I'm not sure adding the air tank to the player paper doll is a good idea. As you can see by this poll, different players have different strategies. Switching to a specific, fixed slot will reduce the options we can experiment with.
Maybe a paper doll slot for several common tank options, but the player can still add tanks to their inventory to supplement their oxygen supply?
They can still use different tank models from the modification station. Ultra Capacity tanks, Liquid Air Breathing tanks, etc.
KlinnLost in a caveJoin Date: 2016-03-09Member: 214022Members
Sure, but it still reduces player choice. E.g. if I wanted to have 2 or 3 or 6 ultra capacity tanks. Plus, it removes a player decision -- trading off inventory space for other needs versus more oxygen. Generally speaking, you want your game to provide the player more options and more decisions.
I'm not sure adding the air tank to the player paper doll is a good idea. As you can see by this poll, different players have different strategies. Switching to a specific, fixed slot will reduce the options we can experiment with.
Maybe a paper doll slot for several common tank options, but the player can still add tanks to their inventory to supplement their oxygen supply?
From my understanding, there is nothing preventing more than one air tank to be used. It is possible that only the slotted air tank is usable. So when a player runs low on air in their tank, then they have to switch over to a new tank.
I'm not sure adding the air tank to the player paper doll is a good idea. As you can see by this poll, different players have different strategies. Switching to a specific, fixed slot will reduce the options we can experiment with.
Maybe a paper doll slot for several common tank options, but the player can still add tanks to their inventory to supplement their oxygen supply?
From my understanding, there is nothing preventing more than one air tank to be used. It is possible that only the slotted air tank is usable. So when a player runs low on air in their tank, then they have to switch over to a new tank.
ive also got a feeling that additionnal airtanks will still be available to the player in its inventory and that the slotted compartment in the ragdoll window will give the player the ability to slot one airtank for ''free space'' in it.
I'm not sure adding the air tank to the player paper doll is a good idea. As you can see by this poll, different players have different strategies. Switching to a specific, fixed slot will reduce the options we can experiment with.
Maybe a paper doll slot for several common tank options, but the player can still add tanks to their inventory to supplement their oxygen supply?
From my understanding, there is nothing preventing more than one air tank to be used. It is possible that only the slotted air tank is usable. So when a player runs low on air in their tank, then they have to switch over to a new tank.
ive also got a feeling that additionnal airtanks will still be available to the player in its inventory and that the slotted compartment in the ragdoll window will give the player the ability to slot one airtank for ''free space'' in it.
Switching between inventory and paper doll tank is the easiest method of achieving the new system while still satisfying the needs of others. But I hope that a tank inside the doll slot will allow greater speed than a tank just inside the inventory and that you have to pay with extra speed loss for carrying tanks not bound to your back, where they are far more streamlined to swimming.
When I start making tanks I settle for 3 at first. When I get to the point of exploring wrecks, I'll make 4. This is up until I can make the better tanks, then I'll settle back to 2 or 3.
Most of my time playing I've just used 1. The seamoth is relatively easy to build and I know where to get all the materials for that without needing 2 tanks.
I have this update tried 2 of the high capacity ones and not needed them. Though I haven't done any major wreck exploration.
Most of my time playing I've just used 1. The seamoth is relatively easy to build and I know where to get all the materials for that without needing 2 tanks.
I have this update tried 2 of the high capacity ones and not needed them. Though I haven't done any major wreck exploration.
Most wrecks can be explored with a single HC and superglide fins and not doing everything in a single run. Some wrecks are more difficult. For example the Koosh wreck is deep, but in radiation, disallowing the rebreather until the Aurora is fixed. It also has 2 difficult sections where you need much time: 1 very long shaft and 1 section with a door behind a sealed door behind a door and real curvy to get you stuck or disoriented in no time. Both took 1 HC without rebreather but ultraglide to its limit.
And since they decided not to limit seamoth O2 if powered, the seamoth is still #1 in diving and I won't need coral brain bed diving. Untill they block diving beyond 200m with a normal suit.
The situation has changed with the tanks doubling and going into the paper doll tank slot. Now a speed swimmer like me needs a plasteel tank, but has more inventory space.
It will make the start situation more difficult, because being slower with the new tank system and no mod station for a while.
