NS_Quantum

Pipi · March 2010

This is the map I'm making right now. The rough geometry and detailing is about done. I've already shown most of it in screenshots of bloom !

I just thought I'd make a thread for my map like everyone else. I'm not too good with stories but here's the one behind this map.

<i>Quantum is the name of one of the few very first semi-military control facilities built by the TSA in purpose of getting info on the refineries and controlling the commerce. They could request samples for analysis, for example. It has been abandoned after the crisis that the war between the Kharaa and humanity has brought.

It was laying in dust and crumbles. The TSA had no use for the low-end technology this facility has to offer nowadays until the Kharaa found nest in it. The TSA came to clean the place and there the game starts.</i>

<u>LAYOUT</u>
<img src="http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/8452/nsqlayout.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Jibrail · March 2010

a small tip when ur making ur map u have to thing strategies.
first off u got the double room closer to marines than aliens, I think double should allways be somewhere in the middle of the map or at the end of the map and have similer distance between each team to reach it.
2.I think the 2 tech points in the middle are to close to eachother and only connected by one corridor.
thats all I can come up with for now otherwise good job and good story behind it I love its name btw and Ill be looking forward for more of this.

ps you got your info wrong in the upper corner! no biggy people will get it.

Comprox · March 2010

This is a general question since I am at work and can't access the mapping documents: I believe it said they were looking more for room based combat and less hallway based combat (ala NS1)? Just something to keep in mind :)

Kouji_San · March 2010

To add to that, the hallway from west to east junction and the hallway going from data processing to fluid processing seem long... Very long actually... Add in a bendy corridor or something so we can't shoot things on the other side of the map :P

Also the north and <strike>south</strike>-east of the dual res look like dual siege points vs those techpoints...

Jimyd · March 2010

Use some common sense here people. He made a mistake on his image, the red squares are tech points, the purple dots are resource points.

You really think there would be a Double-Hive location in the middle of the map? (LOL Z!!!) =) :SIGH:

Looks good for a 16vs16 server. I say shorten up the long hallways, or add some slight bends to them to break up the LoS. Shorter is the better option.

Delphic · March 2010

I remember noticing the cross point when I saw your powergrid, but I think we should see how it plays before we go "Oh noes!", it might be lots of fun. [It might also be silly and unbalanced.]

Do MASCs require los now? I have a feeling they do (and that'd make a lot of sense pretty hard to balance something that can shoot through walls AND move - could just clear out the entire map with a well protected MASC train without even going into hive rooms *ping*), in which case the 'dual-siege' spots aren't an issue, but if not then worth thinking about.

My only real reservation is the corridoriness, whilst I don't think it'll necessarily make for bad gameplay (I loved the sprawling map style in NS1) it might impact the likelihood of this being made official, which would be a shame because we all know that your mapping looks the absolute sex.

Kouji_San · March 2010

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jimyd @ Mar 5 2010, 10:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757347"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>Use some common sense here people. He made a mistake on his image, the red squares are tech points, the purple dots are resource points.

You really think there would be a Double-Hive location in the middle of the map? (LOL Z!!!) =) :SIGH:

Looks good for a 16vs16 server. I say shorten up the long hallways, or add some slight bends to them to break up the LoS. Shorter is the better option.</div>
I think you are drawing a wrong conclusion here Jimyd :P

rammaj is obviously talking about the two red squares (techpoints) above the doubleres (pink circles) and I am talking about the same red squares (techpoints) and the one in the Tram Power room...

Thaldarin · March 2010

It looks nice but it is mainly all hallway combat.

Room based combat is what the mapping guidelines express the focus on, with enough size in those rooms to place structures. Your rooms seem tiny?

Seker · March 2010

So no more ns_bloom ? :O

Some more screenshots would be nice though ;D

Pipi · March 2010

Firstly, thanks for all comments, good or bad.
Just to clarify some things. It is made in multiple files, and subject to change according to gameplay. I haven't put a lot of detailing in case that I would completely remove a room and replace it in that case.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rammaj @ Mar 5 2010, 02:53 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757340"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>a small tip when ur making ur map u have to thing strategies.</div>

I've thought a lot about gameplay and obviously you can't judge only from that view. Again, things might change, no one knows how the game will play. Even UWE can't be sure about how to game will play, only presume and aim at some mechanics until they test it.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Comprox @ Mar 5 2010, 03:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757344"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>This is a general question since I am at work and can't access the mapping documents: I believe it said they were looking more for room based combat and less hallway based combat (ala NS1)? Just something to keep in mind :)</div>

It's true. I have to admit that I made the map in a fun purpose much more than willing it to be official at all costs. It's the first time I create a map for the FPS genre. This might not be my only map either. I've gained a lot of experience with Spark since I had none before that.

