Low fps, please help! (solved) inadequate GPU:gt 640

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

First off, love the game! Have always been a fan of ns! inadequate

I'm having issues with low fps (38fps main menu) And after searching the forums non of the 'help' worked for me. Below is my rig

Amd FX-6300 six-core Processer
Gigabyte 970-da Mother board
16gig 4x4 G Skill ddr3 1600mhz Ram modules
Nvidia gt 640 2gb GPU
Windows 7 premium 64bit
OS on ssd 120gb
Game on 1Tb Seagate Barracude

I have downloaded Nvidia Experience package but There is no profile for NS2, I Also have the latest drivers for the GPU 320.18. The computer is only 3 or so months old!
I have tried playing around the Nvidia graphics settings but nothing really helped. Windows is fully updated and I even went to the trouble of getting the latest drivers for the mobo etc.

I run my screen at 1600x1050, being a widescreen 22.5', And with all the setting on low (in game), V syn off I still only get 38 fps while on the main menu and it drops to about 12 fps late game.

Here is the skydrive link for: http://sdrv.ms/12TjsSy
log.txt
plog 1
plog 2

screenie of r_stats with High and Low settings.

If you need anything else please let me know.

Regards

Lonewolf*jedi

EDIT;
Added screenies.
Added Hardware to rig list.

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

After Deleting %appdata% ns2 files and steamapp ns2 files, deleting local content and re downloading the game I can report that nothing has changed. I initially got the infamous black screen of death the first load up, deleted cache in %appdata% and shaders in the ns2 file which fixed the black screen of death problem.

However, I still continue to have low fps even with low settings.

Regards

Lonewolf*jedi

P.s I will attach log file asap

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

Here is the log, Wouldn't let me attach to previous post.

LW

Would also like to note that after a fresh install, I verified the local game contents and had 9 missing files/failed to validate. Interesting?

DC_Darkling · June 2013

I suspect something is wrong with either your graphics card, drivers, direct x or something of the sorts.

2 reasons:
* Waiting for gpu is 46. That means each frame takes 46 frames waiting on the gpu, if I remember ok. The frame render time is over 50, supporting this.
* your first log showed:
Error: File 'models/props/refining/refining_wall_detail_02.dds' failed consistency check!
Error: IDirect3DDevice9::Reset to 1680x1050 failed (Device lost)
Error: IDirect3DDevice9::Reset to 1680x1050 failed (Device lost)
Error: Attempted to load remote options from a file that does not exist.
Error: 110 memory leaks in 'Client' (45224 bytes)
Error: 110 memory leaks in 'Engine' (45224 bytes)

Worrying about the 3D error there. Combined with the absurd high waiting for gpu I would strongly suggest to start checking around that area first.

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

Yeah, I was just starting to see that re-occurring error with the 3DDevice. I remember that the previous driver I had used I think 310.20 had no waiting time but when I updated to the new 320.18 nVidia drivers the gpu started to get a bit loaded.

Graphics card is only 3 or so months old, as stated, However from time to time there is a red, often green dotted line that appears on the screen in random spots...
The Drivers are the latest, And there is no increase is fps over the old driver, only the load on the gpu.
DirectX is the latest and I've already checked that.
Something of the sorts is why im asking for help! :P

Regards.

Lonewolf*jedi

DC_Darkling · June 2013

new does not mean broken. (actually it means if it is the card, go complain for warranty.

* You could remove your graphics driver completely and then install a older version which 'worked'.
* you could reinstall windows. (Doubt its needed, but it still is a test.
* you could open a support ticket with nvidia.
* id go complain for warranty if option 1 doesnt help to be honest. Green dotted lines in random spots? Sounds very bad. Heat issue perhaps? Or drivers.

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

I've already talked to the company and I told them that I will get some photos because sometimes reproducing the symptoms can be hard. I will be going to see them tomorrow.
I have already re-installed windows, Its only 10 days old.
I will see what can be done with the company that supplied the gpu (they have said they will honor the warranty) , then I will go talk to Nvidia. See what tomorrow brings.

I've created a custom profile for ns2 in the nVidia control panel. I turned all the usual anitailasing, vsync etc off and this has reduced the load on the gpu down to 9-10ms. The load on the cpu is 0-1ms. With this there has been no increase of fps on the main menu, I have however noticed an increase of fps while in ready room and in map. It's almost midnight so finding a full server is getting hard to really test mid and late game fps.

It's a shame that everything is on the lowest settings, I would like to play and see all the hard effort the boys have put into making this game. Playing with crappy 8bit visuals just takes that away from them.

Regards
Lonewolf*jedi

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

Didn't read much of the posts, but after seeing GTX640 I'm going to assume that's your problem. You need a better card or you need to drop the resolution with ambient occlusion, shadows, atmospherics off until the waiting for gpu line is 0 or close to.