That is not completely true or at least for the moment. How it works in Experimental mode is that the equipped tank is drained of oxygen until you switch to a new tank and then it drains air from the new tank. So if I drain a High Capacity air tank to 100/165 and switch to a new High Capacity tank, then the air meter will display 165/165. If I switch back to my old tank, then the air meter will display 100/165. Obviously, there will need to be some type of air meter on the tanks to show how much oxygen is left inside that tank or at least on the tooltip.
KlinnLost in a caveJoin Date: 2016-03-09Member: 214022Members
edited April 2016
This new arrangement makes using multiple tanks unnecessarily complicated.
If you switch tanks during the middle of a deep dive, then come up to the surface or enter your seamoth, only the tank you're wearing is recharged. The one you switched from, which is now sitting in your inventory, you have to switch back to it so it can recharge as well.
So now we've got a bunch of busy-work to do, juggling tanks back and forth, and for what purpose exactly??? How does this improve game play?
The devs seem to be forcing players towards using just one tank as the preferred play style, but there are still situations where multiple tanks make sense, e.g. exploring deep twisty wrecks. IMO, a better arrangement would be to assume a tank in your inventory is automatically connected to the one on your back so you've got one total air supply to use.
This new arrangement makes using multiple tanks unnecessarily complicated.
If you switch tanks during the middle of a deep dive, then come up to the surface or enter your seamoth, only the tank you're wearing is recharged. The one you switched from, which is now sitting in your inventory, you have to switch back to it so it can recharge as well.
So now we've got a bunch of busy-work to do, juggling tanks back and forth, and for what purpose exactly??? How does this improve game play?
The devs seem to be forcing players towards using just one tank as the preferred play style, but there are still situations where multiple tanks make sense, e.g. exploring deep twisty wrecks. IMO, a better arrangement would be to assume a tank in your inventory is automatically connected to the one on your back so you've got one total air supply to use.
Aside from the fact that the devs only have one vision how to play for all kind of players, as all modes use the same rates of resource consumption if toggled on, I don't think an experienced player needs more than a tank even in complex wrecks.
I'd say we simply need 3 real different modes together with creative. Beginners and casual players should get better O2 rates or capacities or the freedom to use inventory tanks. Normal players that aim to play the devs way use the survival mode as is, and hardcore gamers that seek challenge get their inventory reduced or must even handle decompression.
I have no problem with the way O2 handled is now, because I'm already experienced enough. But others like you should try to get the devs have a mode for you. Or let the freedom mode give you inventory tanks.
On top of all of the necessary things that I have to carry, two is the most that I prefer to carry at one time. Two air tanks, a stasis rifle, the welder, the knife, the scanner, and the habitat creator take up 16 slots in total, and that's not counting the slots taken up by food and drinks.
KlinnLost in a caveJoin Date: 2016-03-09Member: 214022Members
edited April 2016
Heh, I'm reasonablely well experienced with this game too and while I understand the multiple modes you're describing, it still amounts to removing player choice. That is, if you want "hardcore" then you must accept these conditions, while if you want "casual" play then you have to accept a somewhat different set of conditions. The player gets no choice other than when first starting the game. That's OK in certain aspects of the game, but IMO game developers should always be looking for ways to avoid railroading players down one route or another if at all possible.
Under the old system, any player in any mode could make a choice about how much oxygen they wanted with the tradeoff of losing inventory space. The player could even chose different approaches in different situations depending on what they were trying to accomplish. I believe it was a good system because it made players consider their options and make decisions.
If you subscribe to Sid Meier's famous "a game is a series of interesting choices" maxim, then it seems counter-productive to remove an interesting player choice from this game.
Heh, I'm reasonablely well experienced with this game too and while I understand the multiple modes you're describing, it still amounts to removing player choice. That is, if you want "hardcore" then you must accept these conditions, while if you want "casual" play then you have to accept a somewhat different set of conditions. The player gets no choice other than when first starting the game. That's OK in certain aspects of the game, but IMO game developers should always be looking for ways to avoid railroading players down one route or another if at all possible.
Under the old system, any player in any mode could make a choice about how much oxygen they wanted with the tradeoff of losing inventory space. The player could even chose different approaches in different situations depending on what they were trying to accomplish. I believe it was a good system because it made players consider their options and make decisions.
If you subscribe to Sid Meier's famous "a game is a series of interesting choices" maxim, then it seems counter-productive to remove an interesting player choice from this game.
+1 to your write up, I agree.
It should be all about choosing what is best for the play style we/I enjoy.