I really liked NS1 maps, and probably got influenced a lot by it. Who knows, it might play well after all in NS2. If it does not, I don't mind putting the map into garbage.

Drown · March 2010

I would note that strategically the map isn't very balanced. If team 1 starts at the top and team 2 at the bottom, team 2 has a much stronger defensive position since both the tech points on the south end of the map only have directions of attack, while both northern ones are more central and have 3 or 4 directions of attack. In terms of hallway vs room, it wouldn't be that tricky to push your rooms in, or expand them to overtake sections of hallway and meet the mapping guidelines. It looks to me a lot like an ns1 map, and I'd love to play it as is, but it doesn't meet what they are currently aiming for. Doesn't mean you shouldn't still make it the way you want though! ;)

Pipi · March 2010

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Drown @ Mar 5 2010, 09:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757518"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>I would note that strategically the map isn't very balanced. If team 1 starts at the top and team 2 at the bottom...</div>

Marine start is the pink room on the left and Alien start is the orange room on the right.

Drown · March 2010

Ahh, so turn the map 90' to the side! That does make more sense. Still, you could probably push the control room to a more central location which would remove a lot of the excess hallways. I'd change it with the crosspiece, even if you still plan for it to be only accessible from archive and data processing. The rest ofit squishes inward pretty evenly after that. Shorter halls between light green and pink would help too... lots of long straight lined halls like you have give marines a pretty heavy advantage and stray from the intended map design theory.

Kouji_San · March 2010

You still have those 2x dual siege spots though, which will keep being a concern if you keep accesible areas in between those techpoints. Changing the shape and length of the hallways would not make much difference, especially with the mobile siege cannons for NS2. And very long hallways, something that is somewhat easier to change with a bend or room to break it up :P

MrWizard · March 2010

It is hard to say how it will play out without having any actual play time on the map, but in regards to Compy's post I would say that Fluid Processing and the Maintenance room could be increased in size, lessening the hallway space. Possibly the same for Main Gen and Marine Start. That being said, Aliens would then have a fairly quicker time to getting to a second tech point than the marines and so some tweaking would possible need to be done.

Maybe even expanding Data Processing and moving it more north or more south depending on how fast things move in-game for balance issues. Also maybe consider having another hallway underneath those vents going between the Main Generators and South Atrium to lessen choke points.

Nothing all that drastic really, but it is a nice layout. I would say any changes could be made for the better [or for the worse] without being able to walk around in it. That said, I think the biggest notable thing I see is there are two passageways into Marine start whereas there are 4 if you include that vent. Thinking about that just reminds me of mass turret turtling in Eclipse start o.O

Pipi · March 2010

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Mar 6 2010, 08:13 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757627"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>You still have those 2x dual siege spots though</div>

Certainly, marines in the Crosspoint will have double, and 2 tech rooms siegeable within a few meters of distance for the MASC to travel. You might see that kind of thing happen in many map since they are going to be small and compacted, and the siege cannons can now move. The Crosspoint is a choke point too and aliens can come from anywhere and especially from the vent from Control room. We'll see.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MrWizard @ Mar 6 2010, 09:00 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757638"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>It is hard to say how it will play out without having any actual play time on the map, but in regards to Compy's post I would say that Fluid Processing and the Maintenance room could be increased in size</div>

Fluid processing is indeed small. The thing is .. when I built the map, I had this fictive balance scale in my head that, every time something was marine sided or alien sided was added on one side or the other. So, if you focus yourself on some part of my map it may seem to advantage a team too much. For example, Fluid processing is smaller and close quarters to help aliens attack it. It's packed but with enough space for structures to be built.

I'm happy with all the comments that have been made again, bad or not. I'm considering everything but I'm not going to make major changes in the map until I play it with other people because I don't know what will affect the balance of the map yet. It's probably unbalanced now and no one can build a perfectly balanced map right away but I don't want to worsen it since we don't know enough about the gameplay.

Until then, I just wanted to make a playable map, that seems balanced to me (even if it does not for some of you) so I or we can play on a different map than the one that is going to be launched with the alpha version. (I doubt there's going to be more than one map). I'm sure other mappers think the same way about it.

Thaldarin · March 2010

I think marines in your map will have more of an advantage because of those long corridor travel times to tech points. It's a theory of course, like many.

