bad servers must go
mushookees
Join Date: 2008-03-26 Member: 63967Members
Join Date: 2008-03-26 Member: 63967Members
There are a few servers out there that cant handle the amount of slots they are set up as. The server rate plummets after too many people join, and people who play on these servers suffer horrendous performance.
You cant expect people to know what server rate is, the majority of people assume ping is the deciding factor in game performance, so when they play on these servers and have a nice low ping, they blame the performance problems on the game itself rather than the server. I write this thread after playing on one of these servers and being utterly dumbstruck that other players didn't realize they could have a better experience on another server.
So i ask a question to UWE, why are you allowing server clients to run slots their CPU's simply cant handle ? Isnt it a simple matter detect CPU speed with the server client and then add a Recommended slot count for that CPU and give a warning for (or simply not allow) higher slot counts ?
I know the majority of server admins know what they are doing, but obviously there are some out there who dont.
You cant expect people to know what server rate is, the majority of people assume ping is the deciding factor in game performance, so when they play on these servers and have a nice low ping, they blame the performance problems on the game itself rather than the server. I write this thread after playing on one of these servers and being utterly dumbstruck that other players didn't realize they could have a better experience on another server.
So i ask a question to UWE, why are you allowing server clients to run slots their CPU's simply cant handle ? Isnt it a simple matter detect CPU speed with the server client and then add a Recommended slot count for that CPU and give a warning for (or simply not allow) higher slot counts ?
I know the majority of server admins know what they are doing, but obviously there are some out there who dont.
Comments
Theres so many bad servers out there and there will be plenty of ignorant new players at release to fill them up. Dont forget that the first impression of the game is very important and you want to make sure that something so stupid as a slow server, does not ruin this first experience.
You cant expect people to know what server rate is, the majority of people assume ping is the deciding factor in game performance, so when they play on these servers and have a nice low ping, they blame the performance problems on the game itself rather than the server. I write this thread after playing on one of these servers and being utterly dumbstruck that other players didn't realize they could have a better experience on another server.
So i ask a question to UWE, why are you allowing server clients to run slots their CPU's simply cant handle ? Isnt it a simple matter detect CPU speed with the server client and then add a Recommended slot count for that CPU and give a warning for (or simply not allow) higher slot counts ?
I know the majority of server admins know what they are doing, but obviously there are some out there who dont.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
this
my question is why do people continuously fill up these bad servers. as soon as you join you know the server is bad when you move an inch in the RR and its delay like youre on dialup, but the server is 20/20? why people why? lol
The problem isn't that there are a lot of "bad servers", the problem is that the hardware requirements for this game are insane at the moment. Hopefully UWE will be able to do something about that before launch; if not, it's going to be a very rocky launch, potentially even disastrous.
Hypernia servers in australia are $23 per/month for 16 players. They can handle 30 tickets all the way up to super end game where they hover between 20-25.
An indicator for inadequate server performance is really needed for the reasons stated in this and other threads. Preferably in the server browser.
Also, server hardware requirements need to go down a lot. Having to have a top notch, over-clocked FPS gaming monster PC as a dedicated server is ridiculous.
Here's how you know a server has bad performance; you join it and find out.
Here's how you know a server has bad performance; you join it and find out.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What is this rubbish? How is an indicator for bad server performance like preventing people from playing the game? Troll much?
Most of us don't want to be tricked into lag fests hosted on someone's grandma's 486 and most of us don't wish a similar fate on new players either. It takes time to find a good server to play on, if all your regular servers are full. You can join and find out tick rate 10-15 servers all day for all I care, but most players don't want that completely unnecessary hassle.
Here's how you know a server has bad performance; you join it and find out.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
New players will not understand the effects that a bad server can have on the game, nor have the experience to know that there are better ones out there. If they're unlucky and their first experience or two is plagued with lagginess they might assume their computer isn't good enough and just stop playing.
*Or servers that keep running the same map (staying online too long) and grind down to a halt, because NS2 servers currently require a fresh map loading or a restart to get back to smooth performance...
^ THIS!
New players just don't know that the server tick rate is important. They also don't come to the forums to read you trolling them, Imbalanxed. They try this game out, experiencing rubber-banding and shutting down the game. End of the story. I bet, bad servers are the cause of the majority of beta-players that aren't playing anymore. And this problem will kill NS2 at release.
The solutions are named in this thread. Show a warning to every player that connects to a server that can't handle the tick rate in the end-game, that this server isn't fast enough and may cause bad performance while playing. This is very important. Maybe even a 5-star rating system in the server browser calculated with the average tick rate of this server.
Though UWE still has a lot of work left in regards to simply pumping up server performance as well.
That aside, a tick rate section in the server browser would be useful. However, that assumes that the "new player" would understand the tick rate metric, which a few of the above posts seem to doubt. Perhaps a scaled server quality rating (perhaps a normalized 0->1 rating).
