<!--quoteo(post=1941183:date=Jun 3 2012, 03:34 AM:name=Ulmont)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ulmont @ Jun 3 2012, 03:34 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1941183"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->New custom skin for the marines. I decided to combine the two color schemes for WWII's eastern front (tan & olive drab), and then realized that I'd somehow created the marine from aliens in the process...
While the outfits are sweet looking and it's always good to see people taking liberty with mods, I do have one discussion question to ask: Is editing models cheating? If yes, when does it become too much? Is the orange HL2 suit acceptable, but a bright pink skulk cheating?
Think about how much easier it would be to shoot a skulk that was neon pink compared to blackishgrey that blends in with the shadows.
I'm curious on the community opinion on this. To me, it seems like editing models is cheating.
If model/skin editing is going to be allowed then they need to be server side mods so that everyone playing on that server has the same game experience. I don't think you should be able to edit models client-side. Same goes for the alien vision and other game-play impacting mods IMO.
While I don't like the idea of people doing that, I don't know of a truly reliable way of making sure they don't. I'm sure exploitative textures can be made to appear legit to the server check.
<!--quoteo(post=1941400:date=Jun 4 2012, 09:37 AM:name=Arkanti)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Arkanti @ Jun 4 2012, 09:37 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1941400"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->While I don't like the idea of people doing that, I don't know of a truly reliable way of making sure they don't. I'm sure exploitative textures can be made to appear legit to the server check.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There is never any reliable way of preventing cheats or hacks on servers, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be discouraged in every way possible.
UlmontJoin Date: 2011-10-02Member: 125211Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
A word on cheating: Bleah. I'll respond to this as soon as I can (I want to, believe me, its just that I don't have the time at the moment to do the full response that I'd like [with pictures and possibly video]).
I decided to paint out the TSF lettering and replace the shoulder's lettering with the present-day mongolian flag (as many modern-day military forces have their country's flag on the bicep of their uniforms - the Mongols being one example).
ScardyBobScardyBobJoin Date: 2009-11-25Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
<!--quoteo(post=1941394:date=Jun 4 2012, 05:56 AM:name=rantology)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rantology @ Jun 4 2012, 05:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1941394"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If model/skin editing is going to be allowed then they need to be server side mods so that everyone playing on that server has the same game experience. I don't think you should be able to edit models client-side. Same goes for the alien vision and other game-play impacting mods IMO.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> One way to do it maybe to only allow steamworks published mods on the servers. While the default could be set to allow all mods that submit, people could report mods for being cheats/exploits and have them delisted.
<!--quoteo(post=1942663:date=Jun 11 2012, 07:55 AM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ Jun 11 2012, 07:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1942663"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->One way to do it maybe to only allow steamworks published mods on the servers. While the default could be set to allow all mods that submit, people could report mods for being cheats/exploits and have them delisted.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I like this, only allowing "official" workshop-mods when the server has consistency "1". And all mods are available when it's off.
ArcL!ghtJoin Date: 2007-11-27Member: 63031Members, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester
If you look what Tripwire did for Killing Floor... there was also ALOT of maps coming out and some were not balanced and served only to level your stats (game is coop survival horror). I played it myself much and those type of maps made me sad.
Tripwire came with idea to "Whitelist" mods and maps so stats only progress when map\mod is whitelisted.
That way you could get a lot of custom stuff out, but not to worry if it's a cheat or not.
Here in NS2 you could just make server/client different like Insight mod does now and person will not be able to connect to server with that set of custom skins which are not approved as of yet.
I think those kind of consistency checks are going to be mandatory as the game releases to combat amateur hacking like modifying sound files or model files. I hope something like that is included because that would definitely fix my issue with model editing.
As to server/client differences, editting your models currently doesn't do that. Only some files will cause a server/client difference error. I have rudimentary programming knowledge, but I know you can edit sound files, cinematic files, model files, and many of the client based LUA stuff for significant gameplay advantages without causing a server/client error. I hope these things are addressed with security checks for 1.0.
