Regeneration is boring replace it with something fun.

nSidianSidia Members Join Date: 2012-08-15 Member: 155651Posts: 208
edited July 2013 in NS2 General Discussion
Health/armor regeneration upgrade on crag tech is just boring. Every one gets the armor buff in carapace anyways. No one wants cara nerfed and buffing regen is dumb. Its just a bad upgrade and really should be replaced. I think it would be interesting if there was a upgrade that wasn't passive. Maybe you could have one that enabled res for kill. So early in the game you actually would have a choice of do I go cara or do I go for (what ever silly name you name it) and try to farm some res for kill. Maybe 1 shell would be 1 rpk 2 is 2 rpk and 3 is 3 rpk. Sounds fair and would actually give players a reason not to use carapace. At least early on when you are poor.

Also you guys ever going to fix that sound bug in ball court or the missing gorge tunnel icon on the buy menu? Or is that a feature now?
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Comments

  • RoflcopterV22RoflcopterV22 ArizonaMembers, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester Join Date: 2013-04-03 Member: 184616Posts: 106 Fully active user
    nSidia wrote: »
    Every one gets the armor buff in carapace anyways.

    Since it only adds 20 armor to skulk/fade/lerk I almost always go regen, actually.
    I'm the kind of guy who would xenocide while teambalance is on.
    Mattk50Soli Deo GloriaPriderage
  • FrozenFrozen New York, NYMembers, Constellation Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Posts: 1,481 Advanced user
    Oh, I think regen is extremely fun
    mattji104
  • Racer1Racer1 Members Join Date: 2002-11-22 Member: 9615Posts: 1,595 Advanced user
    If you are looking for something a bit closer to regen, how about vampire bite? Each successful melee attack would return a small percentage (e.g. 5%) of damage done. Ranged attacks would be half that. A kill would give you an additional 5% health.
  • current1ycurrent1y Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester Join Date: 2003-12-08 Member: 24150Posts: 677 Advanced user
    I disagree regen is boring but I do agree its silly to nerf cara to the point it's almost useless. Only time I use cara is when I'm going on suicide type missions as skulk.
  • nSidianSidia Members Join Date: 2012-08-15 Member: 155651Posts: 208
    mattji104 wrote: »
    Oh, I think regen is extremely fun
    How is it fun? You just sit there and get health back like nothing happened. Ive only used it to get a fast regen while inside of a vent but then going right back to cara. It just feels gimmicky like you can just heal your self and don't need to rely on a gorge or crag station.
  • SUPER_SARSSUPER_SARS Members Join Date: 2013-02-13 Member: 183039Posts: 274 Advanced user
    Locklear wrote: »
    Passive regeneration fits the hit and run style of aliens imo. Pretty fun.

    Kind of like trolling, nerd.
    Locklear
  • nSidianSidia Members Join Date: 2012-08-15 Member: 155651Posts: 208
    edited July 2013
    Locklear wrote: »
    Passive regeneration fits the hit and run style of aliens imo. Pretty fun.

    So your saying its a crutch for noobs or for teams without a gorge to do its job. Would be fun for death matching but pretty boring in organized play.
  • SUPER_SARSSUPER_SARS Members Join Date: 2013-02-13 Member: 183039Posts: 274 Advanced user
    nSidia wrote: »
    Locklear wrote: »
    Passive regeneration fits the hit and run style of aliens imo. Pretty fun.

    So your saying its a crutch for noobs or for teams without a gorge to do its job. Would be fun for death matching but pretty boring in organized play.

    *you're

    Also in organized play a lot of teams only have a their commander as a gorge and he/she can't get to the skulks on the field all the time. If they do go crag hive the skulks can switch from cara to regen at any point for free and heal up without going to back to the hive or gorge saving a lot of time and map presence. But I'm sure you knew this that's why you said so cause that's pretty obvious.
  • nSidianSidia Members Join Date: 2012-08-15 Member: 155651Posts: 208
    Racer1 wrote: »
    If you are looking for something a bit closer to regen, how about vampire bite? Each successful melee attack would return a small percentage (e.g. 5%) of damage done. Ranged attacks would be half that. A kill would give you an additional 5% health.

    That would be really fun actually and would synergize with aura really well or whatever its called.
  • LocklearLocklear [nexzil]kerrigan Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, WC 2013 - Shadow Join Date: 2012-05-01 Member: 151403Posts: 1,337 Advanced user
    edited July 2013
    Why bother with something like that when regeneration already fits that playstyle, as Fade you can go in and get a swipe and regenerate whatever damage you took as long as it wasn't like 2x shotgun blasts and get back in the fight fairly shortly. If you took no damage, then go in for another swipe..

    It already works fine as it is, without any complexity/healing for damage crap required.

    If I took damage I don't want to go back in for another swipe to get health back, I'd rather just go back to the hive or have the current regeneration work my hp back up while I traverse to another portion of the map.

