No more NS2+??

MoFo1MoFo1 United States Join Date: 2014-07-25 Member: 197612Members Posts: 727 Advanced user
So I noticed that suddenly no servers have NS2+ anymore... and looking on the workshop I can't find it.

Did Mendasp finally pull it?

If so then I know at least 2 things the PDT needs to start working on to include into build 290...

- Different mouse sensitivities for Marine/Alien
- Stat tracking (both during and after game) especially in regards to the rt and kill graphs


Sucks if NS2+ really is gone. I don't really understand why, but it doesn't matter. If UWE wants to retain players now then they have to focus all of their efforts on replacing all the features NS2+ offered.

On a side note: Is there a console command for changing mouse sensitivities? At least that would let me set up macro's for each sens.




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Comments

  • PelargirPelargir Join Date: 2013-07-02 Member: 185857Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, WC 2013 - Silver, Forum staff Posts: 1,199 mod
    "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"

    "However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results."


    CCTEE
  • NominousNominous Baltimore, MD Join Date: 2012-02-18 Member: 146518Members Posts: 325 Advanced user
    No curved HP/energy bars near crosshair (crucial when I fade)
    No last life or round end stats
    No team-specific sensitivity
    Lack of other misc. quality of life improvements
    Crappy hitsounds

    Vanilla NS2 is a painful experience. :( I don't understand why pubbers have to suffer from the comp scene's disagreements, though. What were "UWE’s recent decisions to completely [screw] over any mods" exactly? Is it because the Atmospheric Territories extension can't be disabled?
    2coughSamG2020
  • 2cough2cough Rocky Mountain High Join Date: 2013-03-14 Member: 183952Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 1,025 Advanced user
    +map opaqueness, alien vision always on, fov adjust, damage number scale (they're so big they're very distracting in vanilla), etc, etc, etc, etc... yes the fact that vanilla has not included these things for soooooooooooOOOOOOOOOOO long is ridiculous.
  • IeptBarakatIeptBarakat The most difficult name to speak ingame. Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 2,679 Advanced user
    I enjoyed the NS1 styled hud options in ns2+, the round timer being on the hud, auto weapon pickup for better weapons and equipment, and hitsounds.

    Vanilla NS2 is really lacking these features.
    2coughNousWandererIntrepidH
  • Scout255Scout255 Canada Join Date: 2015-01-24 Member: 201015Members, NS2 Map Tester Posts: 18 Advanced user
    Playing today really makes you appreciate ns2+ and the work dragon / medasp did.... Very sad to see things go this way.

    Hopefully this can be resolved because the game is a hell of a lot less fun to play without these mods both vanilla and comp).

    Then again, with how the start of the PDT went I'm not going to hold my breath.... Sigh....
  • CalegoCalego Join Date: 2013-01-24 Member: 181848Members, NS2 Map Tester Posts: 763 Advanced user
    I did sorely miss my customized UI that nixed a lot of the clutter, and autowaypoints were an unwelcome return.

    Accuracies and such were more of a 'nice to have' for me. But the extra map sounds and effects were rather annoying, mostly because I can't remember when the last time I heard/saw them was...

    I do very much wish NS2 vanilla had more of this incorporated (pay the man and take his stuff!).
    NordicremiNousWanderer
  • WyzcrakWyzcrak Pot Pie Aficionado Join Date: 2002-12-04 Member: 10447Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue Posts: 920 mod
    Aeglos wrote: »
    there are other games to play
    This! Some folks act like they're forced to be here.
    TGNS Portal | NS2 side-by-side game viewer
    IronHorse wrote: »
    TG's win or lose mod that replaces the concede function is the best of both worlds and should be official.
    ChrisStarkIronHorsecoolitic
  • CCTEECCTEE Join Date: 2013-06-20 Member: 185634Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 772 Advanced user
    Wyzcrak wrote: »
    Aeglos wrote: »
    there are other games to play
    This! Some folks act like they're forced to be here.

