Ns_disonberg
bERt0r
Join Date: 2005-03-23 Member: 46181Members
Join Date: 2005-03-23 Member: 46181Members
<div class="IPBDescription">My unfinished map</div><!--sizeo:4--><span style="font-size:14pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->Beta 5 out!<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
Since the forums got back up, i felt like starting to map around again... maybe one of you can help me with my problems getting this map together (im hackin on this thingy for about 3 years now).
I already started a thread about it, but it was 2 years ago so i thought, lets start a new one <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
The story (big thanks to Crispy for his storytelling abilities <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> ):
Crogar, isolated planetoid in the Betal System. It was here that Robert Disonberg stumbled upon a strange new bacterium, a bacterium which would later be identified as the earliest sample obtained of the Kharaa lifeform.
Now, due to the recent infestation of this race in the Ariadne Arm a new facility has been set up to analyse all Kharaa bacteria collected from TSA missions. Named after Robert Disonberg and using his same initial studies this facility has as its Primary Objective the research into new weaponry to combat this extraterrestrial threat.
Despite Disonberg's initial warnings regarding the extremely adaptable and hostile nature of the Kharaa organism, the researchers of this facility had been forced forego careful and in-depth analysis, ordered by TSA command to obtain results within the month.
Three weeks ago, contact to the Disonberg Research Facility was lost. We must prepare ourselves for the worst, which is why you have been asked to accept this mission. We have ordered you back from Ariadne Arm to address this situation, retrieving the maximum amount of data, intact, from the Disonberg if its fate has already been decided.
In the event of a communications breakdown the Committee has been ordered to destroy the facility 24 hours after loss of contact.
General theBert McBert
Head of TSA Security Committee
-----------------------------------------------------------
Some screens:
<img src="http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/2364/nsdisonbergbeta10009hi6.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/6543/nsdisonbergbeta10008sc3.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/1451/nsdisonbergalpha50002vg8.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/8867/nsdisonbergbeta10000lv7.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/9752/nsdisonbergbeta40000bn0.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/3687/nsdisonbergbeta10002nr4.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/729/nsdisonbergbeta10004ak8.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/1580/nsdisonbergbeta10005lx4.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/6309/nsdisonbergbeta10010bo3.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
And the file:
<a href="http://www.brywright.co.uk/downloads/files/index.php?dir=natural-selection/maps/ns/&file=ns_disonberg_beta5a.zip" target="_blank">ns_disonberg Beta5a</a>
Feel free to tell me your opinion...
Since the forums got back up, i felt like starting to map around again... maybe one of you can help me with my problems getting this map together (im hackin on this thingy for about 3 years now).
I already started a thread about it, but it was 2 years ago so i thought, lets start a new one <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
The story (big thanks to Crispy for his storytelling abilities <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> ):
Crogar, isolated planetoid in the Betal System. It was here that Robert Disonberg stumbled upon a strange new bacterium, a bacterium which would later be identified as the earliest sample obtained of the Kharaa lifeform.
Now, due to the recent infestation of this race in the Ariadne Arm a new facility has been set up to analyse all Kharaa bacteria collected from TSA missions. Named after Robert Disonberg and using his same initial studies this facility has as its Primary Objective the research into new weaponry to combat this extraterrestrial threat.
Despite Disonberg's initial warnings regarding the extremely adaptable and hostile nature of the Kharaa organism, the researchers of this facility had been forced forego careful and in-depth analysis, ordered by TSA command to obtain results within the month.
Three weeks ago, contact to the Disonberg Research Facility was lost. We must prepare ourselves for the worst, which is why you have been asked to accept this mission. We have ordered you back from Ariadne Arm to address this situation, retrieving the maximum amount of data, intact, from the Disonberg if its fate has already been decided.
In the event of a communications breakdown the Committee has been ordered to destroy the facility 24 hours after loss of contact.