Like you said its a trade off to use more tanks.
Oh and I meet Sid once at his office on a Saturday. He is a heck of a nice person.
Heh, I'm reasonablely well experienced with this game too and while I understand the multiple modes you're describing, it still amounts to removing player choice. That is, if you want "hardcore" then you must accept these conditions, while if you want "casual" play then you have to accept a somewhat different set of conditions. The player gets no choice other than when first starting the game. That's OK in certain aspects of the game, but IMO game developers should always be looking for ways to avoid railroading players down one route or another if at all possible.
Under the old system, any player in any mode could make a choice about how much oxygen they wanted with the tradeoff of losing inventory space. The player could even chose different approaches in different situations depending on what they were trying to accomplish. I believe it was a good system because it made players consider their options and make decisions.
If you subscribe to Sid Meier's famous "a game is a series of interesting choices" maxim, then it seems counter-productive to remove an interesting player choice from this game.
The way I see it, the number of choices hasn't changed, just the time at which you need to make them. Instead of weighing air capacity vs. inventory space before you set out, you now are forced to make the risk/reward judgement during your forays of when to start heading back to the surface/your Seamoth to refill your air supply. If you have 3-5 minutes of air, then that decision almost ceases to exist. Their decision to limit us to one air tank and the decisions we need to make as a result says a lot about the direction they intend to take Subnautica's gameplay.
The tank capacities are being doubled, I'd like to point out, so that tank in that paper doll slot is equal to two in the inventory with the old system.
According to this very poll over half of the players here only use 2 tanks in the outgoing system, so they won't notice a reduction in capacity at all while getting back inventory space. Those who use only the 1 tank will notice an increase in capacity while still getting back inventory space. Of those respondents who use 3 or more tanks, 75% of them will notice a small reduction in capacity but gain a significant increase in inventory space. That leaves 6% seriously put out by the change and I'm having trouble feeling any sympathy for that.
The simple fact of the matter is that this new system fulfills several functions.
1) Makes more sense: It simply makes more logical sense to treat the tank as something that is worn.
2) The KISS Principle: Keeping the tanks simple and not allowing mid-dive swaps prevents the game from having to run scripts to track the O2 capacity of each tank. Maybe we'll see that capacity later as the game becomes more optimized, but I wouldn't hold my breath. (See what I did there? )
3) Different Decisions: As I said before in the thread, I never saw much of a change in swimming speed when using HC tanks when compared to plasteel, as long as I was wearing ultra-glide fins. But as a part of the new system, I have noticed the difference in experimental and I've been seriously considering if I want the speed or the endurance. And when cutting through a door inside a wreck, you're watching that O2 meter and judging if you can afford to complete the cut or swim back to the Seamoth and do it in two runs.
4) Back to Basics: At it's core, this game is about exploring your environment in order to acquire resources, all the while managing resources. This is making the O2 question less about how much inventory space you're willing to sacrifice, especially as the main reason to have high O2 capacity is to explore wrecks. And the primary resource there is scanning fragments which don't require inventory space. It made loading up on the tanks for a wreck dive a bit of a no-brainer.
@Klinn I agree with you that the devs are taking away choices and force a certain playstyle. I don't suffer from their O2 choice because I'm experienced enough to dive with only 1 tank and rather feel with those who can't get along. But I see where it leads if devs have a very focused vision. Driving the cyclops is an example where I'm suffering, because I can't drive a 3d object forced unto 2d motion, because the devs don't like this thing to tilt or roll. Or forcing me to micromanage power cell reloads like hell. So I simply gave up driving it as it was possible to only use the seamoth.
That's why I think there should be more choices for players who are either less experienced or don't like too much challange. If people are not to be put in categories, then maybe some choices could be put into gameplay setting options. Like O2 consumption rate or using multiple tanks or not. But that might not happen, because the calculation goes like: 60% already get along, the rest of 40% will adapt or accept micromanagement.
Another anology with being able to decide between tanks, inventory space and speed: Being able to explore with the seamoth and bases only or relying on the cyclops mothership as a mobile base. There is no decision. The devs have planned to force using the cyclops. So we're stuck with it, no matter how much we like to drive it. There are also no multiple control schemes to choose upon when driving the seamoth or cyclops. Only 1 precise control mechanism for each of them. If you don't like it how it feels to drive, you're out of luck.
