Reinforced Expansion Released! - Natural Selection 2

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  • NarfwakNarfwak Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 5258Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica PT Lead, NS2 Community Developer Posts: 3,787 admin
    edited August 2013
    Narfwak wrote: »
    There is no hard coded system to prevent this outside of the normal voting and server moderation tools being properly utilized by players and admins to make sure the game stays fun for everyone. However, we should see the problem of new players getting repeatedly kicked after loading on reserved slot servers disappear as the new reserved slot system is already in place as of 252.

    As always, veteran members of the NS2 community should do their best to be patient with the newbies as they learn the ropes. It's a tricky game with a lot of different game systems going on and a lot of complexity to learn.

    Then sadly, this free weekend is going to fail. I think I'm going to stay out of it. I don't want to see ANOTHER round of veterans pub stomping. Ultimately I feel that is the #1 deterrent to retention. When veterans are getting outrageous K:D scores, it just ensures that new players don't stay. We've already seen this repetitively. Until UWE does something about this, the game is destined to die quickly. I guess we're in store for another round of 70:1 KD on pub stomping.

    I totally agree with you on trying to help new players. But it doesn't take many veterans out to stroke their egos to ruin the game for many players.

    I don't really agree with this point of view. In my past experience veteran players did not universally choose to play against rookies, but were distributed relatively evenly. Some stacking happens, but it's not very common at all. Besides, without people on their team that know what they're doing the new players don't have anyone to ask for advice or any examples to follow. If anything I'll be playing a lot more than usual over the weekend so that I can help people pick up the game for the first time.

    We have the new tutorial system in place for the first time, too. There's honestly a lot of little things that should add up to making this weekend run much better than those previous (and I wouldn't say those "failed," either).
    UWE Playtest Lead
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  • Super_GorgeSuper_Gorge Join Date: 2013-03-22 Member: 184212Members Posts: 112
    Narfwak wrote: »
    I don't really agree with this point of view. In my past experience veteran players did not universally choose to play against rookies, but were distributed relatively evenly

    Visit the steam forums more often. Especially after sales. Really disgruntled players cite this as their #1 reason they don't like the game.

    And it's already happening:

    "didnt happen to me but ultimately i didnt find the gameplay to be all that fun, would be nice to have some servers with nothing but weekenders cause the regular players just destroy us"
    Some stacking happens, but it's not very common at all. Besides, without people on their team that know what they're doing the new players don't have anyone to ask for advice or any examples to follow. If anything I'll be playing a lot more than usual over the weekend so that I can help people pick up the game for the first time.

    I don't know about, but what I heard, the last two sales were full of pub stomping. Partially explains why the new player retention rate was less than 20% at a very generous estimate. It's probably more like 10%.


  • unclechickenunclechicken Join Date: 2013-08-30 Member: 187228Members Posts: 1
    The latest updates made the game almost unplayable to me...
    The performance didnt increase, it get much worse! Also i got kind of "input lags" which means the screens move after i moved my mouse... It´s impossible to hit something anymore!
    2cough
  • KalopsiaKalopsia Join Date: 2003-05-15 Member: 16331Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 502 Advanced user
    Regarding the Reinforcement Program, I'm all for donating money to keep you guys in business and pumping out content. However before I invest in you, I want to know what my ROI will be over the next 12 months? How many more 'DLCs' do you guys plan on making before you move onto a new title?
    ns2_nothing remake Thread | Workshop
    ns2_waterdome Thread | Workshop

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  • JektJekt Join Date: 2012-02-05 Member: 143714Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,543 Advanced user
    I think you've missed the point.
    NarfwakVigilantiaKuddlyKalli
  • NarfwakNarfwak Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 5258Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica PT Lead, NS2 Community Developer Posts: 3,787 admin
    Well, I guess I'm just going to have to be a badass and stack the team with all the greens and lead them to victory over their oppressors. TO BATTLE RAAA

    But yeah, please, guys, don't stack teams against brand new players. That's just mean.
    UWE Playtest Lead
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  • digitaljuicedigitaljuice Join Date: 2003-01-17 Member: 12420Members Posts: 34
    DFA is hosting a ROOKIES ONLY server for the weekend. We are going to be actively babysitting it so that any non-rookies will be kicked unless commanding.

