Mobile Chambers
Khaze
Join Date: 2006-12-12 Member: 59031Members
Join Date: 2006-12-12 Member: 59031Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Gorges able to carry chambers around on their back</div>This idea occured to me, that, what if a Gorge would be able evolve chambers on their backs? Sort of like a symbiosis with the chamber.
You could allow a Gorge to evolve a single chamber on their back, and basically become a mobile chamber themselves.
For example, you could have a Gorge to build a Sensory Chamber on his back. Because the Gorge is carrying the chamber on his back, his movement speed would be slowed down, and the chamber wouldn't be linked to any hive, nor the other Kharaa could be able to upgrade anything the chamber would normally give. Instead, the chamber on the Gorges back would simply grant the benefits of a stationary chamber, in this case, everyone friendly around the Gorge (including the Gorge itself) would be cloaked, and every hostile around the Gorge would show up as Scent of Fear.
Same thing with Movement, Defence and Offence chambers.
With Movement Chamber, every friendly around the Gorge would receive the adrenaline recharge boost, and the Gorge would also be able to be used as a mobile teleport to the furthest hive, as with the stationary MCs aswell. The increased adrenaline recharge would also apply for the Gorge itself.
With Defence Chamber, every friendly around the Gorge would again receive the same benefits as the stationary counterparts, increased health regeneration rate. The Gorge itself should also get increased health regeneration rate.
With Offence Chamber, the Gorge would basically become a mobile OC, with perhaps a bit faster rate of fire and/or damage than the stationary counterparts.
The benefits of all the chambers would only become active if the Gorge hasn't moved for a couple of seconds, so you couldn't, say, evolve an MC and run behind an Onos stomping everything with infinite adrenaline due to the MCs ability to restore adrenaline. All the upgrades of the chamber that the Gorge wanted to evolve would also be blocked out, so a Gorge couldn't take, say, a DC chamber and Regeneration to get insane regeneration rates. Or as another example, by having a delay on the effects it would also mean a Gorge couldn't run around with a Sensory Chamber and be cloaked all the time, but they would have to stand still to activate the benefits of that chamber.
I would imagine that if a Gorge built a chamber on his back, he would gestate in egg-form for roughly 10 seconds and it would cost 20-25 resources to evolve it.
The chamber would also be permanent untill the Gorge dies or evolves in to another lifeform.
Thoughts?
You could allow a Gorge to evolve a single chamber on their back, and basically become a mobile chamber themselves.
For example, you could have a Gorge to build a Sensory Chamber on his back. Because the Gorge is carrying the chamber on his back, his movement speed would be slowed down, and the chamber wouldn't be linked to any hive, nor the other Kharaa could be able to upgrade anything the chamber would normally give. Instead, the chamber on the Gorges back would simply grant the benefits of a stationary chamber, in this case, everyone friendly around the Gorge (including the Gorge itself) would be cloaked, and every hostile around the Gorge would show up as Scent of Fear.
Same thing with Movement, Defence and Offence chambers.
With Movement Chamber, every friendly around the Gorge would receive the adrenaline recharge boost, and the Gorge would also be able to be used as a mobile teleport to the furthest hive, as with the stationary MCs aswell. The increased adrenaline recharge would also apply for the Gorge itself.
With Defence Chamber, every friendly around the Gorge would again receive the same benefits as the stationary counterparts, increased health regeneration rate. The Gorge itself should also get increased health regeneration rate.
With Offence Chamber, the Gorge would basically become a mobile OC, with perhaps a bit faster rate of fire and/or damage than the stationary counterparts.
The benefits of all the chambers would only become active if the Gorge hasn't moved for a couple of seconds, so you couldn't, say, evolve an MC and run behind an Onos stomping everything with infinite adrenaline due to the MCs ability to restore adrenaline. All the upgrades of the chamber that the Gorge wanted to evolve would also be blocked out, so a Gorge couldn't take, say, a DC chamber and Regeneration to get insane regeneration rates. Or as another example, by having a delay on the effects it would also mean a Gorge couldn't run around with a Sensory Chamber and be cloaked all the time, but they would have to stand still to activate the benefits of that chamber.
I would imagine that if a Gorge built a chamber on his back, he would gestate in egg-form for roughly 10 seconds and it would cost 20-25 resources to evolve it.
The chamber would also be permanent untill the Gorge dies or evolves in to another lifeform.
Thoughts?
Comments
Would not like to see an actual chamber on his back, just change the model a little so it is easy to determine the upgrade for the gorge.
Makes the gorge more fun and supportive in battles, I vote yes.
See MC for example, it gives you 25% percent adrenaline boost every 2 seconds. That's pretty much infinite adrenaline, which thus renders the "Adrenaline" upgrade useless.