@Aegil Only 60% are really happy, not another 15% with only minor difficulties gaining an unasked inventory increase. But as there are now essential differences in plasteel and HC, running HC with 165 O2 will probably even satisfy 70% (the poll didn't ask for the real O2 amounts). Yet I don't like devs who enforce micromanagement hell upon players without giving them a game setting to avoid it. The devs could either create a very heavy, 3rd UltraHC tank with 300 O2 (6 tanks) or allow a mode setting to use tanks in inventory.
This is my first post and I've sign in this forum just to say: The stupidest "update" EVER !!!!
As already mentioned this cut every free decision from the player how to explore this game. I hate paternalism. And I hate the actual stupid state (O2Tank) of the game.
2) The KISS Principle: Keeping the tanks simple and not allowing mid-dive swaps prevents the game from having to run scripts to track the O2 capacity of each tank.
Some minor corrections, at least for the latest experimental build:
You are allowed to swap tanks in mid-dive.
The game does track the amount of oxygen in each tank.
So people who want to use multiple tanks technically can do so, but at the cost of a lot unnecessary busy-work in juggling them back and forth. (see my post upstream for a more detailed explanation)
I remember a long time ago, I read an article after a PC game was released, I cant recall the game, but the Devs was surprised at how players were playing the game, in no way in line with the games design or the devs intent. The moral if there is one is we gamer will game a game how we want to, too fit a play style we like or enjoy.
The happy game is a game where the Gamers and Devs. see a play style and design come together.
Just my 2 cents.
There can be situations though, where someone figures out a way around something in game, that bypasses/suppresses part of the game - doing that can remove the challenge of the game and lead to players declaring that the game gets boring.
It can be a tricky line to tread as developers, between seeing stuff players are doing and embracing it and needing to step on it so that the game isn't wrecked.
That's the beauty of an Early Access game. the devs are seeing how we are playing through the forum's and the in game feed back.
I hope that the Subnautica master game design concept and how gamers play, come together and make this a successful Game.
I don't judge a successful game on just the revenue a company makes over the life time of a product, but on the longevity of that product, if we are still playing a game after 5 or 10 years the game is success.
Longbow Gold was released in 1997 and I still play it because it is a great game.
I am sure every one can point to a game like this, in a list of there favorite games.
I just wish for SN to be on that list...
2) The KISS Principle: Keeping the tanks simple and not allowing mid-dive swaps prevents the game from having to run scripts to track the O2 capacity of each tank.
Some minor corrections, at least for the latest experimental build:
You are allowed to swap tanks in mid-dive.
The game does track the amount of oxygen in each tank.
So people who want to use multiple tanks technically can do so, but at the cost of a lot unnecessary busy-work in juggling them back and forth. (see my post upstream for a more detailed explanation)
Fair enough. My post was based on misreading somewhere, so I thank you for that correction. Have an awesome for being polite about it, too.
I won't have a chance to dive into the game for a while, so have you seen if you can assign an extra tank to the toolbar? Might help with some of the juggling. I generally find myself at a loss with what to do with #5 but, as we're discussing here, play styles vary. Personally, given the reaction here, I'm hoping that we'll get an option for a "dive suit." (it's just a placeholder name, alright people? Don't freak out.) A suit that either gives an extra slot (probably too cumbersome) or extends the duration of a tank somehow. Or maybe a tank that regenerates O2 when you're wearing the charging fins (too tired to check wiki, you know what I mean), as the recharging station is likely to spark debates on their usefulness, assuming that they hadn't already been abandoned by most players. I don't know about them, honestly. I certainly have found that they are a little useful when using the seaglide, but after the Seamoth came in, I haven't bothered.
Comments
They can still use different tank models from the modification station. Ultra Capacity tanks, Liquid Air Breathing tanks, etc.
From my understanding, there is nothing preventing more than one air tank to be used. It is possible that only the slotted air tank is usable. So when a player runs low on air in their tank, then they have to switch over to a new tank.
ive also got a feeling that additionnal airtanks will still be available to the player in its inventory and that the slotted compartment in the ragdoll window will give the player the ability to slot one airtank for ''free space'' in it.
Switching between inventory and paper doll tank is the easiest method of achieving the new system while still satisfying the needs of others. But I hope that a tank inside the doll slot will allow greater speed than a tank just inside the inventory and that you have to pay with extra speed loss for carrying tanks not bound to your back, where they are far more streamlined to swimming.
