If it helps anything, I've been testing the Steam Server Browser method that Kittamaru suggested, and it also gives me the error half the time as well. If anything that's slightly worse as I have to wait for NS to launch, and then crash cause sometimes it'll fiinish loading the map and get into the server in question other times it would crash half way through map loading (again this is when using the Steam Server browser, NS itself still only crashes with the mss32 error on startup never in the middle of a map).
<!--quoteo(post=1602663:date=Jan 29 2007, 03:07 PM:name=DC_Darkling)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DC_Darkling @ Jan 29 2007, 03:07 PM) [snapback]1602663[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> this gets real sick. I know you can't get a huge MBed debug file over, also due to security. You did mail valve yes? <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Eh, I've done searches on the steampowered.com forums, only issues with Miles relates to the old HL2 stuttering sound bug that was rampant around late 2004 when HL2 came out.
I don't think it's a Valve issue still. I can guarantee this problem has never cropped up in CS 1.6, TFC, etc No other HL1 game has crashed on me with a mss32.dll error. No insult to the NS devs, love the game, but it is somehow a NS issue and my PC.
I could host the logs, I've got the space to do so, what security issues are there? Not worried about my SteamID being in there, unless they contain encrypted versions of my login name and pw I'm not concerned about sharing a log of crashes and such.
DC_DarklingJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
debug file is a dumpfile of your kernel and memory.. lets not go there. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
DC_DarklingJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
you are in luck. NS is HL1 which I know how to low.. alot. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
developer 1 (set to 2 if 1 still lacks needed info) condebug 1 (enable to write a file in the root folder (not valve) called qconsole.log. This is your entire console. condump (console command to dump the console to a condumpXXX.txt where XXX is a number.
This together will create some massive spamming in logs which can help alot.
Second, I can't do a condump. Think about it, my issue is NS crashes upon startup with a specific error. Now if I need to be able to open the console and type in condump, I need NS not to crash. Chicken and the egg. I can't get a console dump of the error or why the error occurs, if the error doesn't occur.
DC_DarklingJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
your game loadsup to a degree where it onyl enables the qconsole.log. I suggest running developer 2 so it logs way more info. (Is there a dev 3? I never tried)
If it won't log more info its still to early to log in the boot process
Nope, same thing. I get the same results in qconsole.log with developer set to 1 <i>or</i> 2 ;(
Still just says nothing but "condebug enabled". Maybe it writes another error log to somewhere? the qconsole.log is always located in my root half-life folder.
The weird part that gets me (and this isn't a complain more of a curiosity) is;
A) why does it happen X amount of times on startup of NS then it doesn't happen X amount of times allowing me to play just fine?
B) why does it happen either more frequently or less frequently sometimes? maybe this is just my mind playing tricks on me but some days, I'll only get the error once or twice, other days it'll take me almost 5 minutes to get a "stable" NS that doesn't crash upon startup
While I'd still love the answer to the big question as to why it happens in the first place, knowing why it doesn't happen every X amount of time would also be nice, maybe then I could replicate the effects of it not happening on a full time basis. So, any ideas? Like what about those drwatson logs? i got the space to host them just tell me if there's any sensitive information i need to edit out and i will.
DC_DarklingJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
hmm.. no it IS the qconsole.log file. Simply means your NS crashes before anything interesting happens. Note that playing a LAN game as listenserver should spam that log due to the fact that you are server.
Can you play LAN with the miles codec forced enabled?
the dr watson logs contain everything your kernel was working with, and perhaps even your entire memory at the time of the crash. You can't edit it out, if you could, you did not need someone else to read the damned logs.
And if we are speaking about the same logs, we should, there .dmp files.
I've never tried to run NS as a LAN game. I can do that easily with other HL1 games, no mss32 errors as usual. Assuming I need to be able to Create Server via the NS menu to start a LAN game then no I wouldn't be able too. I'd need NS not to crash on startup for that to work. Assuming it doesn't crash then yea I'm sure it would work just fine, I've played on servers using the Miles Codec once NS is started up stable it doesn't crash out even on a Miles operating server.
Part of me is worried this might somehow be damaging my Windows install. I know a decent bit about the OS but there's always some things a program or application does behind the scenes you aren't aware of. Like I play NS daily right, it can't be good for my kernel and installation of Windows to force Steam and the HL.exe to keep crashing on a day to day basis, over and over until it "stabilizes" for me to play. If that makes any sense..?
