Natural Selection 2 News Update - Friday Update - The Harvester and Spark Q&A

135

Comments

  • DestrockDestrock Join Date: 2005-01-14 Member: 35500Members
    The Harvester need some roots or tentacles under itself.

    When it die it's a non sense. It's looking like a worm ...

    When the Harvester is draining ressources, it's suppose to be teleported inside the alien team member ? That would be more logic to have roots so the Harvester can give the ressources to the hive and then from the hive to the alien player no ?
  • FocusedWolfFocusedWolf Join Date: 2005-01-09 Member: 34258Members
    edited February 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1752800:date=Feb 12 2010, 07:30 PM:name=Quovatis)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Quovatis @ Feb 12 2010, 07:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752800"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No water? I guess that means no sludge or lava either. That's too bad, as it really added to the atmosphere in NS1.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    NNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    ---
    <!--sizeo:1--><span style="font-size:8pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->
    Please don't break the forum tables.<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    YoU BrOkE tHe FoRuM!!!
  • Squeal_Like_A_PigSqueal_Like_A_Pig Janitor Join Date: 2002-01-25 Member: 66Members, Super Administrators, NS1 Playtester, NS2 Developer, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Developer
    As Max said, we don't have glass YET. We are going to have it, and some of our current maps are designed with glass in mind.

    Usually there will be Infestation that is growing around the Resource Harvester, which will make it fit in better.

    I'm not quite understanding the comments regarding the small size of the Resource Harvester. I think people may be thinking it's smaller then it actually is, and should be able to still provide some cover. Here's a scale ref image.

    --Cory

    [attachment=35917:Resource...er_Scale.jpg]
  • NyfNyf Join Date: 2010-02-07 Member: 70468Members
    I think a few people have said this, but I really, really, REALLY want to pop that tower. It falling off looks great, but it would be so awesome if the node would pop first, perhaps causing some sort of splash look if the marines get it on their visor (nothing too intrusive, just something to add to the feel).
    Anyways I think it looks great, so keep it up.
  • gamakungamakun Join Date: 2007-11-20 Member: 62971Members, Constellation
    edited February 2010
    I think the glowing sac should change color slightly when it dies because then it would further cue the players that the structure is dead along with the death animation. Maybe a brownish color.
  • korvokorvo Join Date: 2009-11-19 Member: 69427Members, Squad Five Blue
    edited February 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1752936:date=Feb 13 2010, 04:21 PM:name=Destrock)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Destrock @ Feb 13 2010, 04:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752936"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->(...) That would be more logic to have roots so the Harvester can give the ressources to the hive and then from the hive to the alien player no ?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Never heard about energy that is transferred over the air? Maybe as a kind of gas or radiation. ;)

    But with Infestion it's perfect :)
  • glimmermanglimmerman Join Date: 2004-04-29 Member: 28300Members, Constellation
    I think I'll have to agree that it needs something to suppot it. Looks like the easiest way to "kill" an RT is to just walk up to it's side and push it over.

    I'm suprised that you took that design seeing as way back in that videocast about the mobile seige, you laughed and called the bike sketch/design "rinky-######" and moched it with a kick stand lol.

    Basically: I'm suprised there's no kick-stand on the RT...
  • Mr. EpicMr. Epic Join Date: 2003-08-01 Member: 18660Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1752945:date=Feb 13 2010, 11:07 AM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Feb 13 2010, 11:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752945"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As Max said, we don't have glass YET. We are going to have it, and some of our current maps are designed with glass in mind.

    Usually there will be Infestation that is growing around the Resource Harvester, which will make it fit in better.

    I'm not quite understanding the comments regarding the small size of the Resource Harvester. I think people may be thinking it's smaller then it actually is, and should be able to still provide some cover. Here's a scale ref image.

    --Cory

    [attachment=35917:Resource...er_Scale.jpg]<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Nice bit of info, we haven't heard of DI in a long time. I think the size comments are concerning the legs and how you could kind of hide behind them. With the image you just provided, it is clear that the new harvester (couldn't you guys keep it the RT?) is actually wider than the old RT so in effect there is as much or more coverage for hiding than before.

    Get that lerk video done!
  • AtoneAtone Join Date: 2009-09-21 Member: 68839Members
    edited February 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1752936:date=Feb 13 2010, 04:21 PM:name=Destrock)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Destrock @ Feb 13 2010, 04:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752936"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The Harvester need some roots or tentacles under itself.