PS [Any "you" statements in here are purely addressed to "you all", no particulars, no flaming]: I find it incredibly rude to say that the servers are "bad" and should be discouraged. The people who run the "bad" servers are trying to contribute to the community. They pay for a service and pass that on to you, free of charge (barring paying for the game itself). If you are so very concerned about the experience of new players, please feel free to provide us all with one of the "good servers".
I think you hit the nail on the head there Silent262, I dont know of any other game atm that has quite as drastic server requirements as ns2 has. If NS2's performance was up to scratch I imagine the majority of these "bad servers" would run the game with minimal issues.
of the servers on the go atm I suspect very few of these can cope with ns2 as it is at present, thankfully mine is one of the few :)
Until the game can run on standard game server hardware the game it should not be released as this will be severly detremental to the games launch as most server admins dont even bother doing research into ns2's server requirements before setting up a server and thus I expect to see the server browser flooded with yet more piss poor ns2 servers.
Now sure you can have a program directly test a system's hardware, and make a decision based on that and that would be an option. But to do that you need a baseline and I don't recall seeing a server minimum requirements list anywhere. On top of that if you look into the actual server wiki, you'll find that NS2 doesn't take advantage of multiple cores, which is a HUGE disadvantage. Basically that takes every advantage from an i7 and flushes it down the toilet. If you look at the All-In servers which play quite well, you'll noticed they're overclocked to around 4.4ghz which is a good jump, not ground breaking by any means, but it's reasonable. And that's only neccessary because only one of the 4 cores and 8 threads is actually being used.
So if anything, it's the optimization for the game that is what needs to be corrected not a band-aid that causes more problems without solving the root cause.
dumbstruck that other players didn't realize they could have a better experience on another server.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So glad this was brought up. There are plenty of servers out there that always have people playing, that I get low pings to, but I can't play on because of severe rubberbanding. I had always thought it was my connection since no one else seemed to mind.
We at least need a "favorites" or "blacklist" category on the server menu so we can avoid these servers. I don't think it's UWE's job to moderate individual servers. Server owners can do what the want, but people need to know that there are better servers out there, offering a mostly lag-free experience.
We at least need a "favorites" or "blacklist" category on the server menu so we can avoid these servers. I don't think it's UWE's job to moderate individual servers. Server owners can do what the want, but people need to know that there are better servers out there, offering a mostly lag-free experience.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1 to favorit server on your serverlist :D
my question is why do people continuously fill up these bad servers. as soon as you join you know the server is bad when you move an inch in the RR and its delay like youre on dialup, but the server is 20/20? why people why? lol<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've actually noticed that the ready room is often laggy until you join a team. Maybe the server gives lower priority to players in the ready room.
That aside, a tick rate section in the server browser would be useful. However, that assumes that the "new player" would understand the tick rate metric, which a few of the above posts seem to doubt. Perhaps a scaled server quality rating (perhaps a normalized 0->1 rating).
PS [Any "you" statements in here are purely addressed to "you all", no particulars, no flaming]: I find it incredibly rude to say that the servers are "bad" and should be discouraged. The people who run the "bad" servers are trying to contribute to the community. They pay for a service and pass that on to you, free of charge (barring paying for the game itself). If you are so very concerned about the experience of new players, please feel free to provide us all with one of the "good servers".<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nobody is denying that the dedicated server needs better performance. But servers that can't handle 24+ people shouldn't have that many player slots, simple as that. And if they do then people should know not to play there because the game isn't going to be fun.
The limit is currently 24, if you set it higher, it will snap back to 24 when it initializes. However, if you start a server from within the game, it does not have this limit.
Most of us don't want to be tricked into lag fests hosted on someone's grandma's 486 and most of us don't wish a similar fate on new players either. It takes time to find a good server to play on, if all your regular servers are full. You can join and find out tick rate 10-15 servers all day for all I care, but most players don't want that completely unnecessary hassle.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This thread is not about an indicator for bad server performance. That was your suggestion. Stop being so self centered.
The problem isn't that there are a lot of "bad servers", the problem is that the hardware requirements for this game are insane at the moment. Hopefully UWE will be able to do something about that before launch; if not, it's going to be a very rocky launch, potentially even disastrous.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agree 100%, and I'm really glad people seem to making a fuss about now it now. Requiring a 3rd gen i5/i7 overclocked to 4.4ghz just to run a 24 player NS2 server is on the ridiculous side.
However, I'm sure they're doing whatever they can to get that sorted out.
Yeah, about that. We are providing one of the "good servers", Cold-blooded Gorges server. It's running on 4,5 GHz i5 2500k. Oh, and yes, I'd much rather not have the completely unplayable servers on my server browser list. They're tricking both old and new players, and the limits of the server browser are making the issue worse.
PS. The server is going empty most of the time though. Seems to fill up rarely, since we are not making deliberate efforts to AFK on the server just to seed new players. Combat mod seems to fill the server up though, but that mod could run on much lower-end hardware, so the server power is kinda going to the dogs here ;)