DC_DarklingJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
winxp is pretty stable at this. pre windowsxp try. Your programs are kept seperated from the kernel OS integrals) so a crash usually does no staying damage. I would not worry about that to much. Not for something like NS/Steam.
I tested so many stuff, had countless bluescreens, and now I no longer test stuff it runs fine. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
As for shortcutting yourself into a LAN (not internet): "C:\Program Files\Steam\Steam.exe" -applaunch 70 -game ns +connect XXX.XXX.XXX.XXX:27015 where the XXX stand for your ip. I guess you can try the loopback one 127.0.0.1 or your local ip since its LAN
This is kind of a long shot. But searching Google i got the impression that mss32.dll has a problem with integrated sound chips from realtek AC97 or the like. This is in no sense verified but just a feeling i got reading a lot of game forums. Seems like a lot of people have similar problems using AC97 sound chip.
I would suggest you could try disabling the sound in BIOS, to see if it makes a difference. if the problem disappear, you can with certainty conclude that the sound system is the problem. If it doesn't, then its more of a application problem with the mss32.dll
If everything works with "no sound" the next step would be to try a plug in sound card to see if the problem arises again with the "new" sound card. If the problem stays away, you can conclude with certainty that the onboard sound chip driver has compatibility issues with mss32.dll.
if it doesn't work.. well.. then you are back to square one.
@steelcut, while that may be one length to go, and i thank you for the suggestion, but i aint doing anything with my BIOS. while i know a little about it and such, i also know enough not to fiddle with it due to not knowing enough. i've got the one PC here and i'd rather not fubar the BIOS.
and (again) I also don't think it's a soundcard issue. As Darkling points out, he has no issues with his onboard sound. And I myself, have used several games in the past that use Miles with no errors, hell CS 1.6 uses it does it not? I get absolutely no Mss32 related errors with CS 1.6, HL1, TFC, etc not to mention non-HL games that also work with Miles in some manner.
DC_DarklingJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
My search on the, now by me famous dll, came up without a need for that specific version. In other words, you can try using a newer version. Since NS crashes it means NS needs the dll. perhaps paste a dll from a working game into the ns dir?
running out ideas here.
Also flashing the bios is on most mobos not a big prob and easy to use. If you need a walkthrough for it, just enlighten me on what mobo you got and I will dig it up for ya.
Well I have tried "updating" the Miles files, I went to RAD's website and got the latest version of the Miles stuff, installed it then copy/pasted the appropriate files.
That, actually works even worse than the default version. Instead of crashing with a mss32.dll error, NS completely crashed upon startup with some weird error code I had never seen. I assume this was due to the new version of Mss32.dll cause it never, ever gave me that error with the old one. So I just replaced the new ones with the old ones again and it was back to random mss32.dll errors at random times.
I'll try replacing the files with ones from the CS folder (if there are any, I think they all just stay in the HL folder) and see if that works.
And thanks for the help but I'm not tinkering with the BIOS or anything. I've got the one PC so if I screw it up some how, I'm without a way to game online <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
k, I tried copying over the Mss32.dll (and any files I thought were related) from my CS 1.6 folder to my HL folder, as well as copies in the NS folder and the dll/cl_dll folders (just to try). Same error.
I don't get why if CS 1.6 uses the same dll, the same default voice codec of Miles, does CS 1.6 never crash? I play 1.6 occasionally, but not nearly as much as NS. It's got to be something in NS, some way it uses the dll or hooks into it differently than CS 1.6 does? I'm pretty sure other HL based games use it, TFC, Death Match, DoD, etc right? I get no error in those games either. I'm not blaming NS, I still love the game but damn, this is one curious error.
DC_DarklingJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
I checked my comp and only have one in my HL1 steam dir. My NS does not have the file. As we all know HL mods use everything from the root dir if the mod dit does not contain it. Can always try?
Well, I've got at least two copies; It's in the \steamapps\username\counterstrike\ folder, the other is in the \steamapps\username\half-life\ folder. Double checking, I also have the same files in the TFC folder, Ricochet folder and Death Match Classic folder (these were installed default, not the ones I copied over in the test I did above) Same files, same file size etc Except as said, CS/TFC/DM/Ricochet never crashes for some odd reason whereas NS does (with this error). If the other mods use the same files, but don't do anything of the similar error I have no idea why NS seems to.
Tried that (mentioned it earlier, I think). I've put copies of the Mss32.dll (and any related files that look like they are related to it) in the NS folder, as well as the dll folder and cl_dll folder inside the NS folder. Same error occurs.