    Well true but let's take love for the game as a given and start the discussion from there. :)
    grrrr im beast
  • TyrwingTyrwing Sweden Join Date: 2015-11-23 Member: 209435Members Posts: 41 Advanced user
    Nominous wrote: »
    Vanilla NS2 is a painful experience. :( I don't understand why pubbers have to suffer from the comp scene's disagreements, though. What were "UWE’s recent decisions to completely [screw] over any mods" exactly? Is it because the Atmospheric Territories extension can't be disabled?

    It's not about the compscene vs PDT. It is about standing up for modders. Mendasp's ns+ has in itself nothing to do with the compscene, but he is on the same page as Dragon and is trying to show you guys why he needs some support too. If you don't remember he had this arguement with the PDT a few weeks ago too.

    AliteWob
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver Posts: 3,466 Advanced user
    It seems my return to the game was poorly timed. I might be back in a couple of weeks.

    (Half serious)
    formerly known as F0rdPrefect

    I am good Onos
  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributor Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts Posts: 8,191 admin
    Tyrwing wrote: »
    Mendasp's ns+ has in itself nothing to do with the compscene, but he is on the same page as Dragon and is trying to show you guys why he needs some support too.
    Touchy subject incoming.

    What does "support" mean in this instance?
    His mod has been operating fine, he's no longer developing it, there's currently no way to compensate contributors for their work to ns2 (it doesn't sound like he wants the money either, just based on recent comments of his internally), almost everyone uses and loves his mod, he hasn't seemingly had any issues lately with communication to the PDT when it comes to small maintenance work, and as much as I appreciate everything he has done for ns2 over the years and am sad that I can't use NS2+ right now...... how is any of what has happened going to inspire the regular player to support him?

    Even if it did, how can they support him specifically?
    QUOTE (Techercizer @ Feb 3 2012, 10:47 AM) »
    Every time you ask for troubleshooting without providing system info, ATI adds a rendering bug for an upcoming game.

    When you feel you need to be rude or angry about a game, just read these links and remember what role you are playing:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_disinhibition_effect
    http://www.eldergame.com/2008/06/taming-the-forum-tiger/
    Wyzcrakcoolitic
  • sotanahtsotanaht Join Date: 2013-01-12 Member: 179215Members Posts: 1,020 Fully active user
    edited March 2016
    It's holding the playerbase hostage. That's the intent behind this whole thing. "If you (the devlopers) won't give in to our demands then we'll make half the playerbase quit for not having our mods, and then the other half will quit because there aren't enough people left to play with".

    I'm probably making it sound trivial and unjustifiable by saying "demands" here. That's not really my intent, I'm just trying to point out how they might expect to gain from this
    NovoRei
  • LocklearLocklear [nexzil]kerrigan Join Date: 2012-05-01 Member: 151403Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 1,337 Advanced user
    As pointed out above, there are other games to play. No one's holding anyone hostage.
    "If great visuals brings players in, great gameplay gets them to stay." - Valve
    Alitecooliticvartija
  • sotanahtsotanaht Join Date: 2013-01-12 Member: 179215Members Posts: 1,020 Fully active user
    Locklear wrote: »
    As pointed out above, there are other games to play. No one's holding anyone hostage.

    No you are missing the point entirely. Their goal is to make the playerbase STOP playing. That's their leverage, killing the game.
  • GoldenGolden Join Date: 2004-09-01 Member: 31169Members, NS1 Playtester, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, WC 2013 - Silver, NS2 Community Developer Posts: 426 Advanced user
    sotanaht wrote: »
    Locklear wrote: »
    As pointed out above, there are other games to play. No one's holding anyone hostage.

    No you are missing the point entirely. Their goal is to make the playerbase STOP playing. That's their leverage, killing the game.

    This is not the intention at all. Don't put words in their mouths.
    coolitic
  • WyzcrakWyzcrak Pot Pie Aficionado Join Date: 2002-12-04 Member: 10447Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue Posts: 920 mod
    The fallacy in debating whether or not driving away players is the intention is that removing these mods won't appreciably drive away players.
    TGNS Portal | NS2 side-by-side game viewer
    IronHorse wrote: »
    TG's win or lose mod that replaces the concede function is the best of both worlds and should be official.
  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributor Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts Posts: 8,191 admin
    Golden wrote: »
    This is not the intention at all. Don't put words in their mouths.
    Unless you are the alter ego of Mendasp, both of you are assuming intentions.
    I'll reserve judgement for when I hear it straight from the horse's mouth.



