Replace stab with charge swipe
TriggerHappyBro
Ohio Join Date: 2016-05-23 Member: 217383Members, NS2 Playtester
Ohio Join Date: 2016-05-23 Member: 217383Members, NS2 Playtester
Stab doesn't get used hardly ever due to its un-cancel-ableness (in conjunction with it preventing blink) and its difficulty to land.
I see two benefits to this
1. Stab is easier to use in and of itself
2. You don't have to switch to it mid-fight
2 1/2. You don't run the risk of switching to metabolize by accident
Summary
Researching "stab" now replaces swipe with a chargeable variant like how advanced metabolize replaces metabolize once researched.
Scale the damage done by charge swipe proportionally to how long it is charged (after it's been researched, beforehand it should just swipe repeatedly)
0 charge = swipe damage
max charge = stab damage
Disallow blink while charging
Afterthought: It may be advantageous to leave charge swipe as a separate ability in case a player prefers to hold LMB to rapid fire normal swipes.
Whadda ya think?
Edit: There's this, too. https://feedback.userreport.com/19e981d4-394e-46de-997e-8913cc04aff2/#idea/124211
RevanCorana wrote: »I have an idea to make stab a bit easier to use.
Imagine you have to keep left click pressed down to "charge" the stab, the more you hold it the more damage it deals when released (with a damage cap).
It would be easier to use because the release timing can vary, but it would also keep its current mechanic because you would still not be able to blink while using it.
Also it probably wouldn't require an excessive amount of rework of the current animation.
TriggerHappyBro wrote: »@RevanCorana what happens if you just press and release? Would that do normal swipe damage?
If it does then I propose we scrap stab altogether and just have researching "stab" allow fade's to charge up swipe (but still not blink while charging).
RevanCorana wrote: »Sounds good, switching to stab in fight also makes it more difficult to use and isn't particularly fun.
I see two benefits to this
1. Stab is easier to use in and of itself
2. You don't have to switch to it mid-fight
2 1/2. You don't run the risk of switching to metabolize by accident
Summary
Researching "stab" now replaces swipe with a chargeable variant like how advanced metabolize replaces metabolize once researched.
Scale the damage done by charge swipe proportionally to how long it is charged (after it's been researched, beforehand it should just swipe repeatedly)
0 charge = swipe damage
max charge = stab damage
Disallow blink while charging
Afterthought: It may be advantageous to leave charge swipe as a separate ability in case a player prefers to hold LMB to rapid fire normal swipes.
Whadda ya think?
Edit: There's this, too. https://feedback.userreport.com/19e981d4-394e-46de-997e-8913cc04aff2/#idea/124211
Comments
Not being able to blink is 1 thing, not being to jump on top of that is too restrictive, the fade should be able to keep momentum at all times..
No, the ability doesn't just needs to be replaced completely.
I love arguing with this kind of person that does nothing but states an opinion. xD
I love how you can tell what kind of person I am from just one post.
But to elaborate, since you asked so nicely, stab is a slow ability that doesn't seem to fulfill any role whatsoever. Thus, it needs to be replaced completely.
Fade is the assassin lifeform, stab is supposed to be the ultimate assassin upgrade.
You can see it has in fact a very defined role within the class, maybe you just failed to see because it's not used very much because it is too hard to use properly.
Hence this thread.
I am not the best fade player. I spent the most time with the other lifeforms. But the fact that you are not able to blink AND jump makes me never using this ability. (And I also almost never see other people using this ability)
If you are playing against some good marines it becomes horrible for the fade. Two practiced w3 rifle marines (not to mention the fact what w3 shotgunners will do) can kill you as fast as you are charging for the stab (and while u are charging you are an easy target). Furthermore, unless u are using celerity, marines (even w/o jetpack) will be faster than you (when you are not able to blink or jump). That means a marine will be able to dodge easily when the marine detects you before you are start with the stab charge.
The only chance I have with stab is to try to attack marines from behind (silence) when the marine is standing still. But this will almost never happen.
I agree with RevanCorana. At least you have to be able to use jump while charging.
Perhaps I am too noobish with the fade to use this ability properly, so what do you (those who are good fade players) think about stab?
Why is this so hard?!
https://youtu.be/PtK6u0l9hFg?t=1m52s
Too many new players save for Onos because Fade feels "too hard" so they walk a lot and die a lot which causes onosplosion late game (not the definition of fun)
Chaining jumps doesn't make fade more fun to play.
Moreover I dont think it would reduce the skill ceiling.
I like stab =D. Just a very poorly presented ability (the worst one?) .
You can still medspam, it is just not as pronounced.
You can't because it takes too long to heal now.
@RedSword I couldnt agree more, stab is borderline unusable to most people because of how unpractical and unintuitive it is to use, plus being a biomass 7 upgrade, at the time you get a 3rd hive you automatically put all your res into biomass 9 to unlock Xenocide and Stomp instead.
Fix is: move Stab to biomass 6 and make Stab block either jumping or blinking but not both.
What a Fade in mid / late game could need is a mean for splitting groups of marines in order to fight them isolated. A slow moving energy ball, that deals damage over time and passes through all entities, like the Symmetra photon projector ball, as shown here, could work:
1:40
Compared to the Symmetra ball, I would make it a bit bigger, but a lot slower. The ball keeps moving in the same direction without drop.
You would cast it before the fight as an initialiser. Idially you would try to cast it between a group of marines so that the marines will move to different sides when trying to avoid it. The stab animation would work as the cast animation, so that you gather energy between your claws and then throw it. It wouldn't be spammable and it wouldn't be leathal, but you wouldn't want to stand in it for too long.
The old Vortex model could work as the projectile:
I think it would fit the Fade pretty well and it could actually be useful.
I think that kind of abilites should belong to lerks and it already does, when I understand you correctly spores pretty much fill that role already.
IT would give it a role and a really good one, if a fade gets behind an exo and stabs it the hud on it should go black and movement should lock up, so you don't know your heat level, you can't flee and you don't know how much armor you have left.
Kind of, but spores are pretty much instant, don't deal not enough damage to actually make you want to dodge it and is spammable, which makes dodging pointless in many situations. Late game Lerks are usually better off using umbra anyway. That Vortex ball would float slow enough to fight around it.
Since lerks late game are a bit squishy I try to do support where I am needed. Typically where the strongest onos is.
I will umbra the onos/aliens as they lay some spores down while the marines are distracted, then umbra as the aliens escape/stay, then spore the escape path so marines won't follow.