Hell I tried deleting the Mss32.dll out of the HL folder, just to see if it would give me an error about missing a file, the game simply re-downloaded it or replaced it some how cause after I launched NS the next time (which ironically it didn't crash that one particular time) the file was back in the HL folder even after I deleted it.
Well for all I know it just worked "that" time after I deleted it. Like any of the fixes we've tested so far, I have to actually start NS several times, to see if it will crash or not crash. Sometimes, ironically when we apply a solution, it doesn't crash at that time but a few minutes later an hour later, it'll crash again on startup, if that makes sense.
That and, something tells me it shouldn't be deleted so many times, I mean if it's deleted every time I startup NS, that can't be good for the HL setup, or at least it doesn't sound like it.
DC_DarklingJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
should not matter for your HL install really.
Hm.. Still think the solution might be in the damned dumpfile but I doubt its that easy to take out since we already know its the miles dll. Googling on the exact error came dry yes?
Comments
there was a way to register dlls. Perhaps it never grabbed the dll
this gets real sick. I know you can't get a huge MBed debug file over, also due to security. You did mail valve yes?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Eh, I've done searches on the steampowered.com forums, only issues with Miles relates to the old HL2 stuttering sound bug that was rampant around late 2004 when HL2 came out.
I don't think it's a Valve issue still. I can guarantee this problem has never cropped up in CS 1.6, TFC, etc No other HL1 game has crashed on me with a mss32.dll error. No insult to the NS devs, love the game, but it is somehow a NS issue and my PC.
I could host the logs, I've got the space to do so, what security issues are there? Not worried about my SteamID being in there, unless they contain encrypted versions of my login name and pw I'm not concerned about sharing a log of crashes and such.
you can check logs from steam I guess
this is one from tonight, almost all of them say the same stuff (this is a copy/paste after I started Steam, Started NS for it to crash once);
<!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1-->1170387103: SteamStart 49985
1170387107: SteamLogin ***************************
1170387107: SteamUpdateStart 1 273 mountplatformcache
1170387111: SteamUpdateStart 1 273 loadplatformcache
1170387111: SteamUpdated 0
1170387137: GameRequested 70
1170387138: GameStart 70 8
1170387157: GameEnd 70 0 RunFrame
1170387159: GameRequested 70
1170387160: GameStart 70 8
1170387184: GameEnd 70 0 RunFrame
<!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->
Is there anyway to make NS log the client side? I know servers can log stuff to /ns/logs but I dunno if a client can
developer 1 (set to 2 if 1 still lacks needed info)
condebug 1 (enable to write a file in the root folder (not valve) called qconsole.log. This is your entire console.
condump (console command to dump the console to a condumpXXX.txt where XXX is a number.
This together will create some massive spamming in logs which can help alot.
First, I got a qconsole.log file like you said, via the cvars you gave me. Inside the log is nothing but;
<!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1-->condebug enabled
condebug enabled
<!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->
Second, I can't do a condump. Think about it, my issue is NS crashes upon startup with a specific error. Now if I need to be able to open the console and type in condump, I need NS not to crash. Chicken and the egg. I can't get a console dump of the error or why the error occurs, if the error doesn't occur.
I suggest running developer 2 so it logs way more info. (Is there a dev 3? I never tried)
If it won't log more info its still to early to log in the boot process
Still just says nothing but "condebug enabled". Maybe it writes another error log to somewhere? the qconsole.log is always located in my root half-life folder.
A) why does it happen X amount of times on startup of NS then it doesn't happen X amount of times allowing me to play just fine?
B) why does it happen either more frequently or less frequently sometimes? maybe this is just my mind playing tricks on me but some days, I'll only get the error once or twice, other days it'll take me almost 5 minutes to get a "stable" NS that doesn't crash upon startup
While I'd still love the answer to the big question as to why it happens in the first place, knowing why it doesn't happen every X amount of time would also be nice, maybe then I could replicate the effects of it not happening on a full time basis. So, any ideas? Like what about those drwatson logs? i got the space to host them just tell me if there's any sensitive information i need to edit out and i will.
Note that playing a LAN game as listenserver should spam that log due to the fact that you are server.
Can you play LAN with the miles codec forced enabled?
the dr watson logs contain everything your kernel was working with, and perhaps even your entire memory at the time of the crash. You can't edit it out, if you could, you did not need someone else to read the damned logs.