    Vets are welcome to make use of our ELITE NS2 server or primary DFA server instead.

    glad to hear!
  • ChaunceyChauncey Join Date: 2013-07-25 Member: 186377Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 2
    Am I the only one excited for the taunt?
  • DarkeagleDarkeagle Join Date: 2004-11-03 Member: 32610Members Posts: 1
    Thank you Dev team, for all your hard work!!!
    This has been a fun journey since NS1!
    This update is soo fun, these updates have been a nice evolution to see and be a part of.
    killing a jetpacker earlier today while caught in my webs....priceless, he thought he could gl the hive-NOPE
    :D

    I LOVE the new alien hive vision, I feel it's the best of both worlds.
  • JohnnySmash77JohnnySmash77 Join Date: 2009-07-07 Member: 68079Members Posts: 9
    I agree with Super_Gorge, lack of matchmaking is just a way to broadly sweep away huge portions of new players. Not to mention having imbalanced teams is match-ruining, rendering all content and balance tweaks moot.

    Getting people to stick with a game that has problems like that was viable a few years ago, but nowadays people will instantly switch to their other five go-to games, games that are on sale, games that are free, or games that they bought but haven't tried yet.
  • d0ped0gd0ped0g Join Date: 2003-05-25 Member: 16679Members Posts: 782 Advanced user
    I would have bought these DLCs a few days ago without batting an eye, and all future ones too.
  • xen32xen32 Join Date: 2012-10-18 Member: 162676Members, Reinforced - Supporter Posts: 1,011 Advanced user
    AceDude wrote: »
    You should post your "dream tier" ideas here, that's for sure. We'll see what can we do. More posts means more chance! It's tricky to make a new tier, so all help is much welcomed!

    "I've donated 1000$ to Unknown Worlds Entertainment and all I got is this lousy T-shirt"
  • SolarisSolaris Join Date: 2003-05-11 Member: 16213Members Posts: 185
    My personal dream tier:
    The ability to have my steam avatar show up as decal on my shoulder pads.
    None of that other stuff needed, just a custom decal on my SE Black Armour and I'm a happy little girl.
    Would be worth ~40€ to me. The system is in place, let use it to it's full potential!
    (I so much hoped that would be a standard feature sooner or later... gives the player models more "personality". Also clans could all display their logo, sponsor, etc.)
    The first rule of the tautology club is the first rule of the tautology club.
    KuddlyKalli
  • RockyMarcRockyMarc Join Date: 2009-11-24 Member: 69519Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 474 Fully active user
    So does any UWE devs know if we are still getting Overgrowth when it is released?
    (http://www.wolfire.com/overgrowth)
  • TychoCelchuuuTychoCelchuuu Anememone Join Date: 2002-03-23 Member: 345Members Posts: 10,501
    edited August 2013
    RockyMarc wrote: »
    So does any UWE devs know if we are still getting Overgrowth when it is released?
    (http://www.wolfire.com/overgrowth)
    You can redeem your Overgrowth key right now if you want. I did it like a year ago. (If you bought the game before that bundle, I mean.)
    QUOTE (MOOtant @ Sep 21 2012, 11:06 AM) »
    What is wrong with being a racist?

  • GISPGISP Battle Gorge Denmark Join Date: 2004-03-20 Member: 27460Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Onos, WC 2013 - Gold, Subnautica Playtester, Forum staff Posts: 1,232 mod
    CyberKun wrote: »
    IS SHADOW SKULK IN YET?
    Not yet, will get in soonish.
    Forum Mod - UWE server admin - Have questions about SN or NS2? Need help promoting SN or NS2? Found a bug, or exploit? Or just want to say hi. PM me.
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  • JektJekt Join Date: 2012-02-05 Member: 143714Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,543 Advanced user
    Some dates for the new models going in would be good.
  • jewbearjewbear Join Date: 2013-02-09 Member: 182943Members, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 66
    Jekt wrote: »
    Some dates for the new models going in would be good.
    From what I understand it's going to be sept. 3rd
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    www.BlueFangSolutions.com - best ns2 server provider
  • RockyMarcRockyMarc Join Date: 2009-11-24 Member: 69519Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 474 Fully active user
    dePARA wrote: »