    QUOTE (Techercizer @ Feb 3 2012, 10:47 AM) »
    Every time you ask for troubleshooting without providing system info, ATI adds a rendering bug for an upcoming game.

    When you feel you need to be rude or angry about a game, just read these links and remember what role you are playing:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_disinhibition_effect
    http://www.eldergame.com/2008/06/taming-the-forum-tiger/
  • sotanahtsotanaht Join Date: 2013-01-12 Member: 179215Members Posts: 1,020 Fully active user
    Golden wrote: »
    sotanaht wrote: »
    Locklear wrote: »
    As pointed out above, there are other games to play. No one's holding anyone hostage.

    No you are missing the point entirely. Their goal is to make the playerbase STOP playing. That's their leverage, killing the game.

    This is not the intention at all. Don't put words in their mouths.
    IronHorse wrote: »
    Golden wrote: »
    This is not the intention at all. Don't put words in their mouths.
    Unless you are the alter ego of Mendasp, both of you are assuming intentions.
    I'll reserve judgement for when I hear it straight from the horse's mouth.



    If that's not their intention then they are doing it wrong, because that's the only thing they could possibly hope to accomplish.
  • WobWob Join Date: 2005-04-08 Member: 47814Members, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 483 Advanced user
    What about raising awareness for how much we take mods for granted, and how actually the game needs to implement a lot of these features to just be vanilla. That or to give enough respect to our modders so they can prepare adequately for fixes after patches.
    2coughAlite
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,771 Advanced user
    edited March 2016
    How are the mods taken for granted by the community as a whole? Shine and ns2+ are on almost every server. Comp mod and nsl mod were necessary for the competitive community. These are the most important mods and their usage reflects that.'

    Edit: Rephrased my comment with the italicized portion.
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
    coolitic
  • Deck_Deck_ Join Date: 2014-07-20 Member: 197526Members Posts: 298 Advanced user
    edited March 2016
    Nordic wrote: »
    How are the mods taken for granted? Shine and ns2+ are on almost every server. Comp mod and nsl mod were necessary for the competitive community. These are the most important mods and their usage reflects that.

    Well I am not one of the mod creators that has to deal with the updates to ns2 and knows the conversations or lack thereof that goes on between modders and UWE. Do you?
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,771 Advanced user
    Not knowing the conversations or lack thereof, nor being a mod creator, I still fail to see how those mods were taken for granted by the community as a whole. When Wob says "We take mods for granted" I am assuming he means we as in the community. Before all this drama I thought it was clear that those mods were incredibly important. The fact that nearly every server had them was evidence they were not taken for granted.
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
    IronHorseSantaClawscoolitic
  • Deck_Deck_ Join Date: 2014-07-20 Member: 197526Members Posts: 298 Advanced user
    Yes I don't think this is a discussion of if people in the community find these mods important or if server admins find them important. That's not the conversation.
  • RevanCoranaRevanCorana Join Date: 2015-08-14 Member: 207125Members Posts: 571 Advanced user
    As I understand,

    UWE should release less updates with more changes so modders have to make less updates.

    While modders should better communicate with UWE accepting eventual delays and not screw or blackmail the whole playerbase.
  • SantaClawsSantaClaws Denmark Join Date: 2012-07-31 Member: 154491Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,082 Advanced user
    edited March 2016
    I really wanted to stay quiet on this drama, and I'm probably going to regret it too, but now I feel I have to speak out.
    Golden wrote: »
    sotanaht wrote: »
    Locklear wrote: »
    As pointed out above, there are other games to play. No one's holding anyone hostage.

    No you are missing the point entirely. Their goal is to make the playerbase STOP playing. That's their leverage, killing the game.

