Metabolize!

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  • It's Super Effective!It's Super Effective! Join Date: 2012-08-28 Member: 156625Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 518 Fully active user
    Hehe this post feels leakish, since all I did was reply to the trello card, meh oh well.
    Cheers,
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    coolitic
  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver Posts: 4,381 Advanced user
    Fair nuff on the lerk.
    But I strongly disagree on the gorge's use. Sure it may still save more energy then over carapace outside of combat, but in most cases when you are outside combat, energy is not a issue.
    Although I will admit it takes me further testing on a personal note to see how big the difference is. I did ofc play with the recent regen changes.
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  • rantologyrantology Join Date: 2012-02-05 Member: 143750Members, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold Posts: 1,493 Advanced user
    SantaClaws wrote: »
    In compmod you get 10 hp per biomass level!

    This is incorrect, compmod lerks currently receive 5hp per biomass (check the patch notes from 7/13)

    image
    SantaClaws
  • SantaClawsSantaClaws Denmark Join Date: 2012-07-31 Member: 154491Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,082 Advanced user
    rantology wrote: »
    SantaClaws wrote: »
    In compmod you get 10 hp per biomass level!

    This is incorrect, compmod lerks currently receive 5hp per biomass (check the patch notes from 7/13)

    Thanks, post and spreadsheet updated.
  • vartijavartija Join Date: 2007-03-02 Member: 60193Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Onos, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 99 Advanced user
    rantology wrote: »
    SantaClaws wrote: »
    In compmod you get 10 hp per biomass level!

    This is incorrect, compmod lerks currently receive 5hp per biomass (check the patch notes from 7/13)
    Someone finally did something for that ridiculous lerk perma silence? Heroic effort!
    IronHorseSeb
  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributor Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts Posts: 8,191 admin
    edited August 2014
    Heh, that was the main method of employing Bite for me, flapping loudly & face first into marines typically means death.
    I hope spikes get an accuracy increase then..

    Edit : could also adjust by allowing greater evasion by fixing the delay in ducking / what used to be pancaking - which comes from no acceleration when changing to downward direction because it's just making gravity apply to you instead of actually flapping downwards.
    QUOTE (Techercizer @ Feb 3 2012, 10:47 AM) »
    Every time you ask for troubleshooting without providing system info, ATI adds a rendering bug for an upcoming game.

    When you feel you need to be rude or angry about a game, just read these links and remember what role you are playing:
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    Seb
  • ball2hiball2hi Join Date: 2012-10-22 Member: 163128Members Posts: 146 Fully active user
    ball2hi wrote: »
    I really disliked this ability with Compmod. I felt it added unnecessary required actions to be viable.

    You press Spacebar to keep a constant speed as Skulk, Lerk, and Fade. Now the Fade has an added button into the rotation...
    Metabolise isn't needed to sustain the energy to move around at high speeds.

    It's when you're blinking lots, swiping lots, and running out of energy metabolise means you can just duck round a corner and recover some energy without needing to find a shift or wait ages.

    Was it changed since the last time I compmodded? If you didn't do it every time it was up while traveling, you would barely have enough energy to do a decent engagement when you arrived at your target. Somewhat how it currently is in pubs, but you just learned to blink less and even then you'd arrive with minimal energy.
    76561198098477111.png
    Seb
  • rantologyrantology Join Date: 2012-02-05 Member: 143750Members, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold Posts: 1,493 Advanced user
    edited August 2014
    To be clear:

    Nothing about fade energy regen rates or movement was changed in compmod. The only thing we did was add metabolize and remove shadowstep/vortex. If you want to keep playing the fade the way it is now, in 268 simply don't push the metabolize button and your fade will be the exact same thing it currently is on live.
    image
    d4rkAlfSebBlrg
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver Posts: 3,458 Advanced user
    rantology wrote: »
    To be clear:

    Nothing about fade energy regen rates or movement was changed in compmod. The only thing we did was add metabolize and remove shadowstep/vortex. If you want to keep playing the fade the way it is now, in 268 simply don't push the metabolize button and your fade will be the exact same thing it currently is on live.

