What could the comp scene do for you?
Prefix
Éirinn go Brách Join Date: 2006-12-31 Member: 59353Members, Constellation
Éirinn go Brách Join Date: 2006-12-31 Member: 59353Members, Constellation
What would you public players want to see from the competitive scene in terms of..
attitudes,
servers,
pugs,
or anything?
Also, what is your view of the current Competitive Scene?
And before you reply to this topic, attempt to be constructive and not turn this into 'Clanner vs Pubber'
Cheers, Prefix
attitudes,
servers,
pugs,
or anything?
Also, what is your view of the current Competitive Scene?
And before you reply to this topic, attempt to be constructive and not turn this into 'Clanner vs Pubber'
Cheers, Prefix
Comments
<b>Enjoyable Gameplay:</b> If I were to join the comp scene I would do it mainly for the gameplay. I would want communication between players, telling everyone what is needed where and what is happening. I would want players to respond to events and follow orders (or even give their opinion if they disagree on an order).
<b>Enjoyable People:</b> I want to play with players I can enjoy being with. I wouldn't want to play with robots who do nothing but play super intense NS 24/7. I want to have fun with those players, make jokes and have a great time. I wouldn't expect everyone to be friends with everyone, but I'd still expect everyone to be "enjoyable".
<b>Respectful Atmosphere:</b> This is the most important, but I'd want to have a respectful atmosphere. I'd want the same respect as I have on TG; whether I get a 1 - 10 ratio or a 10 - 1 ratio I still get the respect of my team. Of course I would expect to get a shotgun last when I'm doing poorly, but I wouldn't want or expect someone to say "Nub" or "Learn how to aim" to me (unless it's a joke). I'd want them to know that I am only human and that I sometimes do good, sometimes bad, sometimes I'm more aware and other times I'm less aware.
As for my view on the Competitive Scene, I see it as something that I could do but rather not. I see it as a more organized thing, me needing to be available at the exact time and be fully ready to play hardcore NS. I prefer a more laid back style where I play when I'm good and ready. I see it as something that would require much more practice and aiming skills to do decently and not get discouraged (I'd still have fun, just not as much).
That's why I enjoy the Semi-Competitive Scene like on TG or on IAM at good times of the day; they still have all the requirements above while still letting me play only when I want to. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Oh yeah, if you could arrange less work time with my boss so I could start back into the Clanner scene would be great <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1640522:date=Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM:name=Chocolate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Chocolate @ Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM) [snapback]1640522[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
<b>Enjoyable Gameplay:</b> If I were to join the comp scene I would do it mainly for the game play. I would want communication between players, telling everyone what is needed where and what is happening. I would want players to respond to events and follow orders (or even give their opinion if they disagree on an order).
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As for the quote above, I couldn't agree more.
Comp play is all of that you have described, in my opinion anyway.
If you can get that from public play good on you, i wish i did
<!--quoteo(post=1640522:date=Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM:name=Chocolate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Chocolate @ Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM) [snapback]1640522[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Enjoyable People: I want to play with players I can enjoy being with. I wouldn't want to play with robots who do nothing but play super intense NS 24/7. I want to have fun with those players, make jokes and have a great time. I wouldn't expect everyone to be friends with everyone, but I'd still expect everyone to be "enjoyable".
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You can choose whoever to play with in the comp scene just like in public. The only changes are you'll have time outside of games to joke with your clan mates, as well as in game. Sadly you will have to argue with someone in the comp scene at some point <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1640522:date=Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM:name=Chocolate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Chocolate @ Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM) [snapback]1640522[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Respectful Atmosphere: This is the most important, but I'd want to have a respectful atmosphere. I'd want the same respect as I have on TG; whether I get a 1 - 10 ratio or a 10 - 1 ratio I still get the respect of my team. Of course I would expect to get a shotgun last when I'm doing poorly, but I wouldn't want or expect someone to say "Nub" or "Learn how to aim" to me (unless it's a joke). I'd want them to know that I am only human and that I sometimes do good, sometimes bad, sometimes I'm more aware and other times I'm less aware.
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This is possibly all down to who you play with. If you play with people like Sublime or A.a etc.