General theBert McBert
Head of TSA Security Committee
-----------------------------------------------------------
Some screens:
<img src="http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/2364/nsdisonbergbeta10009hi6.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/6543/nsdisonbergbeta10008sc3.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/1451/nsdisonbergalpha50002vg8.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/8867/nsdisonbergbeta10000lv7.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/9752/nsdisonbergbeta40000bn0.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/3687/nsdisonbergbeta10002nr4.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/729/nsdisonbergbeta10004ak8.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/1580/nsdisonbergbeta10005lx4.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/6309/nsdisonbergbeta10010bo3.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
And the file:
<a href="http://www.brywright.co.uk/downloads/files/index.php?dir=natural-selection/maps/ns/&file=ns_disonberg_beta5a.zip" target="_blank">ns_disonberg Beta5a</a>
Feel free to tell me your opinion...
Comments
I have some comments:
To help aliens move arround faster you might want to use clipping brushes arround pipes, protruding edges in hallways. This will help cut down clipnodes and make moving arround floor/wall/ceiling much more smooth
I saw a small ammo lift/transport thingy in a hallway, might want to raise it so the skulk can walk underneath it (I tried it and I couldn't)
You have some areas which are darkened, meaning models like buildings or players will appear near black. I'm not sure how I fixed some of them in my old map, but I think it had something to do with off grid vertexes or func_water undearneath the locations...
Some RT nodes are dark, you might want to put a spot light or something on it to light it up
Some lights have a halo comming from them, but the light itself has the turned off texture
The big hive, might want to put some cover in that hive for the gorge for example
The overall lighting (not sure if you are already working on that part), but it has that more of the same look... I would try and darken down the ambient light and use eyecatching lights on architecture which you want the player to see, this will make the atmosphere of the map much richer and overall more exiting to look at or walk trough.
A good map with bland lighting will look bad, however a bad map with good lighting could make it look awesome <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> So in your case, interesting archicture, but an overall bland lighting will make it less atractive...
Overall I love the two other hives, the one with broken bridge and the hive on the right part of the map I think it was, still these would be even nicer with more interesting lights and overall murkier/darker feeling...
Im happy to proceed now with mapping <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> and it seems im close to finish the brushwork.
I hope the lightning is better in my upcoming compile... i messed it up due to that damn bug. Anyway, I'll be tweaking the lightning when im done with building my last room (and probably 1 or 2 vents). I need to be in the mood for creating a new area so this might take a while (or hopefully not <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />).
However, i hope i get a few sceens from my currently running compile up tonight. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/asrifle.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::asrifle::" border="0" alt="asrifle.gif" />
Edit: Here it is: <a href="http://www.brywright.co.uk/downloads/files/index.php?dir=natural-selection/maps/ns/&file=ns_disonberg_a2.zip" target="_blank">http://www.brywright.co.uk/downloads/files...isonberg_a2.zip</a>
Without that damn clipping error, it looks a lot better imo <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
I have some screenshots of where i got the clipping error, and im not a mapper myself but ive also got screenshots i will make suggestions on, which i will soon post later. The other poster is right and the lighting seems very plain and not many colors used but the white lights.Anyways let me sort through all the screenshots ill show you my findings and make some suggestions but keep up the great work! ^^
With this picture right here, I would darken that room up making that light in the center on the ceiling another color rather than a light shade of white, perhaps maybe a red or something as the color for the light source. After all the ship is under attack by aliens, which of course could cause poweroutages in the ship and the captain has surley sounded the distress alarm on the ship ( i watch to many sci-fi movies rofl )
<a href="http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/hivecolor.bmp" target="_blank">http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/hivecolor.bmp</a>
As for this hive i would also add something in there to allow gorges and other small life forms to give themselves cover from an oncoming attack if need be. I would also darken the hive room and change all the lights to a darkish but bright orange color maybe.. if you understand what i mean or maybe even a green from perhaps the aliens hive that feeds off it source giving the lights the other color besides white <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
<a href="http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/cliperror1.bmp" target="_blank">http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/cliperror1.bmp</a>
Here is where i got stuck on one part of the map, I had to crouch to get through it.
Since those hallways are long and narrow i would also maybe give them another color to it, of a darker look and feeling. Atleast the aliens would stand a slight chance againts the marines if doing so. dunno.
<a href="http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/changecolor.bmp" target="_blank">http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/changecolor.bmp</a>
on this picture ignore the filename as i named it wrong. Anyhow im not sure if you wanted marines to get through this or if it even leads to anywhere but a marine can not crouch under it to get through.