    Any plans for SS in the future except removing it?
    formerly known as F0rdPrefect

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    MrFangs
  • OtsOts Join Date: 2003-07-30 Member: 18577Members, Constellation Posts: 780 Fully active user
    Kudos to @SantaClaws‌ for writing out the lerk numbers, it's been well known but hasn't really been mentioned that much.
  • DarakianDarakian Join Date: 2004-09-03 Member: 31233Members Posts: 45 Fully active user
    For what it's worth I only see shadow step used every once and again. More often than not it's someone just playing with the ability to see what it does. Can we get lerk lift back? Being able to help a gorge move around would add a lot of utility to the lerk :)
    A.K.A. Yogurt
  • MuckyMcFlyMuckyMcFly Join Date: 2012-03-19 Member: 148982Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 616 Fully active user
    No Lerk lift, haven't you read the rant about gorges in vents? ;)


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  • meatmachinemeatmachine South England Join Date: 2013-01-06 Member: 177858Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 1,551 Advanced user
    rantology wrote: »
    Nothing about fade energy regen rates or movement was changed in compmod.
    I am pretty sure I read something about the startup energy for blink being increased; is this not so?

    @ball2hi‌ What i just mentioned might be the cause of you getting that, but I didnt find it toooo hard to get used to.

    That said, consider the skill floor for fade raised?
    Too weird to live, yet too rare to die
  • MuckyMcFlyMuckyMcFly Join Date: 2012-03-19 Member: 148982Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 616 Fully active user
    So the roadmap for NS2 is, all the comp stuff and anything the CDT member made as mods? :-?

    Can you imagine lerk lift and bile bomb, do you guys remember the beta version of lerks with bile? Oh my god.

    Im looking forward to seeing @meatmachine‌ in action with Metabolize. Better start practicing my aim.


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  • meatmachinemeatmachine South England Join Date: 2013-01-06 Member: 177858Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 1,551 Advanced user
    @MuckyMcFly‌ screw that, go gorge and get behind me! When I start metabolising all over marines by mistake in the middle of an engagement I'll need the extra heals :P
    Too weird to live, yet too rare to die
    MuckyMcFly
  • PelargirPelargir Join Date: 2013-07-02 Member: 185857Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, WC 2013 - Silver, Forum staff Posts: 1,196 mod
    sebb wrote: »
    I don't understand the argument that lerk is getting the short straw, or that lerk isn't the best lifeform, because it definitely is the most important lifeform in the game right now in the right hands. You would be pretty silly not to go with regen on the lerk even after the nerf. Carapace doesn't provide much benefit, and if you are worried about taking a shotgun to the face as lerk with regen you are playing the lerk wrong.

    If you have bad lerks in your team, game will be over too soon. It really depends how people play their lerk but I agree, seems logical to use Regen as a lerk. But anyway, even with Carapace, i'm not so sure you could resist against a shotgun in your face. That's why everyone should play fade! Because this is the best lifeform in NS2 and the one that needs less skill (huhuh). All lifeforms are useful though and if someone is pretty good to play lerk in public or even in competitive, it can be a slaughter.
    "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"

    "It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to."


  • OtsOts Join Date: 2003-07-30 Member: 18577Members, Constellation Posts: 780 Fully active user
    @sebb, that's the whole point. Lerks are getting the short straw because you'll be crazy to go with carapace in any situation, where as for other lifeforms in random cases it is worth while to go with either upgrade. Depending on if you play compmod or vanilla though.. No time to actually test the new regen as of yet.. :(
    IronHorsecoolitic
  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver Posts: 4,381 Advanced user
    After playing more with it, I still do not like the regen change.
    Often it provides no time gain because regen did not fully heal me before I got my ass back to a hive.

    I think I already explained my view on why its more suck for gorges.
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  • PelargirPelargir Join Date: 2013-07-02 Member: 185857Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, WC 2013 - Silver, Forum staff Posts: 1,196 mod
    After playing more with it, I still do not like the regen change.
    Often it provides no time gain because regen did not fully heal me before I got my ass back to a hive.