Your clan mates will/should always respect you, your there in the same team as them, its immediate respect tbh. In public your more likely to be really insulted than during a pcw, unless your comm is born, in which its not real insults its just funny. "Omg guyyysss come on FS wtf are you doing. OMFG". Now thats entertainment. or when he makes fun of you for saying rofl to much, thats also fecking funny.
<!--quoteo(post=1640522:date=Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM:name=Chocolate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Chocolate @ Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM) [snapback]1640522[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
As for my view on the Competitive Scene, I see it as something that I could do but rather not. I see it as a more organized thing, me needing to be available at the exact time and be fully ready to play hardcore NS. I prefer a more laid back style where I play when I'm good and ready. I see it as something that would require much more practice and aiming skills to do decently and not get discouraged (I'd still have fun, just not as much).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You don't 'need' to be available as such. There are always more than 6people in a clan or else no-one would play comp. And training isn't as official as you'd think <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />, its 'cele resupply' or pcws. Just give it a go for a week <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1640522:date=Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM:name=Chocolate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Chocolate @ Jul 25 2007, 05:15 AM) [snapback]1640522[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
That's why I enjoy the Semi-Competitive Scene like on TG or on IAM at good times of the day; they still have all the requirements above while still letting me play only when I want to. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I can respect that <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />.
<!--quoteo(post=1640559:date=Jul 25 2007, 01:11 PM:name=InFlames)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(InFlames @ Jul 25 2007, 01:11 PM) [snapback]1640559[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Remove the pathetic hostilities that surround the Pubber & Clanner scenes. There is no need for it, we are all here to play the same game in the same community.
Oh yeah, if you could arrange less work time with my boss so I could start back into the Clanner scene would be great
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I seriously wish I had that power.
And again thanks for the replys, and keep em coming
[these problems have nothing to do with the clan scene. Skilled players != Competitive player, stop trying to tarnish everyone with the same brush due to your personal experience, if you can't be constructive, stay out of this topic - puzl]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Hmm... let's talk to myself.
Read what he wrote. What would I like from the competitive scene?
Well, I don't know. Ask yourself, what would you like from a microwave factory or some organization that you know exists, but you don't consciously think about?
I only have a guess as to what does go down in a comp scene. IRC, ventrillo whatever. Scrims.
But these individuals do have the potential to slant the game in favor of a team. And yes, I'll say this again and I'll continue to do it, so long as I can post.
Not constructive? Okay, so I'm responding to his questions with my opinions. Or my views as he asked. He's asking for opinions, yet he says do not turn it into a clan vs. pub war. So then the only logical thing that can come out of this is that clanners are good. Big discussion.
So no, I'm not trying to "tarnish everyone" as you assume. I play pub, I see what happens and I write it down here. If you're going to censor that, yet let every random spam thread/post that a comp player spits out every week slip by, than maybe your judgement is flawed.
But censor this too, because you have the power to do so and you will because I'm an annoying itch to you and to the forums. I've suffered harassment from a lot of people here anyway. Let's see how constructive one opinion can really be.
I know it is hard to keep giving help to newer players, especially when you meet these stupid, stubborn players, who don't listen, but there are always some players that will listen and appreciate your help.
You don't have to guide him through the game, just a little hint here and there, when you have some time to write.
In terms of attitudes I'd like to say that it would maybe help, if clanners give more hints/help in public play to players that are open for it and applaud players that made a good (support-) job.
I know it is hard to keep giving help to newer players, especially when you meet these stupid, stubborn players, who don't listen, but there are always some players that will listen and appreciate your help.
You don't have to guide him through the game, just a little hint here and there, when you have some time to write.
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I agree, just a few days ago I was playing with my friend on a marine bot server (Trying to teach him how to learn the game somewhat decently) and I helped him do more than Gorge or Skulk, he can go Lerk <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />. Back to the point, I am glad to give help if the player asks for it, otherwise they wont listen to you.
As for my first post, I was speaking in more of an objective stance than anything. That's what I would expect and literally need from comp play if I were to join. And TBH, I can speak for near certainty that the comp scene does give everything I said <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />. I just don't feel any desire to go into comp play just yet, so I just stick on the pugs (my aim is garbage at best 90% of the time <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />). I'm glad you can respect that just as much as I respect your decision of going into comp play <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />.
