A question to the devs concerning inventory and storage space

zetachron · April 2016

If I look at my big inventory space (6x8=48 units) and compare it with construct spaces like

the big glass locker (6x8=48)<img width="160" height="100" src="http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/subnautica/images/2/29/Locker_Concept.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/320?cb=20150517232615"</img>
the small wall locker (5x6=30)<img width="160" height="100" src="http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/subnautica/images/6/6b/Lockermodel2.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/320?cb=20150619080623"</img>
the tiny seamoth storage locker (4x4=16)<img width="160" height="100" src="http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/subnautica/images/a/ac/SeamothStorage_01.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/320?cb=20150826210314"</img>
the tiny waterproof storage (4x4=16)<iframe width="160" height="120" src="https://sketchfab.com/models/ac953af0476540f89c626a078b2df210/embed" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen mozallowfullscreen="true" webkitallowfullscreen="true" onmousewheel=""></iframe>
the tiniest cyclops locker (2x6=12)<img width="160" height="100" src="http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/subnautica/images/2/2d/Cyclops_(19).jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/320?cb=20150513051355"</img>

I ask myself why every crafted locker in the game (except the big glass case) is so tiny compared to the player's inventory. Especially the cyclops lockers are so small, all 5 of them match 2 wall lockers or only a bit more than the player's inventory alltogether.

So I came to the conclusion, that if it's not the job of you to tease the player with PDA inventory transfer hazzles, it might be a sign that you plan to cut down the player's inventory size to match it with the reality of existing containers. Maybe down to 6x5=30 units or even smaller. Then the player will be very glad to handle a small container, because the small container now looks much bigger compared to the new players inventory. Quite understandable.

Can you confirm it?

zetachron · April 2016

P.S.: Can you also give glass lockers labels? They are the containers I use most and I'd like to label them other than putting labels at the wall above the containers.

EDIT:
Meanwhile I found a solution for the tiny lockers:
<img with="320" height="180" src="http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/272841093796344874/5798E634FDA4FCF517F7A74D5F210E1EB4C8835C/"></img>
That's 4x48=192 units of storage against 5x12=60. A remarkable difference, isn't it?

Also, is it possible that future cyclops upgrades will include a locker extension like the seamoth cargo upgrades? And if so, will the locker space get bigger or just more tiny lockers?

Or maybe the best solution would be using the builder to replace the cyclops lockers with superspace lockers that cost a lot to built and being more end game tech. Then those glass solution would no longer be necessary. It's practical and does even look good, but feels out of place.

(using the builder to replace a builtin section, example reinforcement)
320?cb=20150714220833

So the builder could be used to upgrade existing base or cyclops structures?

Bobythebee · April 2016

Seeing it in term of numbers now I agree the player's inventory is way too big, it seems to come the time of some rebalancing according to the new airtank slot

Rainstorm · April 2016

if they reduce the player's inventory, coupled to most stuff ingame being increased in inventory space size (Creepvine seed cluster now being 2x2 comes to mind immediately) im just imagining at game start the time it'll take me to make a knife, fins and my first powercells and my head starts to hurt with my nose bleeding as well.

Maybe its just me being spoiled with huge personnal inventory space that should'nt have since i started playing, but id cry tears of blood for sure!

Jacara · April 2016

In any game, the player carries far more than inventory storage. Can you imagine having to drop all your gear just to craft a few things? Like 4 Titanium ingots, or multiple lubricants. Either they will have to cut the recipe needs or leave the player inventory the way it is.

eastofdeath · April 2016

I was excited to see the work done making the Cyclops lockers work, and disappointed in the size of only 12 slots.

I hope the 12 be increased to at least 24 or 30 to match the small wall locker.

Looks like the open wall will be a wall of glass lockers as always.

zetachron · April 2016

eastofdeath wrote: »

I was excited to see the work done making the Cyclops lockers work, and disappointed in the size of only 12 slots.
I hope the 12 be increased to at least 24 or 30 to match the small wall locker.

Looks like the open wall will be a wall of glass lockers as always.