<a href="http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/plain.bmp" target="_blank">http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/plain.bmp</a>
I would also darken this portion of the hallway, at first look i would think perhaps a powerdrain from the ships resources are going on, since the little lights are dim along the upper portion of the walls, Again perhaps changing the color of the overall lighting here.
<a href="http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/stuck.bmp" target="_blank">http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/stuck.bmp</a>
When a marine crouches and gets into this vent he gets stuck in there and cannot get out.
( lol i always get stuck finding map bugs, i should be made a PT! rofl )
<a href="http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/outofplacemaybe.bmp" target="_blank">http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files...fplacemaybe.bmp</a>
Here is just something very minor i noticed in marine start, the small orangish yellow light that isnt on the other side of the comm chair just that side. If its supposed to be there like that, sorry. It doesnt bother me i just always notice tiny details like that lol.
<a href="http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/underdark.bmp" target="_blank">http://uploader.inceptionhosting.net/files/1/underdark.bmp</a>
also here in this hive under the small opening of the broke floors, im not sure if its possible but i would make it darker around that perhaps giving a small life form a place to hide.
Well thats all for now, I know how i've explained these things are pretty crappy but as ive said im not a mapper but have just been an ole player of NS for a vera long time now and just thought id give my two cents in even if no one seems to understand or dont like my suggestions. I find myself lacking creativity to even make a map if i knew where to start with one.
Anyways, the map is looking awesome and keep up the work!
[On topic] It's good to see bert's still on this. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Just one slightly off-topic note about uploading pics. BMPs are hefty files but can quickly be converted into much smaller .PNG files by just <i>Saving As</i> a PNG. At the time of writing I don't have a decent image editing tool that can compress BMPs into decent quality jpegs, so that's what I use.
[On topic] It's good to see bert's still on this. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
i was to lazy to change them lol
Well at least i finished building the rooms <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> and i got it compiled.
There are still some bugs and the lightning is not really what it should be, since I forgot to add some texlights and have some overbright areas, im happy to concentrate on lightning now.
I also added a screen with the layout, i think it is quite okay.
Here are some screens (click to enlarge):
<a href="http://img47.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nsdisonbergalpha31om1.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/7817/nsdisonbergalpha31om1.th.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" /></a> <a href="http://img122.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nsdisonbergalpha32qq2.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/1886/nsdisonbergalpha32qq2.th.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" /></a> <a href="http://img71.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nsdisonbergalpha33eh5.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/184/nsdisonbergalpha33eh5.th.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" /></a> <a href="http://img47.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nsdisonbergalpha34vj7.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/1375/nsdisonbergalpha34vj7.th.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" /></a>
<a href="http://img75.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nsdisonbergalpha35vi9.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/9642/nsdisonbergalpha35vi9.th.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" /></a> <a href="http://img70.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nsdisonbergalpha36be7.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/5287/nsdisonbergalpha36be7.th.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" /></a> <a href="http://img159.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nsdisonbergalpha37du7.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/4457/nsdisonbergalpha37du7.th.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" /> </a>
<a href="http://www.brywright.co.uk/downloads/files/index.php?dir=natural-selection/maps/ns/&file=ns_disonberg_alpha3.zip" target="_blank">ns_disongerg_alpha3 click to download</a>
...
Map validity check failure: 17/32 ready room spawns, 28/16 team A spawns, 42/48 team B spawns
Might want to check your spawn entities <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
...
In the U-turn with glass window, you turned the stairs iinto func_walls I guess. If you place a building on it or walk over it you or the building will be pitch black. Simple reason for this: HL lights entities from a normal brush surface from the floor . In this case since the floor (underneath the stairs func_walls) is pitchblack, all models (buildings/players) will also be pitchblack. Pretty easy to fix this, you can simply move the stair steps back to world brush (rightclick menu on entity)
...
The complex floor in the south hive creates some weird clipping hulls, perhaps simplify the floor there ( this will also will reduce r_speeds). If you used clipping brushes on it, which was my second guess. Try and simplyfy the floor anyway and try it without the clipping brush, I'm not sure you can build on clipbrush.
...
Last thing I've think you might want to change is related to the layout of some hallways.