    And again, green rookies get slaugtered on rubberbanding 5 tick servers.
    Thats the way to bring more players the game. NOT

    This.. Working on server performance should be at the top on the to do list.
    TychoCelchuuu
  • Blarney_StoneBlarney_Stone Join Date: 2013-03-08 Member: 183808Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,037
    In ISE's video he has new icons for the hand grenades in his armory. In my armory the hand grenade icons are a rifle, a rifle butt, and a pistol. Anyone know more about this? I'd really rather have the grenade icons if possible, this is just confusing right now.
    if it keeps on raining the levee's going to break
  • RockyMarcRockyMarc Join Date: 2009-11-24 Member: 69519Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 474 Fully active user
    edited August 2013
    Agree, I understand UWE are small but the system specs are demanding for this game and the server specs are just ridiculous.
    Games like TF2 where ISPs can host a good amount of servers on an average box specs, flood in the people!
  • NarfwakNarfwak Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 5258Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica PT Lead, NS2 Community Developer Posts: 3,787 admin
    In ISE's video he has new icons for the hand grenades in his armory. In my armory the hand grenade icons are a rifle, a rifle butt, and a pistol. Anyone know more about this? I'd really rather have the grenade icons if possible, this is just confusing right now.
    Sounds like a mod conflict.
    UWE Playtest Lead
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  • ZinkeyZinkey Join Date: 2013-06-25 Member: 185694Members, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Onos, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester Posts: 123
    DFA is hosting a ROOKIES ONLY server for the weekend. We are going to be actively babysitting it so that any non-rookies will be kicked unless commanding.

    Vets are welcome to make use of our ELITE NS2 server or primary DFA server instead.

    Brilliant idea. It may be worth posting this in the steam forums as well. At lot of the newer players will be discussing the game on those forums this weekend and may not find this info buried in this post. (If you havent of course done it already!)

  • Maxx11_v2.0Maxx11_v2.0 Join Date: 2012-11-18 Member: 172221Members Posts: 274
    Open rant to Unknownworlds Entertainment (mostly referred to as UW or "you" from this point on):
    tl;dr? The less ranty and hopefully constructive advice is in bottom section.

    I had to watch the "Reinforced program" video twice, just to make sure I wasn't imagining things.
    In another world these updates could be called DLC expansions, they could be accessed by a season pass or through an in-game micro transaction

    In a world where NS2 sells like CoD, yes. In a world where NS2 sells like NS2, no. People don't need Unknownworlds telling them how "amazing" they are for adding free content. Especially since I'm sure UW is more than aware that any attempt at paid DLC at this point would split the already small player base and kill the game.Sure, for a single player game concurrent player count is mostly irrelevant. NS2 isn't a single player game though, in fact its strictly on-line multiplayer.

    No, UW didn't need to add any more than they promised. But I don't believe for a second that the expansions ware strictly a labor of love and not a calculated move to bring in more players (and sell more copies).

    What they did need to do however, was fix that which was broken (and to this day, in many ways, still is). A lions share of the patches ware necessary performance and bugfixes.
    I'm going to take a moment to quote my favorite line from the official wiki:
    What are the system requirements?

    The target specifications for Version 1.0 are 1.2 GHz Processor, 256MB RAM, a DirectX 9 level graphics card, Windows Vista/2000/XP, Steam, mouse, keyboard and of course, an internet connection. We are working hard to make sure NS2 runs well on average hardware without having to upgrade your machine!

    Ah, brings a nostalgic tear to my eye when I remember that this is what greeted NS2 hopefuls on the preorder page back in 2009 (and no, its still not updated in the wiki).

    Now back to my rant:
    What I find rather amusing is the part about not wanting micro transactions, despite the "Reinforced" program being just that. A model, where you "buy" nothing or next to nothing.