    When it die it's a non sense. It's looking like a worm ...

    When the Harvester is draining ressources, it's suppose to be teleported inside the alien team member ? That would be more logic to have roots so the Harvester can give the ressources to the hive and then from the hive to the alien player no ?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    The alien harvester transfers the resources through the Bacterium, obviously.

    <!--quoteo(post=1752832:date=Feb 13 2010, 02:22 AM:name=Norton)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Norton @ Feb 13 2010, 02:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752832"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The harvester looks odd to me because I can't figure how the resources are getting to the aliens. Will infestation sprout out from the tower and give it to the aliens through their feet? I just see it pumping stuff out of the hole in the ground into a ball.

    Also, what kind of room are we supposed to make to house these resource towers? I've got a few ideas, but it will take some really creative mapping to integrate an even distribution of gas nodes throughout the entire facility. Like why would a cafeteria or sleeping quarter have resource nodes in them? Why would any room other than one specifically designed for resource extraction have them?

    Whatever, I know it's just a game and I will overlook all of this very easily if I am supposed to just suspend my disbelief. Just curious I guess.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    The reserves of nanoslude (Where your resources come from) were originally intended for large repairs and emergencies. If it was all located in one resource room, then it would not be very accessible for an emergency in another part of the station. If the cafeteria was large enough/far away enough from other resource nodes, then why not?

    <a href="http://www.brywright.co.uk/ns/manual-104/structures_restower.html" target="_blank">http://www.brywright.co.uk/ns/manual-104/s...s_restower.html</a>
  • zexzex Join Date: 2009-10-07 Member: 68978Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1752951:date=Feb 13 2010, 04:21 PM:name=CyberMantis)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CyberMantis @ Feb 13 2010, 04:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752951"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->we haven't heard of DI in a long time.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    This would have been a perfect video to show off some infestation - what's up with that?
    I think the Harvester model looks cool, kinda weird. The orb at the top seems a bit smooth, could use a bumpy texture. And thicker spines holding it to the main body. The orb should definitely burst when it's killed!
  • crodecrode Join Date: 2002-11-09 Member: 7876Members
    edited February 2010
    I still would like to know about if you will attempt some Ambient Occlusion in the engine or bake it into the textures for the models? If its on the models and not any other geometry then it might be a bit odd.
    Edit: In the cinematic editor the camera properties has AO?

    About this glass, what part is missing? All you need is colour, transparency and reflection maps. Or are you talking about something like refraction or breaking of glass like HL2?

    And same with water. You may not be able to swim in it but there will still be water, lava with animated textures.
  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    The harvester reminds me a lot of the domZ in Beyond Good and Evil. Love the animation. :)
    <img src="http://www.freewebs.com/trinitybge01/BadThingylol.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
  • Squeal_Like_A_PigSqueal_Like_A_Pig Janitor Join Date: 2002-01-25 Member: 66Members, Super Administrators, NS1 Playtester, NS2 Developer, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Developer
    <!--quoteo(post=1752954:date=Feb 13 2010, 04:48 PM:name=zex)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (zex @ Feb 13 2010, 04:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752954"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The orb should definitely burst when it's killed!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Yup, that's the plan. Probably at the point where it rears back and the sac swells up, it would burst, with a nice particle effect.

    --Cory
  • NortonNorton Join Date: 2005-01-13 Member: 35264Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1753015:date=Feb 13 2010, 05:44 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Feb 13 2010, 05:44 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1753015"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yup, that's the plan. Probably at the point where it rears back and the sac swells up, it would burst, with a nice particle effect.

    --Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Perfect!!!
  • TriggermanTriggerman Graphic Artist Join Date: 2004-11-10 Member: 32724Members, WC 2013 - Supporter
    <!--quoteo(post=1753015:date=Feb 13 2010, 05:44 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Feb 13 2010, 05:44 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1753015"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yup, that's the plan. Probably at the point where it rears back and the sac swells up, it would burst, with a nice particle effect.