    "If great visuals brings players in, great gameplay gets them to stay." - Valve
  • SUPER_SARSSUPER_SARS Members Join Date: 2013-02-13 Member: 183039Posts: 274 Advanced user
    Locklear wrote: »
    Why bother with something like that when regeneration already fits that playstyle, as Fade you can go in and get a swipe and regenerate whatever damage you took as long as it wasn't like 2x shotgun blasts and get back in the fight fairly shortly. If you took no damage, then go in for another swipe..

    It already works fine as it is, without any complexity/healing for damage crap required.

    If I took damage I don't want to go back in for another swipe to get health back, I'd rather just go back to the hive or have the current regeneration work my hp back up while I traverse to another portion of the map.

    I think thats too complex for nsidia, let him help him out. blinky swipy damage blinky heal. yeah?
  • nSidianSidia Members Join Date: 2012-08-15 Member: 155651Posts: 208
    sure it works but its boring as hell for me at least.
  • XoPhyteXoPhyte Members Join Date: 2013-05-31 Member: 185431Posts: 29 Fully active user
    current1y wrote: »
    I disagree regen is boring but I do agree its silly to nerf cara to the point it's almost useless. Only time I use cara is when I'm going on suicide type missions as skulk.

    This. Cara is useless now.
  • Ghosthree3Ghosthree3 Members, Reinforced - Supporter Join Date: 2010-02-13 Member: 70557Posts: 3,432 Advanced user
    Locklear wrote: »
    Passive regeneration fits the hit and run style of aliens imo. Pretty fun.

    It would if it wasn't so nerfed it takes 70s to regen to full.
    76561197996992409.png
  • Kenshir0Kenshir0 Members, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2013-02-25 Member: 183347Posts: 28
    nSidia wrote: »
    Health/armor regeneration upgrade on crag tech is just boring. Every one gets the armor buff in carapace anyways.

    I always take regen on any lifeform since build 250
  • EmooEmoo Ibasa Members Join Date: 2002-12-20 Member: 11198Posts: 535
    Regen is boring? Carapace is just a flat health upgrade same as biomass. If your gonna replace one kill carapace.
    Ingame name = Ibasa
    IronHorse
  • GoldenGolden Members, NS1 Playtester, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, WC 2013 - Silver, NS2 Community Developer Join Date: 2004-09-01 Member: 31169Posts: 426 Advanced user
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    Locklear wrote: »
    Passive regeneration fits the hit and run style of aliens imo. Pretty fun.

    It would if it wasn't so nerfed it takes 70s to regen to full.

    Why are you relying on regen when you're almost dead? Go back to the hive. Regen replenishes chip damage -> hit and run.
  • aeroripperaeroripper NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation Join Date: 2005-02-25 Member: 42471Posts: 2,420 mod
    Regen may not be "exciting", but it allows you to stay in the field longer and make hit and run attacks more often (which is fun) without traveling to a gorge or hive. If anything cara needs a little bit of a buff now to make it as good of a choice as regen. Maybe not as much as it was in build 249, but it could use something.
  • joederpjoederp Members Join Date: 2012-11-02 Member: 165992Posts: 333
    edited July 2013
    They are both pretty nerfed right now, I honestly think cara and regen suck and need a buff. Maybe not back to 100% strength they were at before but more than they are now.. I mean seriously 100 armor for cara onos? 20 extra for fade? OH WOW 20 armor that will REALLY make a difference...
    And have you ever got down to low HP with a regen onos? You have to wait like 2 minutes to regen to full health / armor.. its ridiculous.
  • bizbiz Members Join Date: 2012-11-05 Member: 167386Posts: 415 Fully active user
    i think running all the way back to the hive to heal is more boring

    but maybe they dumbed it down so regen + cara costs as much as cara because of these type of complaints
  • Ghosthree3Ghosthree3 Members, Reinforced - Supporter Join Date: 2010-02-13 Member: 70557Posts: 3,432 Advanced user
    Golden wrote: »
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    Locklear wrote: »
    Passive regeneration fits the hit and run style of aliens imo. Pretty fun.

    It would if it wasn't so nerfed it takes 70s to regen to full.

    Why are you relying on regen when you're almost dead? Go back to the hive. Regen replenishes chip damage -> hit and run.

    If I can go back to the hive I don't need regen. If I take only 1-2 bullets it doesn't take long to regen that's true, but if you only took 1-2 bullets odds are you were trying to parasite or just escaping around a corner. In which case, cara does the same thing as a skulk effectively, and you can probably still go to the hive anyway. What I think regen is most useful for is hitting RTs, but there's no point when every time you make your escape you have to wait 10 years to heal.
    76561197996992409.png
    joederp
  • MrNihilMrNihil Members Join Date: 2013-03-02 Member: 183524Posts: 23
    Before 250 I almost went cara. For skulk it wasn't too much, but all others got suitable boost in armor (compared to +20 per marine upgrade). Now cara is good option only on fade and onos, since gorge got like 25 more with 3 crags? Its like 4 bullets more to withstand? Regen is too slow. Its faster to actually run to hive/crag and go back again (unless gorge, its quite cool tactic). I understand its to balance that rines got to go to armoury and weld themselfs now. But hey, their comm drops medkits, they got PG (sure, aliens got tunnels, but they are more like base links not forward stations) and such.