    Sure, if you want to call this compensation for providing a free service, I assume you intend to split profits from this venture (if any) with your volunteers, you know, all the guys and gals that use their free time and resources (electricity costs money, as you aptly pointed out in the video), to help you. Sounds fair, right?

    Just to be clear, that isn't a serious suggestion, because I'm almost certain that these people wouldn't take a cent from you, even if you tried to shove it in their hands. Thats the kind of dedicated fanbase this game has, people that are willing to work for free, ignore glaring problems and defend any terrible decisions UW makes. I'm very disappointed... So very, very disappointed, that UW would exploit this dedication in such an ugly manner. Shame on you Unknownworlds Entertainment.

    The sad part is that I really do like the UW team (they seem like a bunch of top lads, dedicated to keeping their company afloat), and I absolutely love the NS concept. Its just so heartbreaking to see UW consistently shoot itself in its collective foot.

    Now, thats my rant done, now for something constructive:

    Heres what I propose. You already have a framework in place for cosmetic changes to specific player models. Why not roll with it. If done right (no glowing skulk models), you could easily pull off cosmetic micro transactions. I'm sure loads of people would be willing to pay for a unique marine skin, special taunts, alternative command console voices etc. Premium cosmetic changes for a few bucks, for personal satisfaction or showing off.
  • ImbaxlaxImbaxlax Join Date: 2013-08-08 Member: 186656Members, Reinforced - Gold Posts: 62
    In a world where NS2 sells like CoD, yes. In a world where NS2 sells like NS2, no. People don't need Unknownworlds telling them how "amazing" they are for adding free content. Especially since I'm sure UW is more than aware that any attempt at paid DLC at this point would split the already small player base and kill the game.Sure, for a single player game concurrent player count is mostly irrelevant. NS2 isn't a single player game though, in fact its strictly on-line multiplayer.

    At release, NS2 sold inordinately well. Like, seriously. For its price and its indie status, it sold unimaginable numbers of copies. UWE were perfectly within their rights to say "good game guys, lets all go buy yachts and fuck off, let these nerds play their games". But they didn't. You think all of this is just a calculated action to get more money? I'm 90% sure an EA analyst would have advised to cut almost all support for the game, and to pull almost all staff off the project immediately after the initial boom in sales.

    UWE didn't. So yeah, pretty sure that makes it a labour of love.
    Mattk50
  • Maxx11_v2.0Maxx11_v2.0 Join Date: 2012-11-18 Member: 172221Members Posts: 274
    edited August 2013
    Imbaxlax wrote: »
    At release, NS2 sold inordinately well. Like, seriously. For its price and its indie status, it sold unimaginable numbers of copies. UWE were perfectly within their rights to say "good game guys, lets all go buy yachts and fuck off, let these nerds play their games". But they didn't. You think all of this is just a calculated action to get more money? I'm 90% sure an EA analyst would have advised to cut almost all support for the game, and to pull almost all staff off the project immediately after the initial boom in sales.

    UWE didn't. So yeah, pretty sure that makes it a labour of love.

    I may have agreed if this was a single player title or at the very least had a single-player campaign. In short, if it was a game that didn't require an active userbase to continue selling. You think NS2 generated incredible profit with its initial sales? I highly doubt it, I also stress the word "profit". Writing their own engine, is bound to have been a huge investment and quite a gamble. Theres also the matter of brand awareness. NS2 and its popularity will have a massive impact on UWs next title, having a broken strictly multiplayer game that fizzled out after short period of time on their resume isn't good advertising, so they keep on fighting. working on fixes, rebalancing and pumping out content. They need to make NS2 as successful as possible, not only to generate immediate profits, but also to strengthen UW as a brand. I can only guess, and I'm not saying there was no "love" involved in the creative process, but if you think that it was the only reason, or even the main driving force behind it theres a good chance you'd be very disappointed.

    Anyway, I don't want to start an argument here. I needed to vent stuff out, and I did. Everyone else has the right to their own opinion.


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