Some hallways are very long and because of this you are able to look down a long distance, sometimes into another complex area. This will scewup VIS and also add unecesary r_speeds. To fix this you should put some bends in these long corridors or perhaps a visblocker so you cannot see down these very long hallways.
Hope this helps you somewhat <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
<img src="http://img458.imageshack.us/img458/8788/nsdisonbergalpha50000zi5.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<img src="http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/746/nsdisonbergalpha50001ea7.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<img src="http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/1451/nsdisonbergalpha50002vg8.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<img src="http://img457.imageshack.us/img457/9398/nsdisonbergalpha50004uj8.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<a href="http://www.brywright.co.uk/downloads/files/index.php?dir=natural-selection/maps/ns/&file=ns_disonberg_alpha5.zip" target="_blank">Get it here - alpha 5</a>
Looking great!
Once im done with the compile im gonna shoot that map a few times and post the bodies here <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> I also hope i can get some guys into playtesting it...
Wow what a push! It seems im getting my first beta finished in a couple of hours, i tweaked the lighning quite a lot since i wanted to get some color in my map. And i got rid of all r_speed issues (you might find it jump up to 715 in one or two spots but i hope this is forgiveable <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Once im done with the compile im gonna shoot that map a few times and post the bodies here <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> I also hope i can get some guys into playtesting it...
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->If you can find a server to PT it I'm there. PM for my info when you secure a server.
As promised i packed some screens into the first post (you gotta click them to enlarge - thx to imagshacks register/login humbug). The download link is there too. Id love to see some of you try out the map ingame - its really big and I alway feel uncomftable whan taking screens <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> (I want a panorama screenshot function)
until i get some critics grrr! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> For example im gonna improve the hive (2nd pic) in lighntning. Sadly i got my good old alloc block full error back (im soooo glad <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />) so im slowed down again... I also have to start studying now again ah well wish me luck
I like it alot how long did it take to come up with the final design ?
Edit: sry i forgot about the minimap. However it is the same you can make yourself with the buildminimap command
<a href="http://www.brywright.co.uk/downloads/files/index.php?dir=natural-selection/maps/ns/&file=ns_disonberg_beta2withres.zip" target="_blank">ns_disonberg_beta2.zip</a>
I will try to get the map on a few servers, i may post links in here. Im quite curious how it plays...
Sek2000
212.27.128.146:27016
85.14.216.212:27016
85.14.216.212:27015
G4B2S
66.228.126.57:27015
The map is in the map cycle and can be voted
Also, the top left hive, it really shouldnt have its node outside like that. The node is practically where the tf would be in a siege from that side.
Other than that... its looking pretty good, but maybe a bit overcomplicated. Take a long look at the routes, see if anything would be too winding.
Good siege ranges too.
I just walked around a bit. I like the theme in general, but I have some little things to say :
I don't really like the lightning scheme. Dunno why, maybe it's due to the texture usage. The map is imo too complex. There are so many corridors. I've been lost some times in your map, that isn't good.
The infestation could be better.
I don't like the glass doors, they open too quickly and don't make any noise. There are not many sounds in your map too, try to make it more living.
That's it, keep up the good job <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink-fix.gif" />
The map is SOLID, no doubt about it.
but the complexity kills it and lighting definitely doesnt do it justice.
Its time to merge some corridors together and use those ideas and extra polys into other places.
But i do beg you to work on the lights. Its overall... too lit up, too flooded. Think spotlights. lots of em.
Exterminated that alloc block full error
Added couple of ambient sounds
rebuilt some very narrow corridors
added new vents in toxic hive and cargo hive
fixed a some stuck points and invisible walls
made some hall/doorways more onos friendly
I've come to terms with this, and it's a cool idea.
I'll check out the map when I can. BTW, are the screens in the original post up-to-date?
Think of siege maps. Imagine if they only had 10 nodes total? They'd be horrible. Siege is only fun whatsoever because its unlimited res (pretty much).
I personally dislike bast solely because there's only 8 rts. Its too hard to control enough, and every time one goes down, everyone kinda just sighs in frustration. On maps with 10 rts, its not as big of a deal.
<img src="http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/3501/minimapkv5.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />