Why NS2 will only ever be a niche game.
Soul_Rider
Mod Bean Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
Mod Bean Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
Let me start out by saying I love NS2 and all UWE have done. I have got a great many years of enjoyment out of NS and NS2, but even I knew NS2 could never be a mainstream success, as I'm sure UWE were too. Remember, all this is my opinion, nothing more.
There are a lot of different reasons why people leave NS2, but the most obvious is the difficulty. The golden question is how to keep NS2's unique appeal, and make it accessible to the masses. I am here to say, it is not possible.
People often cite games life TF2, L4D2 etc, for various reasons, but I want to point out that the unique point that makes NS2 such a great game, will always be a bar to mass-accessibility.
Like RTS games, NS2 is a game of resources, if they aren't managed correctly, spent wisely, and guarded well, your tech dries up. In a FPS centred team game, if you are losing, the other team, may tech up, but you don't lose what you had. It is one of the reasons that combat is so popular, it doesn't punish you for losing.
NS2 really punishes you if you are losing, and while it brings a great gameplay element which all of us who stick around really love, we have to accept this element is the very thing that denies general acceptance.
Build NS2 on what makes it a Natural Selection game, and you will attract a solid hardcore audience, maybe attract some of the old NS players back. Just make sure the game stays true to itself, and accept it will never be a monster success, but at least it will be a great game with a committed, if small, playerbase.
There are a lot of different reasons why people leave NS2, but the most obvious is the difficulty. The golden question is how to keep NS2's unique appeal, and make it accessible to the masses. I am here to say, it is not possible.
People often cite games life TF2, L4D2 etc, for various reasons, but I want to point out that the unique point that makes NS2 such a great game, will always be a bar to mass-accessibility.
Like RTS games, NS2 is a game of resources, if they aren't managed correctly, spent wisely, and guarded well, your tech dries up. In a FPS centred team game, if you are losing, the other team, may tech up, but you don't lose what you had. It is one of the reasons that combat is so popular, it doesn't punish you for losing.
NS2 really punishes you if you are losing, and while it brings a great gameplay element which all of us who stick around really love, we have to accept this element is the very thing that denies general acceptance.
Build NS2 on what makes it a Natural Selection game, and you will attract a solid hardcore audience, maybe attract some of the old NS players back. Just make sure the game stays true to itself, and accept it will never be a monster success, but at least it will be a great game with a committed, if small, playerbase.
Comments
Who would possibly love being kicked when they are already down, or worse, be the one doing the kicking? o.0
I think it's fair to say that you can bring many RTS elements over and mix with FPS just fine... but some just don't work, similar to how you could bring FPS into a RTS but not entirely every aspect.
So I think it's fair to say that some of those elements brought over reduced mass appeal, sure... but i wouldn't go so far to say anyone loves something that most consider a downside.
If you have any awesome ideas to address it though, you should make a mod, I think places would accept such a change
Server can have Competitive mod , mean while Match making will give player to vanilla server with out mods
I didn't mean the experience directly, I mean we know when playing, that falling behind makes the game much harder, and we like the challenge. We don't like it when we get kicked, but we appreciate the challenge is there.
Unfortunately I am between houses for an unknown period of time and working off a laptop not capable of running NS2. My time is currently spent on a new project where I am delving in C++ and Lua on an open source engine, and having great fun. It can run on my 8 year old IBM Thinkpad
I am a [Ns2] masochist. :>
I just don't see how this thread can really lead to anything. The thread title is just stating a fact. Ns 1 and 2 are, and always have been, niche games. Being positive or negative isn't the issue - it's just a thread stating the obvious and now unfixable issue of ns. We can only hope uwe doesn't make subnautica too much of a niche game (which, it doesn't appear to be).
Not trying to sound rude or a hater of the game. It is what it is (and has been).
main reason for the initial lack of playerbase, even if the game began to run at 500 fps constant I doubt you'd see people come back this far after the games release, it's like terraria. the game had an unbeatable playerbase at start because of the games good launch, but unstable info from development and then a random large patch did lead to players returning.. but they NEVER hit the numbers they hit near release and players did not stay playing for as long during release
something about games being already out for a while makes them much harder to bring back
ns2 is basically a completly noobified version of ns1 where defensive play is rewarded and aggresive play is punished, this resulted in the fact that competitive players stay away from the game because they feel it's a waste of time.
Not to mention that you need a beast of a computer to get decent fps.
The ENSL is probably the main reason ns2 even exists and those players did not play ns1 till 2012 for the hl1 engine graphics, they played it for the gameplay and the high skill ceiling.
while we all want ns2 to have more players, it was never gonna be the big blockbuster hit. it did pretty well. niche games can have smallish but devoted player bases. ns2 is a bit too small for comfort at he moment tho hah
More players = More $$$ for UWE >> You cant feel bad with that
Beside Casual and competitive player still can enjoy liek old times >>> Counter Strike GO did that great with ranking system like "Newplayer Rank >> to Global Elite"
Nowadays players want finished products and stuff around the game like ranking systems and some poor RPG elements like achievements. If you think current FPS games, have there been any new game mechanics in last 10 years? L4D is my only example of new game concept, and it takes lots from HL mods like Sven co-op. Pretty much all FPS game mechanics we have seen in last 10 years already existed in some form during golden age of HL1 mods. That is just sad. Once the most popular (and competitive) game genre is now joke because of really dull game designing. I guess people after all wanted more than just new shiny graphics as FPS gaming in in lowest phase in its history.
If you released a re-skinned Quake 3 or UT today it'd have below average sales, (just like UT3 did) and would be eclipsed by sales from your average MOBA.
At least NS2's toxic player percentage is lower than dota's =P
to be fair, unreal 3 sucked really bad and didn't play like the originals
watch unreal tournament when it comes out, guarantee you it'll have much higher sales (its pc only)
The new UT will be free. If that doesn't bring arena shooters back, nothing will.
I doubt past the initial release that UT will fare much better, unfortunately.
People today commend and pretty much require Tomb Raider like skill curves where the player starts off absolutely incapable (you cant jump, attack, do anything really) and you spend half the game just acquiring capabilities (that are taught to you, no less) that games from ten years ago would just give you from the get go. The game essentially treats you like you've never touched a video game before.
This is done so that any person can play the game... which results in more sales, of course, and is ultimately why this is done. Hardcore FPS games just can't accomplish this.
http://www.urbanterror.info/home/
Right now two of the biggest games (Dota 2, CS:GO) on steam are based on 90s or early 2000s games. Both are very enjoyable to play even for a older generation hardcore gameplay addict like me and offer challenges way beyond anything I can cope.
Quake Live is a bit of a weird thing, the game itself is still a beauty. It had no steam access and ended up getting brushed aside probably. The payment system further divided the community quite a bit, I think. Also, the game modes - especially dueling - are pretty much a mess for any newer player. I couldn't really get into dueling despite trying, due to lack of opponents and especially opponents of even remotely same skill level.
QL is going to get relaunched in Steam soonish, I think. It should be interesting to see how it fares, especially if they for example manage to integrate the smooth and modern steam matchmaking into it. I'd definitely be grinding a duel ladder if there was a functional one. Also, the payment stuff is at least a lot less divisive if it runs under steam payments.
Just goes to show you that such a model is not always a guarantee for success like so many claim
Great game, but lag compensation with the projectiles was a bit annoying. Progression system could of of also been better.