For DC, however, all the upgrades only BOOST the effects of the chamber, as the benefits of the chamber itself aren't big enough to completely render any of the upgrades useless.
And if the Gorge decided to get the Sensory Chamber, you'd render pretty much all the upgrades of that chamber useless, except for Focus. You'd always be invisible and you would always see every enemy nearby you as Scent of Fear.
Perhaps you should just rawly disable all upgrades from the Gorge if he chose to evolve a chamber, or something.
Any suggestions?
See MC for example, it gives you 25% percent adrenaline boost every 2 seconds. That's pretty much infinite adrenaline, which thus renders the "Adrenaline" upgrade useless.
Any suggestions?
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Biling gorges run out of adrenaline nearby one mc.
But I agree with your point.
Of course one could exclude the gorge from the chamber's effect, but that would decrease the fun part of the idea for the gorge.
Maybe it would help that the chamber effects are only activated when the gorge doesn't move for 1-2? sec.
I agree that the gorge need to stand still.
The gorge shouldn´t have the Chambers on his back
but he might change his form, just a litte bit. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/pudgy.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::gorge::" border="0" alt="pudgy.gif" />
This will give a few new ways of gameplay..these are
very nice ideas. Gorges will be much more important in
the game. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/pudgy.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::gorge::" border="0" alt="pudgy.gif" />
This is me, as a gorge, with an SC on my back, building a wall of lame, with each OC being pretty much invisible a few seconds after I drop it, with no up front cost for cloaking, and just the cost at the end for the SC, if I'm going to leave that wall (Which I never used to do)
This is me, as a skulk, cloaking evolved (which is my standard MC upgrade), sneaking up to a safe place with a view, evolving to gorge, then with an MC on my back, and 1 nearby, bileing the hell out of your outpost.
This is me, as a gorge, with a DC on my back, healspraying you to death....
See my point?
See my point?
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I just see that you haven't read thoroughly the whole thread.
And I'm curious, since when can you get cloak from MC <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/nerd-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::nerdy::" border="0" alt="nerd-fix.gif" />
Walls of Lame aren't even worth the discussion.
These happen when aliens have enough res anyway or some gorge wastes res on it instead of building something useful for his team.
It's not like cloaked WoLs change positions after some marine has discovered them, thus he and probably his team know it for the future.
Biling some outpost with mc ("on your back") means you may not move because otherwise the mc won't work, thus you are an easy target. Moreover you can already bile outposts with adrenaline and easily destroy it if the marines don't care.
That's why comms should choose their outpost places carefully.
Again, the dc on your back won't work when you move. I want to see a marine dieing to a healspraying gorge that doesn't move at all.
Try again.
besides does the words "overpowered much" tell you anything.
3 gorges with 3 diffrent chambers on their backs.....running about.
this screams of overpowered and lame.UNLESS marines get the abilty to siege gorges as they are seen as structures,not aliens,but still not convinced about this idea.
remember the big discussion that came up when gorges were able to healspray themselves? the "omg overpowered" one.
Gorges now do reduced heal to themselves i believe ,as outcome of that discussion.
nuff said.
As far as I am aware, chamber area effects do NOT stop working when you move, excepting Cloak, which diminishes the faster you move. A gorge with a chamber on its back would never move out of range of the effect, and would therefore get the full effect of the chamber <b>regardless of if they're moving or not</b>. A gorge with cloak evolved, and an MC on their back would be about 85-90% invisible moving at the proposed speed. That's a shadow, able to give mobile adrenaline support, and not have to spend any resources <b>or</b> time building the necessary chambers to support their team.
Think along the lines of the Imperial Guard on-field artillery. It's hard to reach, incredibly effective at support, and can easily clear an entire group out with some help. It's also easy to kill if found. That would be a bile gorge with an MC on its back, and cloaking evolved. Except this would be even more annoying, because the gorge can change position if they're shot at, and the attacker gets killed. The chamber can't do this, or you have to waste even more resources, and time, by building another chamber. Over the course of a battle, that's a lot of res, especially if the chamber is in a holding position, to block the movement, or to support a defence of a high throughput area.
Also, if you think that a wall of lame is used to kill people, then you are sadly mistaken. A Wall of Lame is used to either tie up the marine resources, by getting them either to have to siege the wall, which takes time, and resources, for the commander to equip a couple of grenade launchers, and for the team to take them and destroy the wall, or to force the marines down another, more convient route for the aliens. A cloaked Onos standing in this route can be the most effective tool in this alternative route. If they go down the alternative route, then thye march to either their deaths, or to a damaging trap. If they decide to siege, then the commander, and a few of the team, are being distracted long enough for an attack to take place. Dropping a wall is much more than just to kill people. It's about changing the flow of the marines, or causing an important enough distraction to warrant heavy intervention.
