Do not Remove the Terraformer
ilGetUSomDay
asdf Join Date: 2016-02-27 Member: 213517Members
asdf Join Date: 2016-02-27 Member: 213517Members
Hello, This tool has been incredibly helpful and I have heard the devs are going to remove it. I do not believe that is a good idea. The tool allows me to fill in gaps created by buildings, as well as unwanted footprints carved out by the structures. Gaps like between foundation and ground, or vertical supports and foundations/ground. It also allows me to dig out tunnels I may want, or even just to guide placing structure into walls.
I have used the Transformer at every build, all the time. Leaving it in doesnt even harm anything. Please do not remove it!
I have used the Transformer at every build, all the time. Leaving it in doesnt even harm anything. Please do not remove it!
Comments
I agree with you that it should stay, but sadly, the demand the Terraformer places on performance dictates its removal. Hopefully, they'll find a way to fix this issue.
I'm guessing that the reason is because of a few problems:
1) Artifacts, when removing terrain artifacts can be left, and they can cause tremendous lag. Artifacts are plants that are floating in the water and you can't interact with, as well as slivers of land.
2) The game appears to have a base map in a save file, then it adds (or subtracts) land values for every teraformed sphere. Basically even though a single sphere width tower looks to be made of a long tube with texture, its really multiple spheres overlapped, each having to be added or subtracted from the base map that is stored. This leads to huge loading issues.
That's a big old NOPE from this side of the fence.
I have used the Terraformer in all of the Stable versions so far and have never experienced any problems... And this was before installing the GTX 960 GPU. Until then, it was only vanilla Intel graphics on the motherboard.
Save the Terraformer.
Found a statement from one of the devs that explains the reasoning.
The big issue is related to the fact that the map is static and not procedurally drawn, this means the whole map has to be saved and stored making the files much much larger.
I've used it twice in my current save. The first time was to make a platform for me to take a base pic from, and the second was to dig my cyclops out after it ran aground....by the way that needs to be fixed.
I've built a lot but I don't like the single texture that the teraformer does.
I mean as a stranded voyager I wouldn't want to piss off this planet any more by debasing all this lovely terrain.
My only thing is that if the terraformer goes, the devs need to do some work on how plants interact with bases. I've seen it several times when you build something and theres a teeny tiny plant in the corner and it magically cuts into your structure making it aesthetically weird.
But I really would love some sort of map-editor....with a terraformer tool, naturally.
That way we could alter the terrain as we desire, save the map, and load it without the memory-issues it would otherwise have.
No wonder it takes a lot of space to save changes to that mesh.
Should have used b-rep instead. Oh wait, they are using 3-rd party Game Engine and can't add new rendering mechanic.
3-rd party Engines have removed the fun part out of game development (((
Creating a new game engine is a monumental task. If we didn't have 3rd party license options for using other game engines we wouldnt have nearly the choice in games we do now, as a lot of these companies wouldn't have the money or time to take on such a project. It's very possible subnautica wouldnt ever had a chance to exist if they had to completely write their own.
But making game engine is so much fun
Game designers love Unity though. Allows them to create a game without working with buggy engine in development and inconvenient tools
Its doesn't allow them to do what they wanted to do with the game, its why they did a static map vs procedurally drawn, i think the main problem was the caves and underground zones. Now if they could of made it work (its to close to release now to start all over) it would of made the world a lot easier in the future to expand and update.
On the other side the last 2-3 biomes that will hold most secrets start getting into the game. There weren't that many secrets inside the game compared to the last parts. But stopping the terraformer for that reason would mean to also stop using drilling with the help of base building.
Finally if the devs complain about the terraformer having no possitive gameplay effect, then why haven't they tried to restrict it's usage. Like setting up an excavation area for the terraformer, where terraformings count as crafted structures built into land inside the boxed excavation area. So it gets limited and terraforms aren't just changed map parts. They could have also prevented terraforming cave breakthroughs. They could have given terraforming additional purpose by making it necessary to drill for ore and use the seamoth terrain scanner to detect ore beneath the surface only reachable by terraforming.
So what could be done with a restricted terraformer: Create your own monumental valley, build a nice private cave for your base or just drill for hidden ore that your scanner detected.
But making More uses for the terraformer would just make the current memory issues worse. Why give a device that is a problem source within the current game code/saves more uses?
You're saying that because you like the device, it needs to be kept, development work focused solely on it (which is time that isn't being spent on Anything Else), and be given more uses/mechanics. That's not how game development works.
I understand that people really like the terraformer, but it seems pretty clear (as stated by the Dev's themselves) that it's not working well within the framework of Subnautica, both performance-wise and theme-wise. And at that point, the options seem pretty clear: Either make working out its kinks a focus and keep it Or get rid of it and focus on the rest of the game. So it's just a matter of looking at the work/reward curve for both options. And, despite calls to keep it, it looks to me that ditching the terraformer might be the best choice for the future roadmap of the game as a whole.
Maybe. I could see that being an annoyance/eyesore. Last few bases I've built have been on slopes or near overhangs and I build my moonpool out over the deeper terrain and higher up than the rest of the base. I've never noticed mine taking bites out of terrain.
Though you're right, getting rid of the terraformer wholesale but keeping base construction taking big chunks out of terrain seems a mite inconsistent. If bases still clear out terrain when constructed, there's still nothing stopping a player from removing terrain nearly at will, it's just a more haphazard and involved process.
well that is great for removing, but it will never help with the large gaps or footprints of buildings in the game
I've used the moonpool to carve out large areas, even Rooms do a good job. Without changing the way modules work, I can't see them removing the ability for them to remove things. It would cause a ton more problems than they are trying to fix.
No what I really said is the way how the devs treated terraforming (changing the map and saving the stores, base building cutting out terrain is just the same) it's no wonder it's causing these issues. If you'd treat terraforming as a seperate structure (like the bases) that is stored invisible and with outlines in terraforming vision mode, you'd have seperate save structures. This might not be the almighty terraforming, due to its limits, but we just saw that embedding free terraforming changes into the map is more than the devs could handle.
And I strongly doubt a player wouldn't get problems if he'd place thousands of base parts uncontrolled around the world as he would get encouraged to do so with easy terraforming in mind. Terraforming leaves no track for the player what he has changed. Most players build bases in clusters/building sites and not simply build a module here and there.
And I agree with you on one thing. Time and work is important for a lot of other things to do. So I fear it's already too late to change the way terraforming was handled. All my suggestions about doing it otherwise can't be done in time anymore. So yes, taking it out completely would be the best. Just a pitty.
And that's it. Simply too late to change it. But the way the devs did it was overambitious and now it's best to let it go. Maybe after game release they can try a careful limited version. And maybe give more ideas about usefulness. Like placing ore veins beneath the surface, which the scanner can detect and the terraformer can set free in a limited drilling circle. Or giving us a biome-minidome and we can use the terraformer to change all terrain inside the dome territory and only there.