My VERY important thoughts when release occurs

JaMrulezassJaMrulezass Join Date: 2010-04-10 Member: 71296Members, WC 2013 - Silver
I'm just trying to give my 2 cents as a customer.

Just now, I checked out the TDU2 review, I've been ultra pumped for the game yet it appears that bugs and glitches are KILLING THE game.They gave it a 5.5. I'm sure Atari/Eden Games will fix it but the point is, as much as I want NS2 to come out ASAP,

I COMPLETELY DO NOT support rushing a game out early, just to satisfy the fans. Because as a fan, I want the game to suceed and there have been talks by the devs to add features post 1.0 but I really don't think its a good idea. I think there is a general feeling that the devs want to push this game out asap, but who can blame them? Thier doing a great job but they get flamed by the community so much.

I think that from an indie developer point of view, you need MAXIMUM POSITIVE exposure. I've wanted to go advertise on sites like BF2s and some sporting forums I go onto but I want people's first impression to be very positive, cuz most people don't understand that its a BETA whilst I think our community really does.

Hence, you guys need a GOOD review score. Something like 5's and 6's on IGN and GAMESPOT have, I believe, severely damaged TDU2s sales etc.
If say for example, you release the game in a buggy state (a 6 score for example) but you patch it one week later, it'll be too late. Reviews will be out and it will hurt the game DRASTICALLY.

Bottom line, dont rush! We love you! and we want the game to suceed!

Maybe I'm wrong, just a thought after reading the TDU 2 reviews.

Comments

  • playerplayer Join Date: 2010-09-12 Member: 73982Members
    Unfortunatly UWE does not have an endless supply of money (like say Valve & Blizzard), so at some point a widespread release is in order to generate new funding. You can only hope for that moment to be as far away as possible (for the sake of feature-completeness and polishing).
  • DarksterDarkster Join Date: 2010-02-17 Member: 70612Members, Reinforced - Gold
    Do you mind linking to the review? I've been playing TDU2 single player relatively bug-free, but multiplayer is pretty bad.
  • RollenRollen Join Date: 2010-12-20 Member: 75800Members
    Really hope they get a lot of the perfomance issues fixed me and my guild bought copies ( about 6 of us ) and we really love the concept of the game. But it's hard to play it and test it when the game stutters, lags, drops in fps and just doesn't respond more then half the time. We've been avoiding playing the game because we just can't play it properly.

    And it's a shame because it is a game with great potential and my friends were instantly sold on it when I explained it to them and how I used to play NS1. But now some of them are regretting the purchase which is just heart breaking :(.
  • JaMrulezassJaMrulezass Join Date: 2010-04-10 Member: 71296Members, WC 2013 - Silver
    <!--quoteo(post=1832752:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:11 PM:name=Darkster)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Darkster @ Feb 17 2011, 02:11 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832752"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Do you mind linking to the review? I've been playing TDU2 single player relatively bug-free, but multiplayer is pretty bad.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    <a href="http://ps3.ign.com/objects/018/018326.html" target="_blank">http://ps3.ign.com/objects/018/018326.html</a>

    <a href="http://asia.gamespot.com/pc/driving/testdriveunlimited2/index.html" target="_blank">http://asia.gamespot.com/pc/driving/testdr...ted2/index.html</a>
  • SnougarSnougar Join Date: 2007-12-31 Member: 63301Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832752:date=Feb 17 2011, 06:11 AM:name=Darkster)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Darkster @ Feb 17 2011, 06:11 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832752"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've been playing TDU2 single player relatively bug-free, but multiplayer is pretty bad.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Same, Tho I am not a huge fan of the handling or controller support :V


    I think we will all be amazed how quickly NS2 will start to feel polished as it nears any sort of release deadline and all major features are in.
  • sheena_yanaisheena_yanai Join Date: 2002-12-23 Member: 11426Members
    its impossible anyways to release bugfree games, they just can be "relative bug free" . and you can just polish a game just to a certain degree, otherwise it will be never done, you have to push it out at some point, and see if new issues show up, if some will still remain, and get get in some more money to fund the fixing of this stuff and add new features later, which will be bugged again to a certain degree after release despite testing and fixing and polishing. theres always some issue with a small percentage of players running exotic combinations of hardware components, outdated hardware and other ridiculous stuff you cant even replicate because they are one case scenarios based on operating system/driver glitches/hardware faults.
  • ZenoZeno Join Date: 2007-09-05 Member: 62183Members
    edited February 2011
    I wouldn't count on ign and gamespot since these aren't respectable sites. One of them fired a reviewer because he rated a game too low (they actually had a contract with the publisher or something) -> google it. And the other one isn't any better. Reviews are worth nothing anyway but i would rather look for another, more legitimate site for that. RPS maybe? Or better just listen to other gamers' opinions (as long as they are pc-only players and over 18 ofc)

    edit: oh the topic.... yeah, err ... what player said. + we already have the game (in a "bugged" state) the 1.0 will me more of a transition (for me) than a "release".
  • mokkatmokkat Join Date: 2009-08-30 Member: 68652Members
    On one hand I wouldn't want a rushed release for exactly the reasons listed in this thread. On the other hand, Natural Selection 2 has a reputation from the popularity of its predecessor, and is a very unique game compared to "racinggame 193" - I bet that if UWE had to release early because of financial pressure, then the community would support it, newcomers would be too intrigued to not get it, and gaming sites would give it a large amount of goodwill and room for improvement (indie game after all) in their reviews
  • DarksterDarkster Join Date: 2010-02-17 Member: 70612Members, Reinforced - Gold
    edited February 2011
    <!--quoteo(post=1832756:date=Feb 17 2011, 01:52 AM:name=JaMrulezass)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JaMrulezass @ Feb 17 2011, 01:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832756"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><a href="http://ps3.ign.com/objects/018/018326.html" target="_blank">http://ps3.ign.com/objects/018/018326.html</a>

    <a href="http://asia.gamespot.com/pc/driving/testdriveunlimited2/index.html" target="_blank">http://asia.gamespot.com/pc/driving/testdr...ted2/index.html</a><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Yeah they hit a lot of the problems that I've run across as well. We'll have to see if a patch comes out soon that addresses a lot of them.