    --Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Speaking of the death-animation, wouldn't it be more appropriate to have an animation that doesn't make it fall away that much?
    In order to get it to not clipping through objects, the leveldesigner would have to be able to set at which angle it would always be planted, thus it would always look the same when you see an RT on a level as it would be facing the same way all the time.
    Having the animation a bit more "on the spot" would in my opinion work better so that it can be planted in a random direction instead.
  • MachinasterMachinaster Join Date: 2007-05-31 Member: 61074Members
    That res tower is scary lookin... Someone else put it close to how it made me think/feel, as being something from Dead Space. It does look a little corpse-y, very eerie, just how aliens should seem!

    PS:
    I elect a "Music update". I think it'd be an awesome mid-week thing, or included in a Friday update. Maybe some short samples from a favorite select few from the team (knowing Cory listens to them regularly... Surely the rest of the crew does too!). Or perhaps a few full length ones? Not trying to undermine anything like Spark updates or visuals being released, but damn I've loved the music so far. And on a side/clarification note, this is the same composer as the one who did NS1's music? I thought I read it somewhere, at some point.
  • kyliegirlkyliegirl Gorge Master Australia Join Date: 2002-12-11 Member: 10586Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Love the resource tower, it looks more alive, while the old tower was great I really do think this one gives a bit more life to it, especially its mouth that is seen in the death scene at the end.

    off topic -

    Cory please make a website of your work! Gosh I wish I could see more of your art and possibly even progress pics and walkthroughs of how you achieve it. I wish I could get to that level of understanding of colour and light.
  • cmc5788cmc5788 Join Date: 2009-10-06 Member: 68959Members
    edited February 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1752798:date=Feb 12 2010, 06:27 PM:name=Popenator)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Popenator @ Feb 12 2010, 06:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752798"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oooh, possibilities for the skybox cinematic just made me get really excited..<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    The possibilities for the skybox cinematic made me question the usefulness and efficacy of allowing such effects (especially relative to the possibilities of a low-level engine). I suppose it supports a great deal of glass-passageway levels that provide views of beautiful, dystopian outdoor cinematics without actually allowing levels with any such qualities... cool?

    To be honest, I'm a little disappointed with the "we won't allow glass or water in the first release" statements. These are important shaders to support. They are complicated!!! But standardize them. Your fanbase will forgive you if you have water rolling with a basic sin() curve; they won't forgive you if they can't add a pool of reactor fluid to a map because you didn't add in the result of a Google-able HLSL shader paradigm. Seriously, you can upgrade towards short-term support and forgiveness, but long-term forgiveness is CUTTING. First impressions, for better or worse, define you.

    Either deal with it or don't. I'll watch you rise or fall dispassionately, all the same.
  • LazarusLazarus Join Date: 2002-01-28 Member: 122Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Gold
    <!--quoteo(post=1753025:date=Feb 14 2010, 04:34 AM:name=Triggerman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Triggerman @ Feb 14 2010, 04:34 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1753025"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Speaking of the death-animation, wouldn't it be more appropriate to have an animation that doesn't make it fall away that much?
    In order to get it to not clipping through objects, the leveldesigner would have to be able to set at which angle it would always be planted, thus it would always look the same when you see an RT on a level as it would be facing the same way all the time.
    Having the animation a bit more "on the spot" would in my opinion work better so that it can be planted in a random direction instead.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    But shouldn't the rag-doll physics pretty much take care of that problem?
  • PopenatorPopenator Join Date: 2009-08-27 Member: 68617Members
    I sense a strong lack of faith in yourself and others :\

    The outdoor cinematics are proven to be cool additions to a game within 5 minutes of playing Halo 3.
    Unlike these guys, I'm not bound by a set time for releasing my map, as that would be a pretty unintelligent move to make on my part.

    They didn't say that they wouldn't 'allow' water or glass, and he certainly didn't say that glass wouldn't be in the official release.


    The fact that water isn't in the initial release is somewhat a put-off, though, because, as you've said, the level of detail you program into the water doesn't depend on how water looks in real life, it depends on what you make of it.
  • echsechs Join Date: 2002-12-27 Member: 11568Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1752887:date=Feb 13 2010, 08:49 AM:name=lillbrorsan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lillbrorsan @ Feb 13 2010, 08:49 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752887"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Didn't expect the alien RT to look like that but i like it, even though it feels a bit odd :><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    You're not supposed to stroke it. :p
  • PopenatorPopenator Join Date: 2009-08-27 Member: 68617Members
    Ooh, I just answered my own question

    Water isn't supported yet because, in order for us to respect it, it would have to be extremely responsive and look akin to Bioshock's water.
  • PricePrice Join Date: 2003-09-27 Member: 21247Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1752945:date=Feb 13 2010, 05:07 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Feb 13 2010, 05:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752945"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As Max said, we don't have glass YET. We are going to have it, and some of our current maps are designed with glass in mind.

