New Light Machine Gun

BodyGuard · August 2007

<div class="IPBDescription">An old thing that I just show again</div>I made another thread some month ago, in the artwork of NS1 forums, but maybe this could be just something new in NS2.

Just mixing the skin of the lmg and the knife, the picture speaks clearly than me :

<a href="http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/9581/zilstylevn9.jpg" target="_blank">http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/9581/zilstylevn9.jpg</a>

And the old topic : <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=97953" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...showtopic=97953</a>

Buzzou · August 2007

hehe looks cool, i actually like the electrical tape holding it together, gives it a more improvised, gritty feel.

and the blood/alien goo splattered over it is sweet as well =)

WatchMaker · August 2007

I'm still keeping my fingers cross that the NS2 LMG will be totally different than it's predecessor.

schkorpio · August 2007

looks pretty fun <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

but this is the suggestions forum - are you suggesting this as the new lmg ? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />

BodyGuard · August 2007

Mhh, " yes and no ".
I presume that a lot of things will be customisable in NS2, like the skin of your marine, female or male, and so on ; so why no putting customisable weapons ? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> like " i won't spawn with any gun, but i can carry 20 more ammo pack " ( i know it' stupid, but it's just an example.

But I dont know if this fits with the new lmg concept, of course.

I just tried to build this weapon as an .mdl ( and I never succeded ), just to avoid the switch-weapon between knife & lmg. When using knife(slot3), the marine would jsut attack doing hits with the knife of the lmg, and when with lmg ( slot1 ), he would use the gun itselft ( i mean, firing with it <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> ).

That was more for fun, but I think that could be something... original, for NS1 or for NS2.

Bobomoto · August 2007

well ns2 is placed 7 years after ns 1 so weapons should be allot more advanced then the original game.

Same thing with aliens they should have Hate to say it Evolved. (I am christian and do not believe in any evolution)

CoolCookieCooks · August 2007

Taping a knife to the LMG is hardly an advancement in technology, bayonetts have been around for god knows how long.

XeZo · August 2007

Seeing as NS2 is supposed to look like its happenng several years after ns1, I really hope the new weapons wont have the old looks, maybe on some maps, marines should be able to find the old weapons laying on floors or something, rusty and stuff =)

[Deleted User] · August 2007

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(XeZo @ Aug 29 2007, 08:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1646207"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>Seeing as NS2 is supposed to look like its happenng several years after ns1, I really hope the new weapons wont have the old looks, maybe on some maps, marines should be able to find the old weapons laying on floors or something, rusty and stuff =)</div>

Cool, but a bit silly. because theyd probably have to be in set positions, so people would always rush to the positions to find a rusty HMG early game.
Unless you mean they are just objects that cant be picked up, then yeah, cool <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />

XeZo · August 2007

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stars @ Aug 29 2007, 10:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1646210"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>Cool, but a bit silly. because theyd probably have to be in set positions, so people would always rush to the positions to find a rusty HMG early game.
Unless you mean they are just objects that cant be picked up, then yeah, cool <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /></div>

random spawn location, like the rune mod for CS 1.6 =)

(ofcourse they shouldnt be able to spawn outside the map like in CS XP)

and it shouldnt be as powerful, with a random amound of ammo so getting it wouldnt always be an advantage =)

[Deleted User] · August 2007

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(XeZo @ Aug 29 2007, 10:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1646244"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>random spawn location, like the rune mod for CS 1.6 =)

(ofcourse they shouldnt be able to spawn outside the map like in CS XP)

and it shouldnt be as powerful, with a random amound of ammo so getting it wouldnt always be an advantage =)</div>

Even still, findign a gl or hmg early game?
nyeh...

it is kinda funky, but not needed.

BodyGuard · August 2007

Just stick the knife with High-tech glue. xD

Or an Hmg to a Shotgun =)

*joke* of course <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />

locallyunscene · August 2007

Actually I really like the idea of the bayonet and I think it's plausible. They were used for close quarters trench fighting and that's very close to what the marines have to do with these aliens. Of course they'd prefer to be a hundred yards away firing at a target but on a ship you don't have this option very often and the need for a quick melee option was recognized by the marines. I see it as a plausible way the marines would adapt to the new threat.

XeZo · August 2007

All I think of is the chainsaw on the rifle in GOW! XP

niaccurshi · August 2007

I think the weapons SHOULD look like their predecessors. If a gun is designed a certain way in a certain universe it is because it has elements that work for it. The elements that work aren't going to change. Also, for instance, the manufacturers would be stupid to alter anything that is marine operable under stress conditions as it would mean having to retrain every marine in the use of a completely different feeling gun. In this sense the magazine should be in the same place, so that marines in the service (god help them) for 7 years aren't fumbling around trying to contradict their own subconscious actions.

Lets jazz it up, lets evolve the weaponry to more suit the up to date climate, lets add little gimmicks and even more sensible elements on them but also see where they intrinsically came from, just as you would in the real world with guns developed in series by one manufacturer.

Edit: Also, we're talking about a wholesale massive manufacture of the basic marine weapon (aside from the pistol and knife) here, why manufacturers in a time of war would choose to spend money on this particular weapon and the changes in equipment and techniques to create it is not really justifiable, IMO

hookeyed · August 2007

On the contrary nia, war is a catalyst for technological advances. This is supposed to be a race of resources, and arms. Aaand I would be pretty disappointed if the new designs looked anything like the old ones.