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

If you had you wouldn't of wasted your time writing that post. The gpu is a 2gb card, How is that at fault? At least put some effort into explaining why.

LW

DC_Darkling · June 2013

Basicly the gt models are the lesser versions then the gtx.. but ghostree3 didnt read and was talking about gtx. hhehe. Silly ghost.
While he is correct in saying the card will not be strong enought for maximum graphics..(especially occlusion), you should be well able to play above minimum resolution.

Hence my original conclusion that something was wrong.

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

Lol? You think the amount of gb of ram the card has really means shit? All that does is stop the game freezing (well almost all) and that can be avoided with texture streaming. While useful, the amount of memory the card has is probably the least important part. Don't try and put me down when you don't know what you're talking about. As to explaining why, the 40 series is fucking low and really aren't gaming cards. Checking up on it, it's not even part of the GTX series, it's just a GT. That card would have problems running quake at max fps (ok maybe not that bad).

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

Sometimes the most useful way to get a response and information out of people is to get them angry..

Thanks for explaining, It would be obvious to someone who is somewhat informed (ghosthree3) that I do not know Because 'IF' I had I wouldn't be here wasting my time now would I?

It actually plays all my other steam games very well on max settings, So for my purposes, prior to getting ns2, it worked very well for the price I payed.

And again, you mostly wasting your time, other than the explanation, because your obviously did not read, as you have previously stated, the context (information) of the this thread, In tern you are only adding to your already miss interpreted understanding, based on the fact that one would understand if one would have read correctly, the contents of you this thread.

While I Appreciate the help, It is Helpful, I would rather not be sworn at. Your anger is obviously miss directed because your pride was hurt when someone pointed out that you had not read the posts, which again you have previously stated, which is a basic human response to preserve ones ego and to try, failing miserably mind you, to re balance the somewhat but mostly self conceptualized view of self and the concepts that other have of you.

I apologize if this hurts you, but its the truth, simple psychology. You could say I was actually being kind rather than point out all your short coming, your lack of reading the thread and its contents, in point form to then damage what ever precious yet completely useless and false perception of self.

Yes, I was being kind. Eat that humble pie friend.

LW

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

I hate to keep this going but, why would my pride be hurt at someone pointing out I hadn't read the posts when in my first post I said I hadn't read them?

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

DC_Darkling wrote: »

new does not mean broken. (actually it means if it is the card, go complain for warranty.

* You could remove your graphics driver completely and then install a older version which 'worked'.
* you could reinstall windows. (Doubt its needed, but it still is a test.
* you could open a support ticket with nvidia.
* id go complain for warranty if option 1 doesnt help to be honest. Green dotted lines in random spots? Sounds very bad. Heat issue perhaps? Or drivers.

I have no rolled back to 311.06
As before The fps on main menu dose not change And I'm unable to enter any maps for reasons, However There seems to be no loading on the GPU now. I will continue to try and enter a server and get some real data.

Regards

Lonewolf*jedi

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

While it had dramatically reduced the load on the gpu mind and late game it still hovers around 9-10ms and spikes to 25ms. The fps fluctuated quite alot, 30-90 fps. In close combat with multiple person(s) (aliens and marines) it was still unplayable.

In my midnight haze I completely forgot that it was Saturday... So I will be going to the shop tomorrow lol >.<

Out of interest what is a good mid ranged gpu that will give me a stable fps late game? If this card is faulty I might push and get a refund and spend a few extra $$ to get something better.

Regards
Lonewolf*jedi

Ironsoul · June 2013

Try lowering your resolution, those lower end cards have issues with memory bandwidth (you may have 2GB but the time it takes getting stuff in and out to the gpu itself holds things up). You need memory bandwidth to push pixels to the screen.

I'd recommend 1440x900 for your monitor as it's still in the same aspect ratio.

This game really is an ass when it comes to performance too, not only does it get lower fps than most games, the time it takes to render each frame fluctuates like crazy, making the fps required worse.

Here's a short explanation, there's 1000 milli seconds in 1 second. A game running at 60fps should have a render time of 16.6ms (1000 / 60 = 16.6). But because of how graphics cards are, and how game engines are, this often fluctuates.

Why this is bad is because you could end up with frames being rendered super quick, then a large delay, then super quick again. Look at this graphic for an example, each line represents a fully rendered frame, horizontal is time.

The big gaps in between is where no new image is being shown to you, so it sits still. This results in a jerky looking game. If most of the frames being rendered take over 30ms to render, the image will look like it's running at 30fps or lower regardless of what fps the game thinks it's getting.

This is why some people have a game running at 40fps, another game running at 80fps, yet the 40fps game "feels" smoother, because it is, if the 40fps game is running bang on 25ms per frame, yet the 80fps game is at 30ms, the 40fps game is rendering better.