You mean this:
<img with="320" height="180" src="http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/272841093796344874/5798E634FDA4FCF517F7A74D5F210E1EB4C8835C/"></img>
192 vs 60 - incredible

and they aren't even in the way.

MoodsWoods · April 2016

I personally feel that sizes of the different Lockers are Okay, so a little item Management is needed...I personally like that aspect

, but i can also understand when others dont.

I would rather love to see
x)... labels on the Glass lockers
x) ...that you can actually see the stuff thats inside the glass lockers - i mean, whats the purpose of transparent glass if you always see empty shelves, no matter whats in it!?
x) ...and i would really LOVE to see some kind of simple filling level indicator on ALL Lockers....lets say 2 glowing dots for full locker, one for less than half full and none for empty ones, so i dont have to open t to see if there is space left.
In case of the glass lockers, that could be realized with showing different amount of stuff on the different shelf compartments.

Sidchicken · April 2016

The cyclops lockers are tiny? That's very disappointing. If 2 x 6 is correct, that means we can't even store our larger tools (like the seaglide or the mobile vehicle bay) in the cyclops.

Wall locker size seems like it would have been both appropriate (since they are lockers on the wall) and also at least somewhat useful.

Space_Jesus · April 2016

zetachron wrote: »

Yes, incredible, isn't it?

I really recommend not being so sarcastic. This shouldn't be a fix it yourself problem, really. The Cyclops needs bigger locker space.

Bobythebee · April 2016

@Space_Jesus and you can have them with a builder and a few resources.

Space_Jesus · April 2016

Bobythebee wrote: »

@Space_Jesus and you can have them with a builder and a few resources.

You're missing my point. If UW is going to implement lockers for the Cyclops then it should be common sense to make them larger than Seamoth storage, waterproof storage, and small locker storage. 12 slots? That's ridiculously stupid.

Rainstorm · April 2016

Guys,

While i will admit that as in real life size always seems to matter most (

) , these lockers were clearly meant to be cloth management (our diving suits, fins, helmets/rebreather and the like). Of course, peoples are free to use this space any way they want but theyre like closets by the entrance doors of any house, as in when u get in you put the excess clothes you dont need in there (or in this case u switch between what u wanna wear for a precise situation) and you pick it back up before leaving.

The reason theres several lockers is because in these types of submarines theres typically several crewmembers so theres one for everyone. There is plenty of rooms anywhere else in the Cyclops to stack TONS of floor/wall lockers.

I understand the dissapointment as most (me included ill admit) hoped for bigger space, but in fact it makes sense for them to be this small. Before when u opened them you could clearly see it was meant to be very small lockers.

Space_Jesus · April 2016

Rainstorm wrote: »

Guys,

While i will admit that as in real life size always seems to matter most ( ) , these lockers were clearly meant to be cloth management (our diving suits, fins, helmets/rebreather and the like). Of course, peoples are free to use this space any way they want but theyre like closets by the entrance doors of any house, as in when u get in you put the excess clothes you dont need in there (or in this case u switch between what u wanna wear for a precise situation) and you pick it back up before leaving.

The reason theres several lockers is because in these types of submarines theres typically several crewmembers so theres one for everyone. There is plenty of rooms anywhere else in the Cyclops to stack TONS of floor/wall lockers.

I understand the dissapointment as most (me included ill admit) hoped for bigger space, but in fact it makes sense for them to be this small. Before when u opened them you could clearly see it was meant to be very small lockers.

Twelve spaces per locker and there's only 5 in total; A single Cyclops--a MASSIVE vehicle with plenty of space--is capable of providing us with 60 storage slots..Come on. A pair of standard small lockers is 60 slots and the model of one of those is only marginally bigger than the ones that now come pre-built with the Cyclops. On the subject of crewmembers: there's no such thing at this point since we're the only survivor, and even if we did have crew the lockers are still too small. You can place three items that take up four spaces in one of these things. Does that not seem a bit too restrained?