EDIT: I wonder if you might have to reword and remind everyone of what the questions are and what not to turn this topic into :/.
instead im met with hackusations. i used to be apart of the original nslearn with firewater as well as several of its unsuccessful reformations, so its not like im not willing to help. it just seems from MY point of view that im not getting many requests for help.
Nice way to promote interest for clanning and mutual respect and understanding.
...
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Let the repeating of the obivious begin.
Competetive scene might be a bit of a bad word there, but lets not get mislead. It takes 6 people, let them be 6 total newbies from public server or 6 top clanners and/or high skillers. They pick a voice communication software (recommended, but not really required) and server and face 6 other players.
The differences are that :
1) Scheduling matches might take a little bit of time.
2) You might have to plan ahead to have an hour or so for playing and finishing the round.
3) The random public game effects are eliminated, tons of new elements are present since you can be sure the teammate is aware of the situation and is communicating with you. Nobody is going to lame up the game by doing something idiotic like recycling or building a chamber nobody wants. There are more possibilities for strategy and teamwork.
4) You get to know people better since you are voice communicating them all the time, no matter if its gameplay discussion or just casual chat. Both are very much present in organized play.
Nobody is forcing you to pick any new gameplay elements unless you want to. I find ns much more enjoyable after the imbalanced teams, random recycles and chambers, teams withtout teamwork and such are removed. Who is involved and how serious your organised play is are things you can decide.
its not like im not willing to help. it just seems from MY point of view that im not getting many requests for help.
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Can I be your apprentice?
Let the repeating of the obivious begin.
Competetive scene might be a bit of a bad word there, but lets not get mislead. It takes 6 people, let them be 6 total newbies from public server or 6 top clanners and/or high skillers. They pick a voice communication software (recommended, but not really required) and server and face 6 other players.
The differences are that :
1) Scheduling matches might take a little bit of time.
2) You might have to plan ahead to have an hour or so for playing and finishing the round.
3) The random public game effects are eliminated, tons of new elements are present since you can be sure the teammate is aware of the situation and is communicating with you. Nobody is going to lame up the game by doing something idiotic like recycling or building a chamber nobody wants. There are more possibilities for strategy and teamwork.
4) You get to know people better since you are voice communicating them all the time, no matter if its gameplay discussion or just casual chat. Both are very much present in organized play.
Nobody is forcing you to pick any new gameplay elements unless you want to. I find ns much more enjoyable after the imbalanced teams, random recycles and chambers, teams withtout teamwork and such are removed. Who is involved and how serious your organised play is are things you can decide.
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Ok ok, I give in, its true that my gaming experience would be better with comp play, it just doesn't spark my interest. I guess because I'm a solo gamer so it doesn't spark my interest. Also I doubt I could get 6 players who I would want to scrim with anyway, I only have 1 normal friend (like a person I know in real life) who plays NS with me <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />.
I'm keeping the thought of Comp play in my mind, just for the moment its not in my interests play comp play. If there is enough interested people, I'll probably be more inclined to join <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />.
Ok ok, I give in, its true that my gaming experience would be better with comp play, it just doesn't spark my interest. I guess because I'm a solo gamer so it doesn't spark my interest. Also I doubt I could get 6 players who I would want to scrim with anyway, I only have 1 normal friend (like a person I know in real life) who plays NS with me <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />.
I'm keeping the thought of Comp play in my mind, just for the moment its not in my interests play comp play. If there is enough interested people, I'll probably be more inclined to join <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />.
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1 of my irl friends plays ns sometimes now. The rest of my clanmates are cool guys I got to know via ns competetive play. I'd most likely enjoy playing a 6v6 with teamed up with 5 random pubbers if I only could find the 5 guys.
Its totally understandable and fine that people don't want to play organised, I just want to make sure that you realize that organized ns doesn't have to be the elitist stuff most pubbers dislike. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Ok ok, I give in, its true that my gaming experience would be better with comp play, it just doesn't spark my interest. I guess because I'm a solo gamer so it doesn't spark my interest.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You are forced to play NS as a team, by virtue of the way the game exists. Even if you can rambo into a successful spawncamp on a pub, you need a commander and people capping nodes. The only difference in this regard in organized play is that your teammates are accountable for the intelligent and not-so-intelligent plays they make, so you don't have Joe and Bob building DC nests while your comm turret spams your base waiting for the end of a game that wasn't fun to begin with because of the lack of teamplay.