UlmontJoin Date: 2011-10-02Member: 125211Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
edited June 2012
I figured that I should probably explain why I haven't put up (or finished the WIP, for that matter) any new Skins this past week. 'See, I've been at my parent's house, and will be until Sunday. Unfortunately, this means that I have no method of uploading ANYTHING (upload speed of 50kb/sec here) until I get back on campus. I have still been working on custom skins, however. Currently I'm creating a pack of custom skins that add Country support to the Marines (standard & specops). Basically, I'm changing the coloring, adding a shoulder-flag, possibly adding camouflage or other patters, and doing some minor tweaking to the texture to make the marines look like they're part of certain countries militaries (who all incidentally purchase Alterra Corp. Armor and Armaments).
Countries that I will be doing (in no particular order):
Mongolia (See top of page) Sweden United Kingdom (Britain) France Germany China Brazil Canada United States Russia Spain Italy Poland Egypt Japan Finland Norway Denmark Korea (Unified - I figure they'd have settled that issue by the time the game takes place Uzbekistan
^ Want a country added to the list? Let me know.
I'll also be putting out a couple of custom faces with this pack.
Currently include: Beard guy (Freeman-esque goatee) Burn victim (Mild-burn scar on right cheek, full beard partially burnt away) Scar guy (classic military scar guy) Dirt guy (caked with dirt)
^ Probably will be more.
I should point out that all this PROBABLY WON'T be done by Sunday when I get back. Despite technically being on vacation, I can't work on them full-time; annoying things like sleeping and maintenance are eating up most of my days, currently. We'll see though.
I'll also release First-Person arms for the specops skin (standalone replacer, not integrated with the game, sorry; tried and failed to get the code to work, in part because I don't have the specops skin to test it on, and in part because I'm lousy at coding).
Unknown Worlds, this part's directed towards you: Could one of you tell me which countries sustain a military at the time of the game (assuming that you've already thought this out - if ya'll haven't, I'll just make an educated guess to the state of the world as of the game), so I can make this as canonical as possible? I'm trying to harken back to Colonial & Precolonial color schemes for the skins, while sometimes keeping modern-colors and/or national colors reflected in the armor. (British Redcoats, American Olive Drab). I would really, really appreciate some feedback on this part, as I'm trying to make the skins distinguishable from each-other, while reflecting the changes that would have occurred over time since the present day.
<!--quoteo(post=1941394:date=Jun 4 2012, 07:56 AM:name=rantology)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rantology @ Jun 4 2012, 07:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1941394"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If model/skin editing is going to be allowed then they need to be server side mods so that everyone playing on that server has the same game experience. I don't think you should be able to edit models client-side. Same goes for the alien vision and other game-play impacting mods IMO.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I agree, It's similar to cheating with "CHAMS" due to the player using the models see bright pink armor which stands out. This defeats the purpose of camo, And yes I know marines really don't have camo. However their suit is not easily noticed in dark places. Say I create my own skin for aliens, Each one has a bright red for their hitbox areas, Would you consider this fair ? Same goes for aliens, Especially skulks, Jumping around biting a marine would be more effective being able to see red on the suit where they know a hit will register.
UlmontJoin Date: 2011-10-02Member: 125211Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
edited July 2012
'Been away for a while. Made a quick Video-preview of one of the skins I've been working on (Brazil - Regular & Specops). Recommend you run in in fullscreen 1080p.
Comments
<img src="http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/2583/aliensmarine.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
^
Viewer View
<img src="http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/2305/alinesmarinefppreview.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
^
First Person View View (Diffuse)
<a href="http://www.mediafire.com/?brmdlb72smuyxu8" target="_blank">Download Here</a><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually uve not made Aliens marrines more like Imperial Guard with that colour scheme xD
<img src="http://media.moddb.com/cache/images/groups/1/4/3784/thumb_620x2000/393946-imperial_guard.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Although how can you get these skins to replace the pre-order bonus Black armor as well?
Edit: while carrying certain weapons (flamer example)
Think about how much easier it would be to shoot a skulk that was neon pink compared to blackishgrey that blends in with the shadows.
I'm curious on the community opinion on this. To me, it seems like editing models is cheating.
