[edit] and with that, I donate proof of the sacrifice I made to this thread <img src='http://swiftspear.0x01a4.com/Img/IAM1337.JPG' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> <span style='font-size:6pt;line-height:100%'>Hint: postcount</span>
<!--QuoteBegin-Zunni+Jul 26 2004, 10:16 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Zunni @ Jul 26 2004, 10:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->There were more hitbox misallignments in 2.0 which probably were more noticeable, so if this bug was in play then maybe people thought that other bugs were responsible for the effects.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bingo... the fact that the hitboxes were wrong prior to 3.0 allowed many of these issues to be brushed over as part of that issue.. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Maybe now we'll be able to kill A Civilian when he fades <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Vindication, that sweetest liqueur that is wrought from the heart of a fallen foe.
Kudos on the gravesite, Head Crab, without you we wouldn't be burying this bug.
The same goes to all of you that'd made this possible, once again, much <3.
Now--let's just see how long it takes valve to release the update <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> I'd love to call this bug "FIXED FOR BETA 5"
Why nobody found this bug earlier, in almost 6 years? The reason:
Who would have thought that the last server slot would have had a role to play in this story? 2 or 3 players who would have agreed on this existence of this bug could have passed hundred of hours on their 12-slot test server, yet they wouldn't have found anything, ever.
In a normal game when a server is full, players might notice something wrong, yet they will either say "lag", "bad aim", "h4x" or they will simply continue playing without questioning themselves.
Many people in the whole Half-Life history have "noticed" this bug in many different mods, yet they had no idea what was really going on. And most of the times, there are other bugs that makes the researches harder. In many mods, there have always been hitbox and lag problems, which really didn't help this case.
I was myself very suspicious about this bug when Alpha talked to me about Sarisel's thread on the ns.org forum. The first step in finding a bug is to actually prove its existence, which is really hard sometimes. Alpha has kept an eye on the server for a while, trying to notice "bugged" players. He recorded demos that he's shown me and we've got tons of cases. Then we've been trying to build up some weird theories and we've been trying to reproduce the bug following those theories... on our 14-slot private server. Of course, we never got anything really worth mentioning from these early tests.
I learned coding in the Small language this year. When making plugins, we play a lot with the player ID system for many things. Many coders are aware that when making a <b>(new a = 1; a <= get_maxplayers(); a++)</b> to "apply" a code all the player IDs available on the server, it is very important not to confuse <= with <, otherwise the last ID available on the server will be ignored and the code won't be "applied".
Alpha and I have built a new theory having this coding problem in mind. So I created a 2-slot server and we've done some testing. Now, <b>surprise</b>, if I was in slot #2, Alpha could barely kill me while I was moving and same for him when he was in slot #2. Then we've done some massive testing with all classes, recording tons of demos and getting details of our discovery. We were pretty sure to have found the cause of the bug, but we wanted to be completely certain, so we did some massive testing the next day again and Alpha then sent an email to a bug exterminator.
Knowing this, we felt like we had to find a temporary fix quickly, at least for our server, where we play, since it really feels bad to play with the bug when you know about it and that "being good in a game" could be due only to the bug. The same day, we've had a fix ready and installed on the server. The fix was hiding 2 slots, so we lost 2 slots on our server and most people didn't really notice it, which was great. The early versions of the fixes were doing the job correctly, even though it had some issues which were later fixed.
Alpha later received an email from a bug exterminator, thanking him for the info and saying that they were going to do a few tests. Sarisel's thread on ns.org was then revived when Tyr^Nemesis said that they had tracked down the cause of the bug. Later, Sarisel himself was given the chance to playtest the fully reproduceable bug and posted some details in his thread, which became hugely popular, yet still ignored by most.
We later decided to release the fixes and the complete details of the bug in Sarisel's thread. I asked Mahnsawce to make a Metamod version of the fixes, so most servers could use them. While talking to Mahnsawce for the fixes, he pointed out the fact that it could be a problem with the lag compensation not being applied to the last player on the server. I had a lot of doubts, but after doing further tests with Alpha, while turning off lag compensation, it turned out to be true and Mahnsawce was right. Turning off lag compensation made all players "bugged". By that time, the NS team was theorically "fixing the bug" as I had been told and I assumed that they were aware about the lag compensation problem by then.
Then came the "delay" and I was really surprised to see that the bug was still part of what caused the delay. I sent a private message to Tyr^Nemesis asking him if they were aware that lag compensation was responsible and it seemed that they were not. I told him to test with sv_unlag or cl_lc turned to 0 and notice how every player is then bugged. Then came the new PSHB thread and then Valve was now part of the story, which I wouldn't have thought at first, and our discovery seemed now much more important than Alpha and I could have imagined.