    Usually there will be Infestation that is growing around the Resource Harvester, which will make it fit in better.

    I'm not quite understanding the comments regarding the small size of the Resource Harvester. I think people may be thinking it's smaller then it actually is, and should be able to still provide some cover. Here's a scale ref image.

    --Cory

    [attachment=35917:Resource...er_Scale.jpg]<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Because of the view of the skulk, we forget that the skulk is larger then it was in ns1.
  • iKossuiKossu Join Date: 2002-12-30 Member: 11593Members
    edited February 2010
    Nice going UWE! Although, I was a tiny bit disappointed with no water or glass (yet), but those really are trivial things. The harvester actually reminds me of <a href="http://www.ufopaedia.org/images/a/ab/Snakeman.png" target="_blank"><i>Snakeman</i></a> from <i>UFO: Enemy Unknown</i>, which is why I immediately thought about Harvester being able to move around and look for nozzles by itself. Also, I agree with echs here:

    <!--quoteo(post=1752812:date=Feb 13 2010, 03:07 AM:name=echs)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (echs @ Feb 13 2010, 03:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1752812"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As for the Harvester, it's a great design, and it looks alot better and seems more alive than its NS counterpart. Nice name change too. But I think it would look MUCH better if it was to sway from side to side a little more, it looks too stiff for a living thing.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
  • EdcrabEdcrab Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 4324Members
    Harvester looks like some sort of mosquito/leech hybrid. Awesome!

    As for Spark, I imagine the skyboxes could allow for some very neat backdrops. I’m thinking cityscapes and what-not…
  • SilverwingSilverwing bulletsponge Join Date: 2003-11-23 Member: 23395Members, Constellation
    Looking good!

    Not liking the RT too much. The top part looks... odd. And not in the "it's <i>alien</i>, dude" kinda way. It looks artificial. The "fingers" that grip the sac don't grip it and the sac is too uniform. The tentacles that grip the nozzle look artificial, too, where they join the main body, too many right angles.

    All in all, it is a cool concept but it looks unfinished.

    Pumped about the rest, looking forward to the playable alpha! =)
  • Raza.Raza. Join Date: 2004-01-24 Member: 25663Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1753057:date=Feb 14 2010, 08:24 AM:name=cmc5788)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cmc5788 @ Feb 14 2010, 08:24 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1753057"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->To be honest, I'm a little disappointed with the "we won't allow glass or water in the first release" statements.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    How is it that 80% of the people replying here lack any reading comprehension skills?
    "Thus we haven't implemented it yet, <b>but we will</b>!" is what UWE said about glass.
    Nothing in that text suggest that glass won't be in the first release.
    If you still don't believe it look at Cory's statement a few posts above.
  • RedDragonGeckoRedDragonGecko Join Date: 2002-12-11 Member: 10564Members
    I think the 'bones' around that bubble look to long and loose. Too much space in between the bubble and the bones.
    Maybe make the bones tight against the bubble and have the bubble push out between the bones when it expands.
    Kinda like squeezing a balloon with your fingers.

    The bubble also looked to clean and smooth, perhaps add a veiny bump map.

    I prefer the name Leech, I think it suits it.
  • FarrenFarren Join Date: 2005-03-13 Member: 45065Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited February 2010
    I have to say that I am hating the complete removal of water from NS2 (release). I understand that it takes alot of work to code it in, and that maps can be made without the use of water elements (the underwater passageways in bast were horribly realized... too long without air, too linear for aliens, too murky for marines....).

    What I was hoping to include water as is a visual cueue. Small puddles on the ground, dripping water, heck even a fullblown waterfall seen in the distance through some kind of viewport would give a great impression of dampness and a quick and easy change of environment. Just look at how differently a room can look with the addition of rock style props. And how will we be having the supposed lava flows that have been mentioned before, yet there is no time to develop the same with water?

    I'm not saying we need water effects or swim physics (ok maybe a few ripples for puddles), but it's really a shame that there will not be any water at all.
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