Enough technical babble, the graphics card you're using is deifnitely going to cause issues in Natural Selection 2. I don't recommend upgrading just for NS2 though, if you can't get it running at an enjoyable rate, just drop the game.

However, the recent build 249 improved NS2's performance quite a bit, so be sure to keep coming back to check to see whether the game has improved or not every time they release an update.

ABOUT A RECOMMENDED GRAPHICS CARD

Okay, this is a really complex topic because there's a lot of misconceptions about required hardware.

I would personally recommend getting an AMD 7770. If you're lucky you'll also get a free copy of Far Cry 3 with it due to the Never Settle Bundle, The cheapest I've seen a 7770 is $109 in Australia.

If you want an Nvidia Card, I recommend the GTX 650 or 650 Ti.

Otherwise in the midder/high end I'd recommend a 2GB 7850(1GB if it's $30 cheaper than 2GB) or a GTX 660 (non Ti).

anything better than that won't give you a significant improvement at the resolution you play at.

IronHorse · June 2013

I agree with @ironsoul regarding getting a AMD 7770 , just bought one last week for the wife's rig, spent $90 on it, and its honestly the best bang for your buck.
I dont agree with what he said in regards to FPS timings.. 2 patches ago resolved that issue for the most part, imo.
If price is no object: 680 gtx

Do not do dual GPU setups unless you dont notice subtleties like micro stuttering or tearing or input delays. This goes for most games, btw.

@dc_darkling : don't worry that d3d error is typical when alt tabbing or pop ups or the video driver reseting etc.
@ghosthree3 : "Chiiiiilllllll Winnnsttoonnnnnnn"

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

I'd go 780 or titan if money was no issue :P

Or maybe a 770.

Obraxis · June 2013

Best value on the Nvidia range right now is the 660Ti. Doesnt really matter GB-wise, as you're interested in pure speed. Your GPU is holding back your system a lot, and you'll start to see this in upcoming games.

You can either wait for NS2's other renderers like OpenGL and DX11 to come online and se if that helps you, or preferable, get a faster GFX card. The 640 is less than mid-range and good for Wow, and most other new games at low-to-medium settings.

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

Changing the resolution increased the fps to 51 at main menu.
late game fps is better but As stated I think this is all I can expect from this card.

Thanks for your help guys.

regards

Lonewolf*jedi

DC_Darkling · June 2013

@ironhorse
In my book a resetting gpu driver IS a issue. hehehe.

Im lately more into nvidia. Switched from amd over. Nvidia has more stable drivers the last years in my experience.
As for getting a new card.. It is always best to check on review sites who review a gazilion cards on a lot of games.

The difference inbetween a 550 and a 650, or a 570 and a 670 isnt as huge as you may think. Ive seen bigger differences inbetween x50 and x60 or x70 (submodel part).
experience may strongly vary.

IronHorse · June 2013

@dc_darkling : It's pretty much black magic and nearly un avoidable. So much so, every UE3 engine driven game checks whether its stopped *every single frame * so as long as everything recovers, those messages are harmless ;-)

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

I ended going with the xfx radeon hd 7850 black edition.

100fps on main menu, everything maxed out. late game fps only drops down to ~40fps which is playable. average fps is around 80 or so and max is 180 fps.

Thanks everyone for your help. greatly appreciated.

Locklear · June 2013

40 playable? Not in NS2 :>

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

40 fps AT a dip. sorry, should have written that more clearly.

lw

ultranewb · June 2013

lonewolf_jedi wrote: »

I ended going with the xfx radeon hd 7850 black edition.

100fps on main menu, everything maxed out. late game fps only drops down to ~40fps which is playable. average fps is around 80 or so and max is 180 fps.

Thanks everyone for your help. greatly appreciated.

For reference: I'm playing with the same CPU (in "Turbo Mode") and a GTX550 ti and I get the same FPS you're getting now. You should be getting better FPS with that card.

DC_Darkling · June 2013

@ultranewb
depends also on being cpu or gpu capped.

ultranewb · June 2013

DC_Darkling wrote: »

@ultranewb
depends also on being cpu or gpu capped.

Nope. We've the same CPU and GPU waiting time is actually a factor in the newer build. His new card should perform better than mine. His GPU should not take the same amount of time that mine is.

Pretend the difference is only 2ms between our cards. My system at 60FPS would equate to 68FPS on his system (and 100 vs 125). The performance stats on his card are way more than a factor of twice the stats of my card. 2ms is being conservative.

My original assumption is that he's running a 3.8 ghz and not 4.2 ghz, since this is the default "non-turbo" speed. It's a very safe assumption.

lonewolf_jedi · June 2013

3.5ghz standard yes. When I have some more money I will be an aftermarket fan for cpu, then I might think about upping it.

Lw

Low fps, please help! (solved) inadequate GPU:gt 640

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