    I think I already explained my view on why its more suck for gorges.

    The purpose of regen in my opinion is to allow Aliens to go back faster in combat. If you're trapped for instance, this ability will be very helpul. With any lifeforms, using regen, depending if you're very low HPs or you're not won't skip the fact to come back to the Hive, but regen, Hive in addition & sometimes a Crag, you should be able to return for fighting faster. Seems legit to don't have a such OP regen that heals you so quickly.

    Carapace is a bit different, people who want to evolve with this are supposed to use it 'cause they need more health & armor in battle. That can save you in so many situations. But you don't have regen so you'll go back to the Hive more often.

    Both are differents and that's why having 2 purposes is nice. The latest CompMod update tends to get this closer as far as I know.
    "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"

    "It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to."


  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver Posts: 4,381 Advanced user
    But its not truly different if both make you return to hive.
    Trapped can be survived just as well if your team helps you get out, most of the times. Lower div aim sucks enought to get passed.

    Its not just prem div where everyone plays perfect.
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  • PelargirPelargir Join Date: 2013-07-02 Member: 185857Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, WC 2013 - Silver, Forum staff Posts: 1,196 mod
    But its not truly different if both make you return to hive.
    Trapped can be survived just as well if your team helps you get out, most of the times. Lower div aim sucks enought to get passed.

    Its not just prem div where everyone plays perfect.

    If regen had for goal what you said. Do you really think matches & rounds from lower divisions you mentioned will be more balanced? With lifeforms that only need to wait a few seconds to be full again, in combat or even not?

    I agree there are not just premium players but in that case, it doesn't make any sense for me. I remember the last patch before regen was a bit nerfed and I can tell you trying to kill a lifeform was so frustrating. Now, it seems to be better for this point at least.

    Anyway, you have a choice to make. Carapace or regeneration. Personally, I keep thinking regen is ohhh much more useful than carapace.
    "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"

    "It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to."


  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver Posts: 4,381 Advanced user
    I am personally not in a position to see how well lower div does due to one ability.
    But I do see around me that dodging is still harder for most then aiming is. may be objective, but still.
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    I am personally not in a position to see how well lower div does due to one ability.
    But I do see around me that dodging is still harder for most then aiming is. may be objective, but still.

    Even people in lower divisions know how to play the game. Most of the players in every divisions got around 1.000 hours of playtime at least. It can be more but it's rarely less so it's easier to aim when you play so many times the same game. Dodging is a bit different & harder because you need to know how your ennemy moves, shoots, etc, especially if you fight against stronger players than you are.
    "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"

    "It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to."


  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver Posts: 4,381 Advanced user
    which brings us back to the original topic..
    if dodging is harder, no regen in combat will hit lower divs harder as you just confirmed aiming is easier to pick up then dodging.
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  • vartijavartija Join Date: 2007-03-02 Member: 60193Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Onos, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 99 Advanced user
    IronHorse wrote: »
    Heh, that was the main method of employing Bite for me, flapping loudly & face first into marines typically means death.
    I hope spikes get an accuracy increase then..

    Edit : could also adjust by allowing greater evasion by fixing the delay in ducking / what used to be pancaking - which comes from no acceleration when changing to downward direction because it's just making gravity apply to you instead of actually flapping downwards.

    Fast moving lifeform with free silence is not really good game mechanic (without proper upgrade). Some may remember the more silent the faster you move skulks and perma silent fades. It's this kind of mechanics (bugs) that made many old ns1 players leave the game.
    SantaClawsIronHorse
  • 2cough2cough Rocky Mountain High Join Date: 2013-03-14 Member: 183952Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 1,024 Advanced user
    KKyle wrote: »
    then hot dang I'd be excited for this hypothetical, unconfirmed bringing back of Metabolize (Hopefully) to replace (useless) Vortex.

    No longer unconfirmed...
    Obraxis wrote: »
    We are bringing some things over from compmod. Not all of it, but the things we think will enhance the game. Just as we've done with NS2+. :)
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