I truely wish this bug would have been found earlier and I believe any coder with some reasoning could have come to a theory like ours at some time. It's just sad that it took so many years.
Now, don't get this wrong: good players are good players and bad players are still bad players. It's not like a specific player joined a game and always had the last ID.
Biggest thanks to Sarisel (Saraph) and Alpha, because without them, this bug would have probably never been found, since many players are starting to leave Half-Life for newer games. Sarisel was convinced of the existence of the bug and so was Alpha. Alpha then forced me to work with him like a slave to find the problem =P.
Big thanks to Mahnsawce as well, not only for losing time with us on our test server =P, but also for the lag compensation remark which has made a "DOOOONG" in the head of the people trying to fix the bug.
Now that this bug is tracked down and about to be fixed, there are still many other bugs in Half-Life and its mods. I think it's really important to report these, as they will make the game more enjoyable for you. So I say: NEXT
I had a long e-mail conversation about this some months ago. But when it comes to the point of fixing they blame your client or server settings :|
I dont really know if this #N player theory is always true. All i can say that it was still ok in CS1.3 <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
You can read about the most important info/screenies/ingame demo's here:
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Sarisel's thread on ns.org was then revived when Nemesis Zero said that they had tracked down the cause of the bug.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No, no, that was me ^_^ People confuse us a lot. That's why I go by "Tyr" and he goes by "Nem".
It is good that people have epiphanies, once that one piece fell in place, everyone started realizing what was really going on with this bug. Once Elven got the word out, it spread like wildfire and this thread has had nearly 30000 views in the last 2 days.
Not even valve can ignore that kind of press.
As Head Crab says, there are still many more bugs to fix. I've logged another 4 or 5 tonight. This is a great moment, but i'll agree... NEXT
<!--QuoteBegin-TyrNemesis^+Jul 27 2004, 05:14 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TyrNemesis^ @ Jul 27 2004, 05:14 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Sarisel's thread on ns.org was then revived when Nemesis Zero said that they had tracked down the cause of the bug.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No, no, that was me ^_^ People confuse us a lot. That's why I go by "Tyr" and he goes by "Nem". <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> That is right =P -> corrected
<!--QuoteBegin-Rue+Jul 27 2004, 02:19 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Rue @ Jul 27 2004, 02:19 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I got banned from a server last night for being the last man on a CS server......I mean WTH? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Wow really? Is it that now everyone knows about it.
<!--QuoteBegin-Head crab+Jul 27 2004, 03:08 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Head crab @ Jul 27 2004, 03:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->it turned out to be true and Mahnsawce was right.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> When isn't he right?
You are always right Oh Holy Sawce <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-[mahn]sawce+Jul 27 2004, 01:34 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ([mahn]sawce @ Jul 27 2004, 01:34 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Head crab+Jul 27 2004, 03:08 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Head crab @ Jul 27 2004, 03:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->it turned out to be true and Mahnsawce was right.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> When isn't he right?
<!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, there was that one time...
<!--QuoteBegin-RaVe+Jul 27 2004, 08:07 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (RaVe @ Jul 27 2004, 08:07 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I really think these people that have tracked and observed the bug deserve a custom title of some sort. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Honorary Exterminator?
That sums up my feelings nicely. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
As I already stated in one of my previous posts, the PSHB-Bot temporary "fix" didn't work correctly and I have now a screenshot to explain it better.
As you can see in the image below, the bot is not using the bugged slot, due to map changes and connections/disconnections that there have been after a while.
Basically, that fix only worked once and it was on the first map that had full players. After that, it stops working correctly. I'm not even talking about all the issues that come with AMX when adding bots...
<!--QuoteBegin-Petco+Jul 27 2004, 09:29 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Petco @ Jul 27 2004, 09:29 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Rue+Jul 27 2004, 02:19 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Rue @ Jul 27 2004, 02:19 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I got banned from a server last night for being the last man on a CS server......I mean WTH? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wow really? Is it that now everyone knows about it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeh I know that, but getting banned cause I joined last? bit pathetic
Ah hell, I just realized taht those 'good' games I had used to have wasn't skill <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' /><!--endemo-->
On a side not that is in no way related to Pshb, how does the public NS community deal with 56kers? I'm worried that I'm wasting my time downloading NS now <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-M a t t h e w+Jul 27 2004, 04:29 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (M a t t h e w @ Jul 27 2004, 04:29 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> On a side not that is in no way related to Pshb, how does the public NS community deal with 56kers? I'm worried that I'm wasting my time downloading NS now <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> How do you mean deal? We have Client-Side prediction and Lag Compensation same as the majority of mods. What more could you need other than adding fakelag to people with a lower ping than you? If you're looking for 56K only servers you'd be hard pressed to find one in NS since 56kers are a dying breed.I recommend you get All-Seeing Eye & use it to find servers with the best latency for you and tweak your rate, cl_updaterate & cl_cmdrate accordingly.