There is never any reliable way of preventing cheats or hacks on servers, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be discouraged in every way possible.
I did, however, find time to get this out:
Mongolian Infantryman
<img src="http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/9812/mongolian.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
^
Viewer View (Diffuse)
I decided to paint out the TSF lettering and replace the shoulder's lettering with the present-day mongolian flag (as many modern-day military forces have their country's flag on the bicep of their uniforms - the Mongols being one example).
<img src="http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/6185/mongolflag.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
^
Flag (Diffuse)
No DL link yet, as my time evaporated before I could do the First-person arms (grrr). I'll try to get those (and the DL) up by the end of today.
One way to do it maybe to only allow steamworks published mods on the servers. While the default could be set to allow all mods that submit, people could report mods for being cheats/exploits and have them delisted.
I like this, only allowing "official" workshop-mods when the server has consistency "1". And all mods are available when it's off.
Tripwire came with idea to "Whitelist" mods and maps so stats only progress when map\mod is whitelisted.
That way you could get a lot of custom stuff out, but not to worry if it's a cheat or not.
Here in NS2 you could just make server/client different like Insight mod does now and person will not be able to connect to server with that set of custom skins which are not approved as of yet.
As to server/client differences, editting your models currently doesn't do that. Only some files will cause a server/client difference error. I have rudimentary programming knowledge, but I know you can edit sound files, cinematic files, model files, and many of the client based LUA stuff for significant gameplay advantages without causing a server/client error. I hope these things are addressed with security checks for 1.0.
Countries that I will be doing (in no particular order):
Mongolia (See top of page)
Sweden
United Kingdom (Britain)
France
Germany
China
Brazil
Canada
United States
Russia
Spain
Italy
Poland
Egypt
Japan
Finland
Norway
Denmark
Korea (Unified - I figure they'd have settled that issue by the time the game takes place
Uzbekistan
^
Want a country added to the list? Let me know.
I'll also be putting out a couple of custom faces with this pack.
Currently include:
Beard guy (Freeman-esque goatee)
Burn victim (Mild-burn scar on right cheek, full beard partially burnt away)
Scar guy (classic military scar guy)
Dirt guy (caked with dirt)
^
Probably will be more.
I should point out that all this PROBABLY WON'T be done by Sunday when I get back. Despite technically being on vacation, I can't work on them full-time; annoying things like sleeping and maintenance are eating up most of my days, currently. We'll see though.
I'll also release First-Person arms for the specops skin (standalone replacer, not integrated with the game, sorry; tried and failed to get the code to work, in part because I don't have the specops skin to test it on, and in part because I'm lousy at coding).
Unknown Worlds, this part's directed towards you: Could one of you tell me which countries sustain a military at the time of the game (assuming that you've already thought this out - if ya'll haven't, I'll just make an educated guess to the state of the world as of the game), so I can make this as canonical as possible? I'm trying to harken back to Colonial & Precolonial color schemes for the skins, while sometimes keeping modern-colors and/or national colors reflected in the armor. (British Redcoats, American Olive Drab). I would really, really appreciate some feedback on this part, as I'm trying to make the skins distinguishable from each-other, while reflecting the changes that would have occurred over time since the present day.
I agree, It's similar to cheating with "CHAMS" due to the player using the models see bright pink armor which stands out. This defeats the purpose of camo, And yes I know marines really don't have camo. However their suit is not easily noticed in dark places. Say I create my own skin for aliens, Each one has a bright red for their hitbox areas, Would you consider this fair ? Same goes for aliens, Especially skulks, Jumping around biting a marine would be more effective being able to see red on the suit where they know a hit will register.
<img src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-z4krO5brAdA/Ta9U7t2xt2I/AAAAAAAAAFU/BEsV4QaL5HI/s1600/me-gusta.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<center><object width="450" height="356"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/1fxzTODqmQs"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/1fxzTODqmQs" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="356"></embed></object></center>
<img src="http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/2610/ns22012090716570613.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
First-person arms for SpecOps marine.
<a href="http://www.gamefront.com/files/22225275/hands_black.zip" target="_blank">Download</a>