I have this update tried 2 of the high capacity ones and not needed them. Though I haven't done any major wreck exploration.
Most wrecks can be explored with a single HC and superglide fins and not doing everything in a single run. Some wrecks are more difficult. For example the Koosh wreck is deep, but in radiation, disallowing the rebreather until the Aurora is fixed. It also has 2 difficult sections where you need much time: 1 very long shaft and 1 section with a door behind a sealed door behind a door and real curvy to get you stuck or disoriented in no time. Both took 1 HC without rebreather but ultraglide to its limit.
And since they decided not to limit seamoth O2 if powered, the seamoth is still #1 in diving and I won't need coral brain bed diving. Untill they block diving beyond 200m with a normal suit.
Hopefully, any air tanks in your inventory can be switched out with your empty one or they change their mind.
It will make the start situation more difficult, because being slower with the new tank system and no mod station for a while.
Source
https://trello.com/c/QB1qtU12/5431-make-tank-part-of-paper-doll-ui
That is not completely true or at least for the moment. How it works in Experimental mode is that the equipped tank is drained of oxygen until you switch to a new tank and then it drains air from the new tank. So if I drain a High Capacity air tank to 100/165 and switch to a new High Capacity tank, then the air meter will display 165/165. If I switch back to my old tank, then the air meter will display 100/165. Obviously, there will need to be some type of air meter on the tanks to show how much oxygen is left inside that tank or at least on the tooltip.
If you switch tanks during the middle of a deep dive, then come up to the surface or enter your seamoth, only the tank you're wearing is recharged. The one you switched from, which is now sitting in your inventory, you have to switch back to it so it can recharge as well.
So now we've got a bunch of busy-work to do, juggling tanks back and forth, and for what purpose exactly??? How does this improve game play?
The devs seem to be forcing players towards using just one tank as the preferred play style, but there are still situations where multiple tanks make sense, e.g. exploring deep twisty wrecks. IMO, a better arrangement would be to assume a tank in your inventory is automatically connected to the one on your back so you've got one total air supply to use.
Aside from the fact that the devs only have one vision how to play for all kind of players, as all modes use the same rates of resource consumption if toggled on, I don't think an experienced player needs more than a tank even in complex wrecks.
I'd say we simply need 3 real different modes together with creative. Beginners and casual players should get better O2 rates or capacities or the freedom to use inventory tanks. Normal players that aim to play the devs way use the survival mode as is, and hardcore gamers that seek challenge get their inventory reduced or must even handle decompression.
I have no problem with the way O2 handled is now, because I'm already experienced enough. But others like you should try to get the devs have a mode for you. Or let the freedom mode give you inventory tanks.
Under the old system, any player in any mode could make a choice about how much oxygen they wanted with the tradeoff of losing inventory space. The player could even chose different approaches in different situations depending on what they were trying to accomplish. I believe it was a good system because it made players consider their options and make decisions.
If you subscribe to Sid Meier's famous "a game is a series of interesting choices" maxim, then it seems counter-productive to remove an interesting player choice from this game.
+1 to your write up, I agree.
It should be all about choosing what is best for the play style we/I enjoy.
Like you said its a trade off to use more tanks.
Oh and I meet Sid once at his office on a Saturday. He is a heck of a nice person.
The way I see it, the number of choices hasn't changed, just the time at which you need to make them. Instead of weighing air capacity vs. inventory space before you set out, you now are forced to make the risk/reward judgement during your forays of when to start heading back to the surface/your Seamoth to refill your air supply. If you have 3-5 minutes of air, then that decision almost ceases to exist. Their decision to limit us to one air tank and the decisions we need to make as a result says a lot about the direction they intend to take Subnautica's gameplay.
According to this very poll over half of the players here only use 2 tanks in the outgoing system, so they won't notice a reduction in capacity at all while getting back inventory space. Those who use only the 1 tank will notice an increase in capacity while still getting back inventory space. Of those respondents who use 3 or more tanks, 75% of them will notice a small reduction in capacity but gain a significant increase in inventory space. That leaves 6% seriously put out by the change and I'm having trouble feeling any sympathy for that.
The simple fact of the matter is that this new system fulfills several functions.
1) Makes more sense: It simply makes more logical sense to treat the tank as something that is worn.
2) The KISS Principle: Keeping the tanks simple and not allowing mid-dive swaps prevents the game from having to run scripts to track the O2 capacity of each tank. Maybe we'll see that capacity later as the game becomes more optimized, but I wouldn't hold my breath. (See what I did there?