The idea IS that the gorge-chamber only works when he's NOT moving for at least 2 seconds or more and the chamber stops working immediatly when the gorges starts moving.
so some features of chambers are rendered useless,because i dont see why a fade should have to stand still for 2 seconds or more.
or an onos,to get a desired effect of the chamber.
if you only nerf the gorge in this way,it will still scream discrimination,
and you get that discussion rolling.
in either way i still dont see the point of this change, nor what good it will do.
I don't see how it would scream discrimination, as the Gorge is sacrificing his own speed and possibly the ability to evolve any upgrades for himself in exchange for a great support ability for his team.
And Lt Path, you're merely pointing out and kicking down the flaws with the original idea. Why don't you try and enhance the idea, instead of throwing mud at it? Even if you don't like the idea, it's not up to you or me for that matter to decide wheter this is worth getting in to NS2, that's completely up to the devolopers, and our job is merely to toss out ideas that are as perfect as they can be, so they can pick the ones that seem good, if any.
The chamber upgrade for the Gorge would only work if the Gorge wasn't moving, but this wouldn't apply for other aliens. Meaning, a Gorge was sitting in a corner, and an Onos ran in to the area, the Onos would immediately get the benefits of that chamber, like they do with the stationary chambers. Hell, you could even prevent the Gorge from getting ANY of the upgrades from any chambers if they had evolved a chamber-upgrade.
I would imagine evolving this would also cost a fair bit of resources, like 20, so the Gorge would have to think twice before getting one.
How stupid would it be, if an alien has to stand still for 2 sec. to benefit from the gorge.
The gorge behaves like a simple upgrade chamber
-after he invested some res to choose one of the 3 chambers as special ability
-stands still for 2 sec. at least
-as long as he keeps standing still
Even attacking could interrupt the effect of the chamber in the name of balance.
As Khaze said, there are even more balance options.
It's more like a fast support chamber build than an additional upgrade for the gorge.
maybe you should update your first post depending on the discussion results.
We don't need more ppl shooting the initial idea down just to increase their postcount and without reading the whole thread and the developement of your idea.
so im sorry if my post offends you,but its not about me not reading the initial post,or gods forbid boost my postcount.
i'm simply saying,its a creative idea.but i dont think its a good idea?!
im simply trying to imply you cant change anything without having some sort of chain reaction.
change it for 1 class of alien,it spins out of balance,so in most cases change it for all.
but my thoughts arent good enough i guess,so ill just leave it at that.
Perhaps the gorge can only build a chamber on it's back in coherent with the hive chamber, i,e someone drops a MC so the gorges can only evolve an mc chamber on thier back.
And the gorges can only evolve with this chamber AFTER a hive chamber has been dropped.
This would promote dropping chambers @ the start of the game a little more.
blablbalbla, onos is going going, ooooo look, marines there, lets stomp them so skulks can kill them, hahhahahahah they are so dead. UNBALANCED
1. The Gorge is only able to get a chamber which has already been locked in to a Hive.
2. The Gorge doesn't get slowed down as I originally suggested.
3. The Gorge doesn't get any of the benefits given by that chamber himself, only those around him.
4. This "mobile chamber" doesn't unlock any upgrades, so if all your stationary chambers die and a mobile chamber survives, no upgrades for you.
5. Costs ~20 resources and takes ~10 seconds to gestate. Encourages specialisation among Gorges while preventing the Gorge from being at the frontlines due to high resource cost. (No running behind a stomping Onos to give him infinite adrenaline. You die and it's 30 resources wasted.)
6. Benefits only kick in when the Gorge is stationary. You could also have some sort of a "stance" for the Gorge, he could "anchor" himself to the ground to activate the chamber upgrade he has. Takes a couple of seconds to initiate. Hell, you could even link it to the Dynamic Infestation, only works when walking on that.
How's that?
What I'm trying to achieve here is further specialisation for Gorges, to make perma-gorges a bit more interesting, while not directly buffing the Gorge itself, but providing the ability to support his teammates pretty well.
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ok, now imagine a caraparace, adre onos with an adre gorgie healing it with an mc on its back, with 2 hives.
blablbalbla, onos is going going, ooooo look, marines there, lets stomp them so skulks can kill them, hahhahahahah they are so dead. UNBALANCED
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Are you saying a Gorge, an Onos and a couple of Skulks wouldn't be able to kill a couple of marines without the help of an MC...?
A Gorge with an MC upgrade (or any chamber for that matter) would only be able to use it under specific circumstances. It wouldn't be be always on, as you would know if you read the whole post I did.
Well what else can we work off???
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Use your creativity?
Well, you do have a point there, but what I'm saying is, discarding a new idea because it doesn't work with the current system is a nono. Simply because we have no way of telling if the new system will be anything like the old one.
TURTLE GORGE!!!! WEEEE