<!--quoteo(post=1640917:date=Jul 27 2007, 08:18 PM:name=Chocolate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Chocolate @ Jul 27 2007, 08:18 PM) [snapback]1640917[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Also I doubt I could get 6 players who I would want to scrim with anyway, I only have 1 normal friend (like a person I know in real life) who plays NS with me <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
See sig.
Can I be your apprentice?
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ok
<!--quoteo(post=555555:date=Jul 27 2007, 16:56 PM:name=That_Annoying_Kid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(That_Annoying_Kid @ Jul 27 2007, 16:56 PM) [snapback]555555[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Milo, if I see something completely and totally awesome that I was unaware about I will usually ask how it's done, and most of the time people will happily inform me<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
well thats fine. im not saying i dont get questions, im just saying that i very rarely get them.
1 of my irl friends plays ns sometimes now. The rest of my clanmates are cool guys I got to know via ns competetive play. I'd most likely enjoy playing a 6v6 with teamed up with 5 random pubbers if I only could find the 5 guys.
Its totally understandable and fine that people don't want to play organised, I just want to make sure that you realize that organized ns doesn't have to be the elitist stuff most pubbers dislike. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
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Ah yeah, that is an illusion that alot of pubbers have. I too find that stereotype somewhat true, but in a <b>very</b> different light. I find that in comp play you need to know what you are doing, you need to know what's going on and you need to have some ability to aim (at least not pull off the 1 - 15 scores I do sometimes <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />). Alot of pubbers think that you need to be able to pull off 25 - 1 scores, can take on a fade singly handedly and are literally NS playing robots, which is utterly wrong.
PS: I'm speaking from a TG point of view, which is literally a step down from comp play anyway <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />.
I find that in comp play you need to know what you are doing, you need to know what's going on and you need to have some ability to aim (at least not pull off the 1 - 15 scores I do sometimes <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
youre absolutely right. however, that doesnt prevent you from starting to play in some beginner clan. as i said before no one was born good at this game, therefore no-one expects you to pull off amazing stunts if youre just trying organized ns for the first time.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->PS: I'm speaking from a TG point of view, which is literally a step down from comp play anyway <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
i hate to say this but if you take a "step down" from competetive play, you find division 2.
PS: I'm speaking from a TG point of view, which is literally a step down from comp play anyway <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />.
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You've never played competitively then, when entering the competitive arena please dont assume you know anything. This will allow you to learn quickly and make it alot easier for the competitive community to accept you, which isnt a requirement but it will make your time 100x better.
I think clans *should* have public servers for the betterment of competetive NS. I know I became involved because I joined community-clans that went "pro" later on, introducing me to the competetive scene. The lack of public servers that seem to advocate competetive NS is a drawback in my opinion of bringing in fresh meat, although I think programs such as The Dojo are helping a good deal.
Prefix, I'd just like to address one thing I've been saying for a while about servers:
I think clans *should* have public servers for the betterment of competetive NS. I know I became involved because I joined community-clans that went "pro" later on, introducing me to the competetive scene. The lack of public servers that seem to advocate competetive NS is a drawback in my opinion of bringing in fresh meat, although I think programs such as The Dojo are helping a good deal.
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I agree, but clans these days don't have money :/, to get that sort of thing you need the members first.
I have done this before by joining a multi gaming clan and starting an ns division, which means we get our own server box and we can run as many servers as we like <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
Some of you may remember the =M4G= servers? They were around in the times of 3.2 betas. My co-leader set them up, we got all our members from that I have to say.
You've never played competitively then, when entering the competitive arena please dont assume you know anything. This will allow you to learn quickly and make it alot easier for the competitive community to accept you, which isnt a requirement but it will make your time 100x better.
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Alright, I just figured TG and comp play were somewhat similar because TG is 100x better than most other pub servers around.