Bobythebee · April 2016

The corridor where the lockers are is pretty narrow, in terms of proportion that makes sense

Now i'll don't have to put lockers near the hatch for my equipment (approximately 30 stacks)

Sidchicken · April 2016

Bobythebee wrote: »

The corridor where the lockers are is pretty narrow, in terms of proportion that makes sense

Now i'll don't have to put lockers near the hatch for my equipment (approximately 30 stacks)

Unless your equipment includes a seaglide, which won't fit.

Personally I routinely line both sides of that corridor with large lockers (8-10 in total) and will probably continue to do so.

zetachron · April 2016

I think it's quite possible that there is a plan to give the Cyclops a lockerspace upgrade module like the Seamoth, so we could get more space by sacrificing upgrade slots. But how will the upgraded space be implemented? More tiny lockers - or - the tiny lockers getting more spacey?

EDIT:

Or maybe the best solution would be using the builder to replace (like reinforcements replacing standart walls) the cyclops lockers with superspace lockers that cost a lot to built and being more end game tech. Then those glass solution would no longer be necessary. It's practical and does even look good, but feels out of place.

(using the builder to replace a builtin section, example reinforcement)
320?cb=20150714220833

So the builder could be used to upgrade existing base or cyclops structures?

Bobythebee · April 2016

@Sidchicken When I talk about my equipment that include rescue knive, more airtanks and some pretty useless stuff

including the rad suit

Sidchicken · April 2016

@Bobythebee I'm just saying there are things you will have that will not physically fit in the lockers on the clops, and that's frustrating.

DefectiveDelfin · April 2016

I feel that yes,the cyclops lockers are supposed to be where you store your suits.It fits the Cyclops being a mobile base because you can store your suits like the Reinforced or Reclaim suit in the lockers and take it out whenever you want to without having to craft your own lockers or keep it in your inventory.It makes sense that the Generic equipment storage lockers would be located near the entry point of the Cyclops and the personal and other storage lockers would be upstairs,where you can build your own large lockers.

However,maybe you could get an upgrade that either Upgrades the lockers or places several large lockers in the area between the Seamoth docking port and the cabin.It could be a "Cyclops storage module" That adds several large lockers for you to keep all your resources and other items in.Or,the size could be upgraded by a little bit.Maybe make it 2x8?

Either way,i'm grateful for the extra lockers as i can keep my equipment in there.4 cyclops lockers can hold some of the tools or suits you don't need so even though it's small,it's still pretty useful.

zetachron · April 2016

I wrote this thread (a little too sarcastic) because of the discrepancy of inventory (48) vs some small container (12-16) space.

It just makes no sense to have a big practical inventory and then still fiddle around with small containers.

And it doesn't matter (from the reality viewpoint) if the tiny containers are more real (like real subs have really tiny lockers), when the player inventory already debunked reality (4 locker spaces in your pockets and able to carry 4x4 objects - not in your hands, but also in your pockets). Those small containers are simply not practical to handle if you have a big inventory. It would be different if player inventory was smaller (small locker size of 5x6=30). Than half of 30 means 15 and the smaller lockers look big again. But most players simply want an unbelievable practical inventory. So why now a superrealistic and impractical tiny locker space?

Or as I (proposed somewhere earlier) and @DefectiveDelfin suggested the locker spaces could get upgraded to larger versions. Unlike DefectiveDelfin I disagree about the usefulness of the cyclops lockers. I either need a smaller player inventory or cyclops lockers being wall lockers. Although I can understand the devs aiming to force the players to only store suits and small stuff inside them or avoid being the lockers misused as ore containers. But then I'd rather suggest to allow cyclops implemented big cargo space somewhere. I could accept tiny lockers, if they weren't the only ones aboard.

@DefectiveDelfin Why do you like an unrealistic and practical player inventory and at the same time favor a realistic and impractical locker size?

Resulting suggestion - better solutions:

upgrade locker spaces with your builder tool or with cyclops upgrade modules
keep the 5 tiny ones, but give the cyclops a real good cargo space to store stuff in a practical way
reduce inventory to 5x6=30, but allow to hold big things in your hand without needing inventory space (mobile platform)

DefectiveDelfin · April 2016

zetachron wrote: »

I wrote this thread (a little too sarcastic) because of the discrepancy of inventory (48) vs some small container (12-16) space.