This is completely off topic, but I just realized that the forum has changed so the "number of views" counter can go above 32,767 (something that was encountered during the nancy remake thread).
Hi, the TFC text describing the hitbox bug was written by me, so I'd just like to take the time to say a huge thank you for figuring this problem out as it's been the bane of the TFC community's existence for a good while now. A slight word of caution, though. I've seen more than one person affected by the bug on a single server, meaning there may be more ways to create the effect. This fix should stomp out most instances, but it may not be the end of this saga just yet.
* The Novel (to be featured on Oprah's Book Club) * The Movie * The TV Show * PSHB: Miami * PSHB: Crime Scene Investigation * PSHB: Special Victims Unit * Survivor: PSHB * Late Night with PSHB * PSHB Soundtrack featuring "OMG HAX!"
Comments
I might have to join Swiftspear with that bet too, they identified it really quickly meaning it has to be some sort of easy fix XD
[edit] and with that, I donate proof of the sacrifice I made to this thread
<img src='http://swiftspear.0x01a4.com/Img/IAM1337.JPG' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
<span style='font-size:6pt;line-height:100%'>Hint: postcount</span>
Bingo... the fact that the hitboxes were wrong prior to 3.0 allowed many of these issues to be brushed over as part of that issue.. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Maybe now we'll be able to kill A Civilian when he fades <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Kudos on the gravesite, Head Crab, without you we wouldn't be burying this bug.
The same goes to all of you that'd made this possible, once again, much <3.
Now--let's just see how long it takes valve to release the update <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> I'd love to call this bug "FIXED FOR BETA 5"
Who would have thought that the last server slot would have had a role to play in this story? 2 or 3 players who would have agreed on this existence of this bug could have passed hundred of hours on their 12-slot test server, yet they wouldn't have found anything, ever.
In a normal game when a server is full, players might notice something wrong, yet they will either say "lag", "bad aim", "h4x" or they will simply continue playing without questioning themselves.
Many people in the whole Half-Life history have "noticed" this bug in many different mods, yet they had no idea what was really going on. And most of the times, there are other bugs that makes the researches harder. In many mods, there have always been hitbox and lag problems, which really didn't help this case.
I was myself very suspicious about this bug when Alpha talked to me about Sarisel's thread on the ns.org forum. The first step in finding a bug is to actually prove its existence, which is really hard sometimes. Alpha has kept an eye on the server for a while, trying to notice "bugged" players. He recorded demos that he's shown me and we've got tons of cases. Then we've been trying to build up some weird theories and we've been trying to reproduce the bug following those theories... on our 14-slot private server. Of course, we never got anything really worth mentioning from these early tests.
I learned coding in the Small language this year. When making plugins, we play a lot with the player ID system for many things. Many coders are aware that when making a <b>(new a = 1; a <= get_maxplayers(); a++)</b> to "apply" a code all the player IDs available on the server, it is very important not to confuse <= with <, otherwise the last ID available on the server will be ignored and the code won't be "applied".
Alpha and I have built a new theory having this coding problem in mind. So I created a 2-slot server and we've done some testing. Now, <b>surprise</b>, if I was in slot #2, Alpha could barely kill me while I was moving and same for him when he was in slot #2. Then we've done some massive testing with all classes, recording tons of demos and getting details of our discovery. We were pretty sure to have found the cause of the bug, but we wanted to be completely certain, so we did some massive testing the next day again and Alpha then sent an email to a bug exterminator.
Knowing this, we felt like we had to find a temporary fix quickly, at least for our server, where we play, since it really feels bad to play with the bug when you know about it and that "being good in a game" could be due only to the bug. The same day, we've had a fix ready and installed on the server. The fix was hiding 2 slots, so we lost 2 slots on our server and most people didn't really notice it, which was great. The early versions of the fixes were doing the job correctly, even though it had some issues which were later fixed.
Alpha later received an email from a bug exterminator, thanking him for the info and saying that they were going to do a few tests. Sarisel's thread on ns.org was then revived when Tyr^Nemesis said that they had tracked down the cause of the bug. Later, Sarisel himself was given the chance to playtest the fully reproduceable bug and posted some details in his thread, which became hugely popular, yet still ignored by most.
