occlusion geo in reactor, oxygen, glass hallway and power access III
Comments
Good to hear, hopefully you can keep the night atmosphere and lighting as close as you can to the original as well.
I will say that when comparing that original layout to the NS2 one, I am noticing a lot more alien friendly hallways. Compare the areas outside of Hamasaki.
I realize that greybox maps typically give an advantage to marines.. but I just wanted to point out that this may not be the case currently and that the broad strokes of rooms and hallways need to be more marine friendly than they are currently, with future geo improvements assisting alien usage. Otherwise, it just continues to be more alien friendly as development goes on.
Currently, though, I've got writer's block on how to redesign Routing (a huge undertaking) Support and AE-35 for gameplay, while translating AE-35's visual distinctiveness into NS2. Hopefully it will be ready for Sunday, though I'm unsure if Reactor can be completed by then.
You'll all also be happy that I managed to shrink everything into a much more tight fit. It's comparable to Summit in terms of size, whereas before it was a bit bigger and the paths required you to extend far out into your cardinal directions.
edit: /ns1-ayumi creator
This is the direction Starchild is going, though ive renamed it reactor for now
New update to the map its a halfway house of where we want it to be. Still a lot more work to go in to remaking the rooms etc but an udpate is better than nothing for weeks on end!
Current layout
I like that you widened and kinda split the entrance to Ae35 from support. Should make for better fights.
The changes to the MS-Reactor-Power-Access area look great too and the way you shifted Pressure Control area on the map.
The big problem tho is Coldturn Monitoring Hamasaki after moving the Pressure Control area.
You basicly turned Coldturn into a 2hive siege spot with res node. The distance between Coldturn and Hamasaki is way too short.
Aliens starting in AE35 are doomed this way.
I propose the following change:
Move the marked map parts to the right.
Coldturn needs to connect closer to Pipeline.
If you dont like the new long corridor at Section Zero / Central Junction you can also close that gap by increasing Central Junction room a bit and making the Section Zero corridor before the S-Curve longer too.
I think this change is helpful anyway, regardless of Coldturn, because you dont want another docking situation, where Marines swarm the middle of the map easily and can quickly pressure alien res towers (Coldturn, Eastern). With the additional distance this problem is decreased.
Maybe you'll need a vent from AE35 or SouthEast to Eastern to improve Eastern defense for Aliens starting in AE.
And come on people, where is the outrage about missing Gorges Hideout
Routing is now more of a room
New vent routes
Map has been shrunk to "conventional map sizes" yet attempting to keep or increase certain run times across / around the map.
Adjusted many of the RTs to adjust for the timings
New RT in Routing
Map layout
Not a bad idea!
Removing monitoring would make the north even more isolated, but removing that connection seems like a good idea. Maybe make it connect to south east instead. (Otherwise you're giving aliens a free RT.)
I've come up with a potential solution that would add importance to the upper walkway in routing and it would also increase rotation time from marine start to eastern entrance, which is pretty damn fast at the moment.
Red line - the lower floor of routine
Green line - the walkway/bridge in routing
Incorporates @Kasharic idea from the image above (however the room is still one)
RT in section zero is now gone
Vent from NW Turn to Reactor is now gone
Need the curved halls in reactor to have slightly higher ceilings (150%), and Hamasaki pathways to have been widened a bit on the sides. Still not totally sure about Glass Hallway or AE-35 (considering I'm an idiot and designed those areas). Glass Hallway might need to be restructured such that the RT is in the middle of the room (instead of the side) with some LOS blocks on the Marine side. AE-35 needs to not be a one entrance Hive room, needing some serious restructuring.
One thing that bugged me as alien was Eastern entrance. Specifically, how it connects to hamasaki. To enter, you either pick the shooting gallery (corridor), or the vent, both of which are easily covered by marine. And experience shows that you will usually have multiple marines in there. I suggest adding some cover to the corridor, and or expanding the vent to have multpile exits.
Changelog (also includes the previous week, forgot to post)
Ayumis RR has had a brushwork make over (No catbus as of yet)
The north of the map has been shifted to the right, should mean it takes marines slightly longer to get to pipeline now, where as cold turn and aforementioned pipeline is now closer to hamasaki
A new vent has been added from hamasaki to cold turn (if it proves to OP or a dumb move it will be altered or removed)
From feedback gathered so far I have begun reworking the basic textures and lighting on the map. So far I have only managed to get oxygen and glass hallway done. (these do not represent the final visual theme of the map).
Improved occlusion geo in reactor, oxygen, glass hallway and power access III
Minimap as of 02/10/16
Client : 1006.210632 : You(Marine-2296) are in "Eastern Entrance", position -45.960938, -8.617188, -45.773438.
Cool map though.