Are there any obvious concerns with Beta 2 balance?

Church

<!--quoteo(post=1599336:date=Jan 16 2007, 03:35 PM:name=Garo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Garo @ Jan 16 2007, 03:35 PM) [snapback]1599336[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
DC has now became first chamber in most of the games and it's common to see it in field. SC has become 2nd or 3rd chamber now, which is shame, because it's the most versaile chamber in my opinion. Maybe nerf MT somehow so that it can't counter cloack so well. Maybe allow MT to spot aliens only on the map and minimap, but don't show the onscreen blue mt circless. Drop scan cost a bit and there you go.. (just my suggestion)

- Garo
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Ha...hahahahaha.

umm...you DO know that cloaking counters MT right? Not the other way around?

MrBananaMan

aliens: the stalkers with fast movement and cool skills
marines: they guys who get mt so they can stalk aliens, and get jp's so they can move fast and fly around and make normal people not be able to kill them

kiddo

<!--quoteo(post=1599376:date=Jan 16 2007, 10:49 PM:name=Church)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Church @ Jan 16 2007, 10:49 PM) [snapback]1599376[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Ha...hahahahaha.

umm...you DO know that cloaking counters MT right? Not the other way around?
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do YOU realize with a good comm, you will have obs everywhere and your cloak is usless. Unless you plan to walk rest of the game, you might be fine. SC is good for focus, cloak is good I must admit, but with good comm those obs will counter that SC very easily.

As for DC bacoming first chamber? I haven't yet played a game where it was dropped first, I've seen so far MC and SC been dropped first. Normally DC comes through by the second hive.



as for jp cost....reducing speeds on LERKS and FADES and reducing cost on jps...doesn't make much sense. While celerity doesn't increase aliens speeds as they once were, jps overpower aliens easily. If you reduce cost on jps, shouldn't speeds be the same...to counter jps? I know devs said, reducing speeds on fades but increasing energy...hate to say this, but because blink is slow now, you will need your energy more, thus using up your energy faster. (remember he has to get in and get out...blinking in, attacking, blinking and blinking out sucks more energy now..)

enigma

<!--quoteo(post=1599400:date=Jan 16 2007, 07:43 PM:name=kiddo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(kiddo @ Jan 16 2007, 07:43 PM) [snapback]1599400[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
do YOU realize with a good comm, you will have obs everywhere and your cloak is usless. Unless you plan to walk rest of the game, you might be fine. SC is good for focus, cloak is good I must admit, but with good comm those obs will counter that SC very easily.
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where the hell can you find a good comm?

kiddo

<!--quoteo(post=1599442:date=Jan 17 2007, 03:26 AM:name=enigma)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(enigma @ Jan 17 2007, 03:26 AM) [snapback]1599442[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
where the hell can you find a good comm?
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play often! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
if you attend server you normally visit, you know who can comm and who can't. You know if that person would comm, your team might win. Also knowing the comm, you now know what he expects from you and what you should be doing. I've seen good and somewhat good comms, prolong the games...holding one hive for hours. its amazing how much res you can get from only two res nodes and kills. In 3.2 Aliens have to work a lot harder and work together a lot better. Once marines tech up, holding two hives is usless...sometimes with good players. Aliens need to be pushing hard and be on the offense. I'm sure each person who plays might see things differently, all depends what server you play, who you play with and who comms.

TOmekki

<!--quoteo(post=1599442:date=Jan 16 2007, 10:26 PM:name=enigma)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(enigma @ Jan 16 2007, 10:26 PM) [snapback]1599442[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
where the hell can you find a good comm?
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<a href="http://mbnet.fi/tomekki/kuvat/peach.jpg" target="_blank">peach</a> is pretty good i hear

zerwalter

<!--quoteo(post=1598449:date=Jan 13 2007, 04:39 PM:name=kiddo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(kiddo @ Jan 13 2007, 04:39 PM) [snapback]1598449[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> personally... celetiry doesn't feel any different from not having it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Celerity is definitely a noticeable speed increase. Just bunnyhop without and with and check your speed.

Joe2

except on lerk...

Splinter_Steve

The chamber changes and hive armor nerf were both good for gameplay. The lerk nerf works on its own, but now jetpacks are pretty much unstoppable in a clan match. Some might say lerk is less fun to play now. Gorges have been retarded for a few versions now. Cloaking is better. Onos hp is OK. Pretty much all I can think of.