We later decided to release the fixes and the complete details of the bug in Sarisel's thread. I asked Mahnsawce to make a Metamod version of the fixes, so most servers could use them. While talking to Mahnsawce for the fixes, he pointed out the fact that it could be a problem with the lag compensation not being applied to the last player on the server. I had a lot of doubts, but after doing further tests with Alpha, while turning off lag compensation, it turned out to be true and Mahnsawce was right. Turning off lag compensation made all players "bugged". By that time, the NS team was theorically "fixing the bug" as I had been told and I assumed that they were aware about the lag compensation problem by then.
Then came the "delay" and I was really surprised to see that the bug was still part of what caused the delay. I sent a private message to Tyr^Nemesis asking him if they were aware that lag compensation was responsible and it seemed that they were not. I told him to test with sv_unlag or cl_lc turned to 0 and notice how every player is then bugged. Then came the new PSHB thread and then Valve was now part of the story, which I wouldn't have thought at first, and our discovery seemed now much more important than Alpha and I could have imagined.
I truely wish this bug would have been found earlier and I believe any coder with some reasoning could have come to a theory like ours at some time. It's just sad that it took so many years.
Now, don't get this wrong: good players are good players and bad players are still bad players. It's not like a specific player joined a game and always had the last ID.
Biggest thanks to Sarisel (Saraph) and Alpha, because without them, this bug would have probably never been found, since many players are starting to leave Half-Life for newer games. Sarisel was convinced of the existence of the bug and so was Alpha. Alpha then forced me to work with him like a slave to find the problem =P.
Big thanks to Mahnsawce as well, not only for losing time with us on our test server =P, but also for the lag compensation remark which has made a "DOOOONG" in the head of the people trying to fix the bug.
Now that this bug is tracked down and about to be fixed, there are still many other bugs in Half-Life and its mods. I think it's really important to report these, as they will make the game more enjoyable for you. So I say: NEXT
I dont really know if this #N player theory is always true. All i can say that it was still ok in CS1.3 <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
You can read about the most important info/screenies/ingame demo's here:
<a href='http://www.hlccl.com/forums/showpost.php?p=501355&postcount=4' target='_blank'>http://www.hlccl.com/forums/showpost.php?p...355&postcount=4</a>
No, no, that was me ^_^ People confuse us a lot. That's why I go by "Tyr" and he goes by "Nem".
It is good that people have epiphanies, once that one piece fell in place, everyone started realizing what was really going on with this bug. Once Elven got the word out, it spread like wildfire and this thread has had nearly 30000 views in the last 2 days.
Not even valve can ignore that kind of press.
As Head Crab says, there are still many more bugs to fix. I've logged another 4 or 5 tonight. This is a great moment, but i'll agree... NEXT
No, no, that was me ^_^ People confuse us a lot. That's why I go by "Tyr" and he goes by "Nem". <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is right =P -> corrected
Wow really? Is it that now everyone knows about it.
When isn't he right?
<!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo-->
When isn't he right?
<!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, there was that one time...
j/k
Honorary Exterminator?
That sums up my feelings nicely. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
As you can see in the image below, the bot is not using the bugged slot, due to map changes and connections/disconnections that there have been after a while.
Basically, that fix only worked once and it was on the first map that had full players. After that, it stops working correctly. I'm not even talking about all the issues that come with AMX when adding bots...
Wow really? Is it that now everyone knows about it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeh I know that, but getting banned cause I joined last? bit pathetic
On a side not that is in no way related to Pshb, how does the public NS community deal with 56kers? I'm worried that I'm wasting my time downloading NS now <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo-->
How do you mean deal? We have Client-Side prediction and Lag Compensation same as the majority of mods. What more could you need other than adding fakelag to people with a lower ping than you? If you're looking for 56K only servers you'd be hard pressed to find one in NS since 56kers are a dying breed.I recommend you get All-Seeing Eye & use it to find servers with the best latency for you and tweak your rate, cl_updaterate & cl_cmdrate accordingly.
Thanks again, we TFCers appreciate it!
YEY
Now let the money roll in!
<b>Player Specific Hitbox Bug</b>
* The Novel (to be featured on Oprah's Book Club)
* The Movie
* The TV Show
* PSHB: Miami
* PSHB: Crime Scene Investigation
* PSHB: Special Victims Unit
* Survivor: PSHB
* Late Night with PSHB
* PSHB Soundtrack featuring "OMG HAX!"
where can i order the book?
Awsome work. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->