    Although honestly I don't see NS2 getting anywhere close to being this unpolished at release.. Just look at the recent patch delay they've done to fix bugs. It seems like they're not interested in rushing the process.
  • NeoSniperNeoSniper Join Date: 2005-06-02 Member: 52976Members
    Given limited time to release the 1.0 version, I think it's BETTER to leave some features for later and shift focus on fixing bugs and improving performance.

    The important point is that the 1.0 features need to be enough so that the game feels complete, and the remaining features are well advertised as later additions much like the updates valve does for TF2 and the L4D games. A great example is maps, which is why NS2 is shipping with a few maps and the promise to release more in the future.
  • JaMrulezassJaMrulezass Join Date: 2010-04-10 Member: 71296Members, WC 2013 - Silver
    <!--quoteo(post=1832839:date=Feb 17 2011, 09:10 PM:name=Zeno)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zeno @ Feb 17 2011, 09:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832839"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I wouldn't count on ign and gamespot since these aren't respectable sites. One of them fired a reviewer because he rated a game too low (they actually had a contract with the publisher or something) -> google it. And the other one isn't any better. Reviews are worth nothing anyway but i would rather look for another, more legitimate site for that. RPS maybe? Or better just listen to other gamers' opinions (as long as they are pc-only players and over 18 ofc)

    edit: oh the topic.... yeah, err ... what player said. + we already have the game (in a "bugged" state) the 1.0 will me more of a transition (for me) than a "release".<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Me neither, but you gotta understand gamespot and ign are some serious big players where lots of casual gamers decide to buy or not to buy.

    Of coruse, me and you are not the average gamer. I take those sites with a huge grain of salt but nonetheless, they are big influences to the mass market and can possibly dictate sales in the mass markets.
  • SopsSops Join Date: 2003-07-03 Member: 17894Members, Constellation
    Rush what? Game companies rush a release because they want to start selling and have people playing their game. Anyone can buy and play NS2, the game has been released for a while now so there is nothing to rush.

    The game should be feature complete before they put the v1.0 stamp on it but it makes little difference if that happens 2 months from now or a year from now. You can start telling your friends about the game once it is stable and fun to play, it doesn't matter if the game is prefaced with a beta tag.
  • playerplayer Join Date: 2010-09-12 Member: 73982Members
    Yes it can already be bought, but for the moment NS2 is relatively obscure. I'm assuming when 1.0 arrives it'll go up on the steam-frontpage, which will generate new sales on an entirely different order than what we've seen thus far, and with that, immense scrutiny.
  • SopsSops Join Date: 2003-07-03 Member: 17894Members, Constellation
    edited February 2011
    UWE can start a media campaign whenever they feel the time is right.

    Just look at G-mail, if the product is already available to the public then the v1.0 designation is largely symbolic.
  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1832899:date=Feb 17 2011, 09:37 AM:name=NeoSniper)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoSniper @ Feb 17 2011, 09:37 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832899"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Given limited time to release the 1.0 version, I think it's BETTER to leave some features for later and shift focus on fixing bugs and improving performance.

    The important point is that the 1.0 features need to be enough so that the game feels complete, and the remaining features are well advertised as later additions much like the updates valve does for TF2 and the L4D games. A great example is maps, which is why NS2 is shipping with a few maps and the promise to release more in the future.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Except TF2 and L4D1/2 were basically feature complete upon v1.0 release. The only features they added afterwards were new maps or mutations (L4D2). Its not like they added a whole new class in TF2 as a patch.
  • mokkatmokkat Join Date: 2009-08-30 Member: 68652Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832949:date=Feb 17 2011, 09:13 PM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ Feb 17 2011, 09:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832949"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Except TF2 and L4D1/2 were basically feature complete upon v1.0 release. The only features they added afterwards were new maps or mutations (L4D2). Its not like they added a whole new class in TF2 as a patch.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I agree, I'd much rather compare that kind of situation to Tripwire Interactive's Killing Floor. Started out with 5 maps or so, which grew immensely after multiple big content patches and official community mapping contests with money prices involved.
    I really like how TWI has handled KF, and I hope UWE can use the same method of getting new customers with large free content patches advertised on the Steam frontpage.
  • ZekZek Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 7962Members, NS1 Playtester, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1832949:date=Feb 17 2011, 03:13 PM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ Feb 17 2011, 03:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832949"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Except TF2 and L4D1/2 were basically feature complete upon v1.0 release. The only features they added afterwards were new maps or mutations (L4D2). Its not like they added a whole new class in TF2 as a patch.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    A whole new class is pretty much the only thing they haven't added to TF2 yet.
  • mokkatmokkat Join Date: 2009-08-30 Member: 68652Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832952:date=Feb 17 2011, 09:21 PM:name=Zek)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zek @ Feb 17 2011, 09:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832952"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A whole new class is pretty much the only thing they haven't added to TF2 yet.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    yes, Valve has really added <b>Whole Lot Of Useful Gameplay-items</b>â„¢ to TF2 :D


    <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIafaUfkLSQ" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIafaUfkLSQ</a>
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