MrBananaMan

out of the 5 last alien win ns games ive palyed, we've had a hard time crushing the marine base. the last game i played literally took 10 minutes just to take out their base. they had 1 rt and all the marines were in abse with hmg's. onos can show its face for about 1.5 seconds before having to rush back behind a corner. why is it so hard to finish the game?

StixNStonz

gas + xeno + acid = no chance

Johnie

Ye...jetpacks seem to strong.
Maybe a speed nerf to the jetpack?

TerRaKanE

<!--quoteo(post=1600029:date=Jan 19 2007, 03:56 AM:name=MrBananaMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MrBananaMan @ Jan 19 2007, 03:56 AM) [snapback]1600029[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
out of the 5 last alien win ns games ive palyed, we've had a hard time crushing the marine base. the last game i played literally took 10 minutes just to take out their base. they had 1 rt and all the marines were in abse with hmg's. onos can show its face for about 1.5 seconds before having to rush back behind a corner. why is it so hard to finish the game?
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dont play on 30 slot servers tbh.
if 15marines stack in the rine base.. well then 10minutes to finish them off is a reasonable time.
Assuming you play on a 16 - 18 slot server, with slight teamwork, its pretty well now. Aliens just have to realize that they need more teamwork than in 3.1 now, and cannot only rely on their fades. Get teamwork, umbra + spores + xeno ...whatever.

Joe2

<!--quoteo(post=1600073:date=Jan 19 2007, 10:28 AM:name=Johnie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Johnie @ Jan 19 2007, 10:28 AM) [snapback]1600073[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Ye...jetpacks seem to strong.
Maybe a speed nerf to the jetpack?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1

TOmekki

jetpacks are fine, please stop removing every aspect of ns that requires movement and air control

MrBananaMan

<!--quoteo(post=1600076:date=Jan 19 2007, 05:36 AM:name=TerRaKanE)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TerRaKanE @ Jan 19 2007, 05:36 AM) [snapback]1600076[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
dont play on 30 slot servers tbh.
if 15marines stack in the rine base.. well then 10minutes to finish them off is a reasonable time.
Assuming you play on a 16 - 18 slot server, with slight teamwork, its pretty well now. Aliens just have to realize that they need more teamwork than in 3.1 now, and cannot only rely on their fades. Get teamwork, umbra + spores + xeno ...whatever.
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since when do aliens work together in pubs. you jsut dont get that team feeling on aliens that you do on marines.

MARINE_DUDE

Yaa the Aliens need to work together more in 3.2, suits me fine, i love team work, has anyone else ever relised the feeling of team work is leet, and superceeds your own singular ability.

Every classic map i always go permanent Gorge, get res and chambers and spend the rest of the time commenting on the MAP and (whole team progress) using the mic, hehe <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> i found this done little, when i fist tried aliens , and basically never played marines again.

i'd have to point out though, the TEAM FEELING on MARINES i dearly miss <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
playing on Marines is like a shot of pure adrenelin RUUUSSHHH at each strategic point as we work toether as a tight unit ever onward never quitting. I played MARINES 2-3 years staight, classic only of course. I guess i felt like i done it all as far as me & Marines.

Then i discoved <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/pudgy.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::gorge::" border="0" alt="pudgy.gif" /> never looked back

I have found Aliens will work together 90% of all the PUB CLASSIC games i play <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

I'll see you on a classic server <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

Swiftspear

<!--quoteo(post=1600218:date=Jan 19 2007, 05:39 PM:name=MARINE_DUDE)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MARINE_DUDE @ Jan 19 2007, 05:39 PM) [snapback]1600218[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Yaa the Aliens need to work together more in 3.2, suits me fine, i love team work, has anyone else ever relised the feeling of team work is leet, and superceeds your own singular ability.

Every classic map i always go permanent Gorge, get res and chambers and spend the rest of the time commenting on the MAP and (whole team progress) using the mic, hehe <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> i found this done little, when i fist tried aliens , and basically never played marines again.

i'd have to point out though, the TEAM FEELING on MARINES i dearly miss <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
playing on Marines is like a shot of pure adrenelin RUUUSSHHH at each strategic point as we work toether as a tight unit ever onward never quitting. I played MARINES 2-3 years staight, classic only of course. I guess i felt like i done it all as far as me & Marines.