3) Different Decisions: As I said before in the thread, I never saw much of a change in swimming speed when using HC tanks when compared to plasteel, as long as I was wearing ultra-glide fins. But as a part of the new system, I have noticed the difference in experimental and I've been seriously considering if I want the speed or the endurance. And when cutting through a door inside a wreck, you're watching that O2 meter and judging if you can afford to complete the cut or swim back to the Seamoth and do it in two runs.
4) Back to Basics: At it's core, this game is about exploring your environment in order to acquire resources, all the while managing resources. This is making the O2 question less about how much inventory space you're willing to sacrifice, especially as the main reason to have high O2 capacity is to explore wrecks. And the primary resource there is scanning fragments which don't require inventory space. It made loading up on the tanks for a wreck dive a bit of a no-brainer.
That's why I think there should be more choices for players who are either less experienced or don't like too much challange. If people are not to be put in categories, then maybe some choices could be put into gameplay setting options. Like O2 consumption rate or using multiple tanks or not. But that might not happen, because the calculation goes like: 60% already get along, the rest of 40% will adapt or accept micromanagement.
Another anology with being able to decide between tanks, inventory space and speed: Being able to explore with the seamoth and bases only or relying on the cyclops mothership as a mobile base. There is no decision. The devs have planned to force using the cyclops. So we're stuck with it, no matter how much we like to drive it. There are also no multiple control schemes to choose upon when driving the seamoth or cyclops. Only 1 precise control mechanism for each of them. If you don't like it how it feels to drive, you're out of luck.
@Aegil Only 60% are really happy, not another 15% with only minor difficulties gaining an unasked inventory increase. But as there are now essential differences in plasteel and HC, running HC with 165 O2 will probably even satisfy 70% (the poll didn't ask for the real O2 amounts). Yet I don't like devs who enforce micromanagement hell upon players without giving them a game setting to avoid it. The devs could either create a very heavy, 3rd UltraHC tank with 300 O2 (6 tanks) or allow a mode setting to use tanks in inventory.
When it comes to wrecks though I don't enjoy having to keep going in and out to cut doors etc, so I tend to go with 3 or even 4 if it's a long wreck.
Hoping the devs bless us with a second paper doll slot. *fingers crossed*
Doing my best to represent those who enjoy, but are crap at, video games
As already mentioned this cut every free decision from the player how to explore this game. I hate paternalism. And I hate the actual stupid state (O2Tank) of the game.
Some minor corrections, at least for the latest experimental build:
So people who want to use multiple tanks technically can do so, but at the cost of a lot unnecessary busy-work in juggling them back and forth. (see my post upstream for a more detailed explanation)
unnecessary busy-work
THIS...
The happy game is a game where the Gamers and Devs. see a play style and design come together.
Just my 2 cents.
And yes like everyone here, I love this game.
It can be a tricky line to tread as developers, between seeing stuff players are doing and embracing it and needing to step on it so that the game isn't wrecked.
Many devs have gotten this wrong on many games.
I hope that the Subnautica master game design concept and how gamers play, come together and make this a successful Game.
I don't judge a successful game on just the revenue a company makes over the life time of a product, but on the longevity of that product, if we are still playing a game after 5 or 10 years the game is success.
Longbow Gold was released in 1997 and I still play it because it is a great game.
I am sure every one can point to a game like this, in a list of there favorite games.
I just wish for SN to be on that list...
Fair enough. My post was based on misreading somewhere, so I thank you for that correction. Have an awesome for being polite about it, too.
I won't have a chance to dive into the game for a while, so have you seen if you can assign an extra tank to the toolbar? Might help with some of the juggling. I generally find myself at a loss with what to do with #5 but, as we're discussing here, play styles vary. Personally, given the reaction here, I'm hoping that we'll get an option for a "dive suit." (it's just a placeholder name, alright people? Don't freak out.) A suit that either gives an extra slot (probably too cumbersome) or extends the duration of a tank somehow. Or maybe a tank that regenerates O2 when you're wearing the charging fins (too tired to check wiki, you know what I mean), as the recharging station is likely to spark debates on their usefulness, assuming that they hadn't already been abandoned by most players. I don't know about them, honestly. I certainly have found that they are a little useful when using the seaglide, but after the Seamoth came in, I haven't bothered.