I see no reason to make the frontiersmen more like grenadiers. It would look pretty silly to see a bunch of marines bayoneting an RT. Nice concept image, though.

niaccurshi · August 2007

Yes it is a catalyst for advances, but not for wholesale changes. When the cannon plundered enemy lines in France the bows that the English were using were the same with minor changes in its manufacture as they had been for years, armour had improved from the decades previous but intrinsically remained the same in areas of its heritage. Move to modern warfare and look at the weapons we're using now and compare them to the last time Iraq was invaded, or even vietnam, you won't see a whole load of changes to the mainstay of weaponry as short periods of time elapse, but you might see new weapons being made available.

I just think it would be a whole lot cooler if little things were improved and that such improvements did alter the shape of the weapon and the look of the weapon, but that ultimately you can see it's still essentially the same weapon, albeit a couple of "versions" better, that was used 7 years ago. (and the precedent is being set, tbh, by the marine armour concept on the female marine, it's a pure example of how at least with armour the idea is that not much is changing but where small advancements can be made they are)

If you want different looking weapons then make new weapons to show the advancement of technology, imo <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />

hookeyed · August 2007

<shamefully off topic>

The English? Bah, the Germans designed and mass produced several different tank models throughout the war, even with the allies at their doorstep. The point of a technological advancement is finding something else to do the same job, makes sense to give it the same name.

And Iraq is hardly at an arms race with the US. They don't need to make new weapons, they're practically facing the same enemy (technology wise).

CanadianWolverine · August 2007

Those limitations are gone in an enviroment where nano forges exist, all you would need are the blue prints, which is essentially what the armory and lab provide. Also, in a place where phase gates and portals exist, it really wouldn't be all that difficult for the TSA to send their marines (who may be bio engineered clones for all we know) with custom gear right from the get go, if they actually cared. If anything it looks like the reason the marines get saddled with the Light Machine Gun is because a bean counting accountant approved the weapon load out after pulling rank on real marine commander.

Forget the limitations of modern mass production, nanites build stuff in this future.

niaccurshi · August 2007

I'm not just looking at limitation of mass production though (and I'm not seeing mass production as a limitation in the real world now, only mass PAYMENT <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink-fix.gif" />)...the thing that is most important for me is these marines are human, and if they're in a war then they're humans that are probably being indoctrinated with basics of the military from childhood. Changing too much about what a human accepts to be static is only going to hurt the efficiency of that person when they become a marine.

Essentially, the old adage just spring to mind, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. and the LMG, while being the nuts and bolts of a force starting out, isn't broke. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />

CanadianWolverine · August 2007

I see what you're saying and standard training would dictate that the LMG would probably be familiar. By that same token, I doubt it would be the first time a marine picked up a mine, nade, shotgun, welder, knife, and HMG or wore Heavy Armor or a Jet Pack. Those were probably hashed out in Basic.

There's a saying by Aesop from <i>The Fox and The Lion</i>: "Familiarity breeds contempt."

Personally, I would think that military doctrine would have improved to the point in the future that gear load outs would be far more customized than what we had in NS1, similar to what various militaries are attempting today:

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE("St0nkingByte")</div><div class='quotemain'>Just stumbled across this, the Canadian Forces 'Army of the Future' project paid a sci-fi writer to write a story about what CF combat might look like in the future. Amazingly good near-tech sci-fi stuff...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>"Crisis in Zefra builds on the Army's strong tradition of looking and thinking ahead. Although this book is set in a fictional location ten to fifteen years from now, already we are witnessing the threads linking today to this fictionalâ€”yet possibleâ€”vision of tomorrow. I invite you to read Crisis in Zefra, debate its concepts, and participate in building the Army of the Future."</div>

<a href="http://armyapp.dnd.ca/dlsc-dcsot/docs/Crisis_in_Zefra_e.pdf" target="_blank">http://armyapp.dnd.ca/dlsc-dcsot/docs/Crisis_in_Zefra_e.pdf</a></div>

I could have sworn the game GRAW and GRAW 2 were based off a similar concept the US military is working on.

This is why I get the impression the future still has ######head bean counters in charge, otherwise why would the TSA marine be so poorly equiped? They can build huge mining operations, fly the reaches of space, land colonies on planets, but they can't spare a few credits for a proper load out? Is the future run by the WWII Soviet or Japanese military? "Arm you? What are you talking about, here's this pocket knife which I didn't give you, your grampa did, and follow the guy with the rifle, if he drops it, you pick it up." Maybe they are making too many babies in this future and human lives are considered cheaper than a decent load out.

Or maybe the marine is kinda like a village volunteer fire fighter, you just get the most standard cheap ass equipment for your hick colony and practice consists of rolling the fire trucks / infantry portal out once in a while then going for a beer with the guys.

The TSA marines could be better than that.

hookeyed · September 2007

The name of the game is adaption. Literally. >_>
I'd think that the aliens would've evolved to face the current LMG design, forcing the marines to invent something new. Simple as that.

aeroripper · September 2007

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Or maybe the marine is kinda like a village volunteer fire fighter, you just get the most standard cheap ass equipment for your hick colony and practice consists of rolling the fire trucks / infantry portal out once in a while then going for a beer with the guys.</div>

lol, I smell a photoshop.

niaccurshi · September 2007

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hookeyed @ Sep 1 2007, 07:06 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1646823"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>The name of the game is adaption. Literally. >_>
I'd think that the aliens would've evolved to face the current LMG design, forcing the marines to invent something new. Simple as that.</div>

The irony of it all though is that humans don't evolve, they don't adapt quickly, and the idea of the basic weapon in a marines arsenal changing so that it is nothing like what generations of fighters are skilled in fighting with is preposterous as far as I'm concerned.

hookeyed · September 2007

Well, an altered LMG isn't going to be some inoperable foreign device. Most of the new designs don't look anything you'd have a real problem with. In the end, a gun is a gun.. you pull the trigger and reload.
The point is that aliens adapt by biology, and marines by technology. Both at roughly the same rate.

New Light Machine Gun

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