Then i discoved <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/pudgy.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::gorge::" border="0" alt="pudgy.gif" /> never looked back

I have found Aliens will work together 90% of all the PUB CLASSIC games i play <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

I'll see you on a classic server <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
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Join a clan. Seriously, in clan play team work is just about all that matters. I can't tell you how frustrating it is to play pubs and try to run formations and moves that any other competitive player would know and just have the pubber I'm buddying with stare at me blankly until the skulk jumps off the ceiling and eats him. I can't tell you how many times another pub marine has watched me build an RT, seriously, that's about the most useless thing you could possibly do.

MrBananaMan

its not all about explaining every little detail and communicating to get that team feeling.

when you are on the marines, you move slower (i think this is a big part of it) and you just feel better when you are with another marine. you instinctivley follow other marines, you cover each other. on aliens however, people dont usually follow each other, and it doesnt have that natural feeling of wanting to follow another alien either. things move fast on aliens. you move fast, you die fast. theres not as much time to buddy up, and it probably isnt as helpful since aliens cant cover fire cause they are melee.

kiddo

<!--quoteo(post=1600198:date=Jan 19 2007, 09:38 PM:name=TOmekki)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TOmekki @ Jan 19 2007, 09:38 PM) [snapback]1600198[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
jetpacks are fine, please stop removing every aspect of ns that requires movement and air control
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really? so nerfing lerks, fades and celerity upgrade to aliens is fine? Aliens should be about speed...but if you reduce aliens speed, and reduce the cost of jps...this doesn't make much sense to me. its only fair either nerf speed of the jp or bring back normal alien speeds from 3.1. If not that, then at least make celeiry increase aliens speeds as they were in 3.1...make celeity worth the upgrade...

MrBananaMan

jp's are disgusting.

GreyFlcn

Silly concept about the JPs.
What if they had their recharge rate greatly reduced. (Or their capacitor size shrunk)

Would put JPers are a lot more risk.

(Would also allow lerks/fades to catch em)

MrBananaMan

i remember the first time i played ns, i didnt think the jetpacks went forward. i saw it as a way to get to higher places, not something to actually out do the alien speed and flexibility.

GreyFlcn

<!--quoteo(post=1600327:date=Jan 20 2007, 08:00 AM:name=MrBananaMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MrBananaMan @ Jan 20 2007, 08:00 AM) [snapback]1600327[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
i remember the first time i played ns, i didnt think the jetpacks went forward. i saw it as a way to get to higher places, not something to actually out do the alien speed and flexibility.
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Did they go forward if you got a running start?

TOmekki

<!--quoteo(post=1600290:date=Jan 19 2007, 10:28 PM:name=kiddo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(kiddo @ Jan 19 2007, 10:28 PM) [snapback]1600290[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
really? so nerfing lerks, fades and celerity upgrade to aliens is fine? Aliens should be about speed...but if you reduce aliens speed, and reduce the cost of jps...this doesn't make much sense to me. its only fair either nerf speed of the jp or bring back normal alien speeds from 3.1. If not that, then at least make celeiry increase aliens speeds as they were in 3.1...make celeity worth the upgrade...
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did i say i embraced those changes? (well, the lerk+celerity thing is an exception since a cele lerk was just too fast for the game to handle in 3.1)

Johnie

Jetpacks may be strong, but <b>pubs</b> seem to be more balanced then ever.

ZiGGY

eugh stop ###### about jetpacks >.> Im with tomekki on this one, jetpack nerfs would make me cry.

but if you REALLY wanna up your game and use true potential jetpacks, you gotta fly it 1.0 style (please note in 1.0 jetpacks were much much more powerful lol) and that method is simply: Use JPs to obtain res control asap, kamikaze jp+sg on alien RTs is probably the most effective and least known JP tactic in the book (and i gave it you for free! :O)

TOmekki

you dont have to kamikaze if you can aim

MrBananaMan

jetpack nerfs make you cry, but they make me smile. jp is easy mode.

GreyFlcn

Well, thats another idea
Make it so that Jetpacks have the same restriction as Lerk
Were they can't fly backwards or sideways

Would mean that if a Lerk is chasing a JP, the JPer can't fly backwards while shooting.
Would also cut their manuvering quite a bit.