It just makes no sense to have a big practical inventory and then still fiddle around with small containers.

And it doesn't matter (from the reality viewpoint) if the tiny containers are more real (like real subs have really tiny lockers), when the player inventory already debunked reality (4 locker spaces in your pockets and able to carry 4x4 objects - not in your hands, but also in your pockets). Those small containers are simply not practical to handle if you have a big inventory. It would be different if player inventory was smaller (small locker size of 5x6=30). Than half of 30 means 15 and the smaller lockers look big again. But most players simply want an unbelievable practical inventory. So why now a superrealistic and impractical tiny locker space?

Or as I (proposed somewhere earlier) and @DefectiveDelfin suggested the locker spaces could get upgraded to larger versions. Unlike DefectiveDelfin I disagree about the usefulness of the cyclops lockers. I either need a smaller player inventory or cyclops lockers being wall lockers. Although I can understand the devs aiming to force the players to only store suits and small stuff inside them or avoid being the lockers misused as ore containers. But then I'd rather suggest to allow cyclops implemented big cargo space somewhere. I could accept tiny lockers, if they weren't the only ones aboard.

@DefectiveDelfin Why do you like an unrealistic and practical player inventory and at the same time favor a realistic and impractical locker size?

Resulting suggestion - better solutions:
upgrade locker spaces with your builder tool or with cyclops upgrade modules

keep the 5 tiny ones, but give the cyclops a real good cargo space to store stuff in a practical way

reduce inventory to 5x6=30, but allow to hold big things in your hand without needing inventory space (mobile platform)

Well first off,it's a game.That has creatures that are evolutionarily impossible.That also has a machine that fabricates lead.From two batteries.It also allows you to go to extreme depths.Without getting crushed.

Why do you favour a realistic locker inventory when you don't favour realistic crafting,creatures,mechanics and sizes?Don't you see what's wrong?

Condescending questions aside,i could go on and on for hours about how this isn't realistic.The answer to both my questions and yours are "it's a game".

The thing is,you can build lockers in the cyclops.The small lockers are just meant for you to put your tools and suits into,and aren't meant to be the pre-installed mega lockers.Though i agree that the size needs to be improved,they are still meant to be just for small stuff.The bigger lockers you want are supposed to be built by you.Do you expect the cyclops to come equipped with Marble melons and hanging fruit too?.It's the reason the devs allow you to build in the cyclops,so you can customize it yourself.

The player's inventory is big because its a game.Right now,subnautica streams are just beginners running out of space,then dumping everything and repeating the cycle until they get a base.If you want realism,subnautica streams would be players having not enough space to progress in the game.It would ruin the game.

The tiny lockers can fit tools like Stasis rifles and Propulsion cannons.Tools that most people don't carry around.If the lockers allowed you to carry all these gear,you could be extremely well armed without having to waste inventory space.So thats the purpose of the tiny lockers.To fit your tools and equipment.

zetachron · April 2016

@DefectiveDelfin We both know it's a game. It's only a matter arguing about immersion/reality for a better feel (not really wanting reality) and being practical and fun. I've seen games going down the bin, because their micromanagement was too impracticable and killed the fun and easy handling out of the game.

If you look at the practical aspect than I'd say if lockers are too small compared to the players inventory, then the micromanagement starts to get ugly, taking some fun out of the game. Of course one can always do that, as you suggest:
<img width="320" height="180" src="http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/268338039143297137/4E0DDC66704C3D83F496BDC12B429C582F9DAFEB/"></img><img width="320" height="180" src="http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/272841093796344874/5798E634FDA4FCF517F7A74D5F210E1EB4C8835C/"></img>
but it's also less immersive to attach containers in front of lockers. That's more of an emergency solution. I'd really favor some cargo space for the cyclops that could be upgraded and you would feel much better with it. And one can still build containers if he needs infinite space.

I'm not calling for infinite space, just for practical, yet immersive space. I want to use the builtin lockers and maybe future builtin containers. And I'm also a friend of smaller inventory. But probably to each his own. Let's see what the devs will do.

A question to the devs concerning inventory and storage space

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