    My humble opinion on regen alone: Boost it. Make it worthy waiting for full health than making retreat to base. Or... One could get faster crag/hive healing or on cyst biomass.

    This update is more like for pro players then new ones. Rookie servers are rare in welding buddies, good crag stations (this 200 limit is ridiculous) or gorges as healers. Regen should be for people who doesn't want to rely on those things, or boost those abilities.
  • joederpjoederp Members Join Date: 2012-11-02 Member: 165992Posts: 333
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    Golden wrote: »
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    Locklear wrote: »
    Passive regeneration fits the hit and run style of aliens imo. Pretty fun.

    It would if it wasn't so nerfed it takes 70s to regen to full.

    Why are you relying on regen when you're almost dead? Go back to the hive. Regen replenishes chip damage -> hit and run.

    If I can go back to the hive I don't need regen. If I take only 1-2 bullets it doesn't take long to regen that's true, but if you only took 1-2 bullets odds are you were trying to parasite or just escaping around a corner. In which case, cara does the same thing as a skulk effectively, and you can probably still go to the hive anyway. What I think regen is most useful for is hitting RTs, but there's no point when every time you make your escape you have to wait 10 years to heal.

    Exactly, it takes too long to be useful if you take any significant damage and need to retreat to heal. If I have to wait more than 30 seconds to heal then what is the advantage of regen over just running back to the hive?? Regen is supposed to allow aliens to not rely on a gorge or crag station so much, to be able to have an encounter then retreat to heal in a reasonable amount of time then go back to battle. Right now it takes so long to heal as anything higher than a skulk that by the time you are at full health you already have half the marine team on top of you.
  • 1dominator11dominator1 Members Join Date: 2010-11-19 Member: 75011Posts: 1,171 Advanced user
    edited July 2013
    It may not be the most exciting but that is no reason to remove something this core to the alien playstyle. More so an argument for adding more upgrades, cause 2 upgrades per chamber is pretty weak.
    I do think it goes too damn slow to be really fun or even useful in most cases, in the time it takes me to regen as any lifeform but onos I could just run back to the nearest hive/gorge and the whole process will be faster to boot and without the risk of dying to ninja marines cause your bumming around near the front with low health. I much prefered the out of combat but quick regen of a few builds ago.
    Of course considering how much cara sucks on the higher lifeforms (+50 armour on an onos?!?!?) you might as well go regen, its in combat action will probably add up to more effective HP than the cara.
  • Ghosthree3Ghosthree3 Members, Reinforced - Supporter Join Date: 2010-02-13 Member: 70557Posts: 3,432 Advanced user
    joederp wrote: »
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    Golden wrote: »
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    Locklear wrote: »
    Passive regeneration fits the hit and run style of aliens imo. Pretty fun.

    It would if it wasn't so nerfed it takes 70s to regen to full.

    Why are you relying on regen when you're almost dead? Go back to the hive. Regen replenishes chip damage -> hit and run.

    If I can go back to the hive I don't need regen. If I take only 1-2 bullets it doesn't take long to regen that's true, but if you only took 1-2 bullets odds are you were trying to parasite or just escaping around a corner. In which case, cara does the same thing as a skulk effectively, and you can probably still go to the hive anyway. What I think regen is most useful for is hitting RTs, but there's no point when every time you make your escape you have to wait 10 years to heal.

    Exactly, it takes too long to be useful if you take any significant damage and need to retreat to heal. If I have to wait more than 30 seconds to heal then what is the advantage of regen over just running back to the hive?? Regen is supposed to allow aliens to not rely on a gorge or crag station so much, to be able to have an encounter then retreat to heal in a reasonable amount of time then go back to battle. Right now it takes so long to heal as anything higher than a skulk that by the time you are at full health you already have half the marine team on top of you.

    They actually all take the same time to heal, it's % max hp regen not a fixed amount. I believe the skulk gets 2hp per regen tick atm.
    76561197996992409.png
  • ZekZek Members, NS1 Playtester, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 7962Posts: 4,690 Advanced user
    I think regen is plenty fun and useful right now. Cara on the other hand is very boring for higher lifeforms with its new values. Maybe it's still good on a spreadsheet but the difference is not perceivable to the player which makes it not fun.
  • nSidianSidia Members Join Date: 2012-08-15 Member: 155651Posts: 208
    useful but not fun just sitting there waiting for the health also very loud.
  • male_fatalitiesmale_fatalities ausns2.org Members, Constellation Join Date: 2004-03-06 Member: 27185Posts: 673 Fully active user
    edited July 2013
    Im happy with regen / cara being shit, MC/SC are far more interesting chambers. Lets face it, going MC/SC force you to alter your playstyle. Going DC you just play exactly the same...

    I would love for aliens to have a completely different tech tree based on aggression. The two upgrades would be increased RoF & Focus.
    NS1: Boost|. mf
    NS2: asc . mf-
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