Pipi · March 2010

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin @ Mar 6 2010, 12:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757676"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>I think marines in your map will have more of an advantage because of those long corridor travel times to tech points. It's a theory of course, like many.</div>

Ya but things like, the first corridor going east from the marine start is elevated to one level up so it's not just a straight corridor. Marines have a slightly longer route to make to get to the tech points too, and they walk slower (I even consider them sprint). Aliens also have strategic vents to try to balance things.

Here's the last room I'm working on.. South Atrium. There's no prop work yet, except for outside buildings and the rods and pipes by the "windows".

<img src="http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/3043/nsq76.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Delphic · March 2010

Nggghhhh *splat*

my head just exploded.

(just in case that wasn't clear, I got damn love that last screenshot)

MrWizard · March 2010

That makes a good deal of sense actually. Honestly I've kinda forgotten about sprint! I wonder how much faster marines can get around a map with sprint now... it could change things up quite a bit.

Thaldarin · March 2010

That last area looks like one of your largest on your map from the overhead. I can see potential problems with battles including many players in your other tech points.

Don't get me wrong the level is coming along nicely and who knows it may work out well for you, although the guidelines should be listened to for overall map specifics. Especially if you have to put structures in your tech point area, allow access in and out your room and allow for a battle. It just seems to cramped.

Pipi · March 2010

This room is really huge, it could contain twice a base and have both complete teams in it fighting.

The other tech points aren't that small actually, just a little smaller and the corridors a little bigger than what the guidelines say.

I've been thinking about gameplay a lot you know, even if I'm making the map just for fun and not aiming for an official release. I'll have to wait until the guidelines are really specific and to know a Lot more about gameplay (meaning probably at least wait for the Beta).

I'll probably aim for a map that plays well on the best ratio of players too. NS1 was 32-players ready but ideally it was better in a 6vs6 or 7vs7.

A lot of things are to consider for my next map (at least I intend to make a second map for now).
As for Quantum, I'll just finish it and wait to see how it plays, but in the end it was just about getting experience with the Spark editor and making my own textures and using them, etc. The map is made in multiple files as I said before, for separated areas. I could completely replace a part of the map really easily too.

Thanks for the comments people.

Pipi · March 2010

The first corridor coming from Marine Start to the north.

<img src="http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/2323/nsq75.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

glimmerman · March 2010

I wonder how much they will pay you for your maps :D

Would you mind if i do the french thing of:

<i>el take your worke' en presente' as mi owne' zen gete' el payde'</i>

Bulletcatcher · March 2010

Holy ###### that is some good work! That must have taken along time to put together!

Cereal_KillR · March 2010

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (glimmerman @ Mar 12 2010, 02:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758976"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>Would you mind if i do the french thing of:

<i>el take your worke' en presente' as mi owne' zen gete' el payde'</i></div>

That doesn't even look french. Get rid of the apostrophes and use "le" and "mon".

This could almost be french (but it's not):
<i>Je take le worke de yourze et puis presente-le as le mon owne. Zen gete el magnifique payde. Baguette.</i>

Kouji_San · March 2010

Nah this is spark, it builds maps on its own... Seriously though, it looks good, the lighting is just awesome in that first shot. Second shot has that >Billy Bob was here< idea (as in there was life before the battle of Natural Selection)

Pipi · March 2010

Hey Glimmerman, you should take advice from Cereal_KillR.. <i>Son francÃ¨s ist bettere than le tien.</i> ;)

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Mar 12 2010, 11:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1759007"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>(as in there was life before the battle of Natural Selection)</div>

Yeah, I'm trying to make it so. Actually, the main theme of this map is a damaged facility. So there is going to be broken walls and stuff from earthquakes or whatever happened on the planet and for some reasons there is visible signs of work that was being done at a time to contain the damages. As you can see in this shot, broken walls and tools lying around, the ladder has been put there quickly by the handyman or whoever was working there before.

<img src="http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/3718/nsq79.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Thanks for the comments everyone.

Pipi · March 2010

Marine start, just need to make it a little bigger from the comments I've received. I'll move everything you see back about 2 floor tiles. Right now it's just a little bigger than the marine start of Tanith.

<img src="http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/3999/nsq80.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

SHAFTTHEGIMP · March 2010

awsome!

glimmerman · March 2010

i think the rine starts still needs a bit of work. Some textures are a bit too big on there, plus it needs some of the NS2 "fifth pillar" AKA some pizas!

NS_Quantum

Comments