And if we are speaking about the same logs, we should, there .dmp files.
Part of me is worried this might somehow be damaging my Windows install. I know a decent bit about the OS but there's always some things a program or application does behind the scenes you aren't aware of. Like I play NS daily right, it can't be good for my kernel and installation of Windows to force Steam and the HL.exe to keep crashing on a day to day basis, over and over until it "stabilizes" for me to play. If that makes any sense..?
I tested so many stuff, had countless bluescreens, and now I no longer test stuff it runs fine. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
As for shortcutting yourself into a LAN (not internet): "C:\Program Files\Steam\Steam.exe" -applaunch 70 -game ns +connect XXX.XXX.XXX.XXX:27015
where the XXX stand for your ip. I guess you can try the loopback one 127.0.0.1 or your local ip since its LAN
But searching Google i got the impression that mss32.dll has a problem with integrated sound chips from realtek AC97 or the like.
This is in no sense verified but just a feeling i got reading a lot of game forums. Seems like a lot of people have similar problems using AC97 sound chip.
I would suggest you could try disabling the sound in BIOS, to see if it makes a difference. if the problem disappear, you can with certainty conclude that the sound system is the problem. If it doesn't, then its more of a application problem with the mss32.dll
If everything works with "no sound" the next step would be to try a plug in sound card to see if the problem arises again with the "new" sound card. If the problem stays away, you can conclude with certainty that the onboard sound chip driver has compatibility issues with mss32.dll.
if it doesn't work.. well.. then you are back to square one.
But I will regoogle it, and see what I can find
>edit. You did update the drivers for your motherboards chipsets? If its a onboard soundcard it might help to upgrade mobo stuff, not just sound<
@steelcut, while that may be one length to go, and i thank you for the suggestion, but i aint doing anything with my BIOS. while i know a little about it and such, i also know enough not to fiddle with it due to not knowing enough. i've got the one PC here and i'd rather not fubar the BIOS.
and (again) I also don't think it's a soundcard issue. As Darkling points out, he has no issues with his onboard sound. And I myself, have used several games in the past that use Miles with no errors, hell CS 1.6 uses it does it not? I get absolutely no Mss32 related errors with CS 1.6, HL1, TFC, etc not to mention non-HL games that also work with Miles in some manner.
Same error. Put in it a shortcut, included my IP, same crash same Mss32 error.
In other words, you can try using a newer version. Since NS crashes it means NS needs the dll. perhaps paste a dll from a working game into the ns dir?
running out ideas here.
Also flashing the bios is on most mobos not a big prob and easy to use. If you need a walkthrough for it, just enlighten me on what mobo you got and I will dig it up for ya.
That, actually works even worse than the default version. Instead of crashing with a mss32.dll error, NS completely crashed upon startup with some weird error code I had never seen. I assume this was due to the new version of Mss32.dll cause it never, ever gave me that error with the old one. So I just replaced the new ones with the old ones again and it was back to random mss32.dll errors at random times.
I'll try replacing the files with ones from the CS folder (if there are any, I think they all just stay in the HL folder) and see if that works.
And thanks for the help but I'm not tinkering with the BIOS or anything. I've got the one PC so if I screw it up some how, I'm without a way to game online <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
I don't get why if CS 1.6 uses the same dll, the same default voice codec of Miles, does CS 1.6 never crash? I play 1.6 occasionally, but not nearly as much as NS. It's got to be something in NS, some way it uses the dll or hooks into it differently than CS 1.6 does? I'm pretty sure other HL based games use it, TFC, Death Match, DoD, etc right? I get no error in those games either. I'm not blaming NS, I still love the game but damn, this is one curious error.
My NS does not have the file. As we all know HL mods use everything from the root dir if the mod dit does not contain it. Can always try?
Hell I tried deleting the Mss32.dll out of the HL folder, just to see if it would give me an error about missing a file, the game simply re-downloaded it or replaced it some how cause after I launched NS the next time (which ironically it didn't crash that one particular time) the file was back in the HL folder even after I deleted it.
When you delete the file before starting NS it works always.
Then I can easily rig you a shortcut which runs a batchfile to delete that file before NS boots up.
Better then nothing
That and, something tells me it shouldn't be deleted so many times, I mean if it's deleted every time I startup NS, that can't be good for the HL setup, or at least it doesn't sound like it.
Hm.. Still think the solution might be in the damned dumpfile but I doubt its that easy to take out since we already know its the miles dll.
Googling on the exact error came dry yes?