    This is not the intention at all. Don't put words in their mouths.
    Whether the intention is one or the other really doesn't matter to me. In my personal case, the effect is exactly what @sotanaht describes. I no longer have any desire to return to NS2. In spite of all the positive buzz we've had lately.

    I always feared, early on even when NS2+ was known as CHUD, that Mendasp's mod in particular would become too big and irreplaceable. For exactly this reason, that he could use it as leverage if he for what ever reason wished to and at any point in time.

    This 'irrational' fear increasingly grew as Mendasp started to add little troll modes, starting with swalk mode iirc. Which he could impose on anybody he wants. Of course, we would be 'insured', that he would only do this as jokes and we can always disable it in console etc.

    So I had to decide.. IF he would ever impose a trollmode on me, what would I do? Would I just wait for him to, and trust that he would, decide to turn it off on his own? I don't know Mendasp that well, and I know so far he's only really doing it with people he knows. But still, I had to make these considerations on principle.

    For me, I decided, that this would be an absolute deal breaker. I would not wait for my game to become playable again - only to wonder, when I would have to go through it again.

    He would sometimes joke in voip and chats about stopping upkeep or removing the mod, or sabotaging it, in protest - but we could always pass it off as him blowing off steam..

    And look; this is a critique on @mendasp's behavior, but it is just as much a testament to the quality and value that I put on his work. Some of you are probably thinking "Just go play with vanilla settings". No; this is not an option for me, I'd rather not play at all.

    Now he has not singled me out by imposing a trollmode on me. His target isn't even me at all. But the effect on my enjoyment, nay, ability to play, is indistinguishable.

    Until now, these have been irrational fears.. But now it is reality. Once this is all over, ask yourselves, when will they claim their next demands? And when will you again be subject to their mercy? Mendasp once had the benefit of doubt on this issue. How could this possibly be repaired now?

    It is a dealbreaker for me. I cannot become reinvested in a game, that can be hold hostage like this. Especially, when such a large majority of the community, don't seem to condemn this behavior. Where is the deterrence for Mendasp to ever repeat this?

    Yes, he has stated that it is only temporary.. But how can I insure, that he will not repeat this stunt the next time he gets pissy on somebody?

    I understand why he wanted to stand in solidarity with dragon, I really do. And in that cause, I'd probably stand right beside you. But not this way. This move to remove NS2+, for any reason what so ever, is a dealbreaker for me.

    Inb4; I am singling Mendasp out here, because I do not view it as the same, as when dragon removed his mods. Dragons mods largely only affected competitive games - without them, the game is strictly speaking still playable. And if I understand correctly, dragon is not just holding a ransom, but actually contemplating quitting. -In which case we can't demand he does something he doesn't want to do.

    So you can say @Golden that sotanaht is putting words in their mouth. Maybe he is, but it is really beside the issue. The effect, whether this was the intention or not, is exactly what sotanaht describes - at the very least in my case.

    Edit-and-tldr: I don't think any less of Mendasp because of this, I think he's a great guy. I sympathize with why he did it. But I do not, and will not, agree with his method.
    Post edited by SantaClaws on
    Me9aIronHorse
  • WyzcrakWyzcrak Pot Pie Aficionado Join Date: 2002-12-04 Member: 10447Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue Posts: 920 mod
    It's easy to put words in mouths which aren't talking. I'm not sure what I'd be saying if I had just done to the entire community what I just did.

    This is the /best/ time to be playing NS2! The doomsday you feared has played out with no practical impact. Despite rhetoric, this weekend's tournament play proves that comp play isn't going to die without Dragon's mod. Despite many of us enthusiastically implying otherwise when praising Mendasp's work in the past, last night's Server Browser proved that casual play isn't going to stop without Mendasp's mod. Meanwhile, UWE has their own dev excitement AND momentum, and we'll all come out of this with better communication than before.

    I'm very optimistic about the future.
    TGNS Portal | NS2 side-by-side game viewer
    IronHorse wrote: »
    TG's win or lose mod that replaces the concede function is the best of both worlds and should be official.
    RevanCorana
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