Browser Wars

DiscoZombie · September 2004

<div class="IPBDescription">why so adamant?</div> alright, back in the days when Netscape was the mozilla browser, I used it instead of IE... it seemed much cleaner and I liked not having Microsoft's browser... then there was a time when Netscape fell behind IE in functionality, so I gave up and switched to IE... now, recently, I switched back to Firefox, and I don't really even know why...

I want to know why people swear by their browsers. what does yours have that others don't?

since my switch, here's the things I like about firefox:<ul><li>it's faster, and I'm pretty sure it hogs less resources.</li><li>It seems more spyware and virus resistant... with IE, I would accumulate viruses now and then without even having to click any 'yes' boxes...</li><li>I like the way it looks better, with my lovely wood-grain skin...</li><li>Some of the plug-ins, like mouse gestures, are pretty sweet.</li></ul>
I think tabbed browsing is overrated, though. 5 firefox tabs are just as hard to keep track of as 5 IE windows, and you can't alt-tab between them... even if you set up a macro or mouse gesture to switch between em, it's still not the same... and this leads me to my one big complaint:

the thing I miss most about IE is the way it handles new windows... I loved being able to press ctrl-N and have a window pop up that was truly identical to the one I already had open, 'back' history and all. say there was a link a couple pages back that I wanted to open without closing this page - I could ctrl-n and go back a couple pages and there I was... with firefox, I have to do my 'open this page in new tab' gesture, and that copy has no 'back' history so I have to switch back to my first tab to go back... and then the copied tab is 'marooned' where it is because it has no history...

and of course there's still certain things firefox can't handle, like <a href='http://launch.yahoo.com' target='_blank'>LaunchCast</a>, but I guess that's other companies' faults and not mozilla's...

so yeah, in closing, there's things I miss about IE, but I'm not sure they're worth switching back for.

what browser do you use and why do you think it's better than the competition?

SkulkBait · September 2004

There are just too many irreplacable features in Firefox for me to switch back to anything else. Its so configurable, via pluggins, that it can pretty much do anything you want. I love mouse gestures, adblock, flashblock, and allow-right-click. And with built in pop-up blocking, what more could you want?

DiscoZombie · September 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SkulkBait @ Sep 7 2004, 06:32 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> There are just too many irreplacable features in Firefox for me to switch back to anything else. Its so configurable, via pluggins, that it can pretty much do anything you want. I love mouse gestures, adblock, flashblock, and allow-right-click. And with built in pop-up blocking, what more could you want?  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
yes, the ad blocking and security are particularly streamlined, they'd be what I'd miss most if I switched back to IE... though with service pack 2, there's apparently built-in pop-up blocking in IE too... in fact, SP2 SAYS it corrects all the things I had problems with -- the security problems -- so I AM considering going back to the dark side...

TommyVercetti · September 2004

I use Mozilla 1.7 because it's not made by the folks who altered Halo (even if it's still hella good).

Also, M$ itself has said that IE is insecure.

Bo_Selecta · September 2004

You can switch between tabs with ctrl+tab
and you don't need a new window with tabs =D

JediYoshi · September 2004

-I use firefox-

Anyhoo, it actually sometimes takes a lot of mem useage, sometimes it just gets crazy and I shut it off with task manager, I don't even do anything special to trigger it.

Anyway, I also use firefox because it has the one plugin by default that I used in IE, zee google search bar. That, along with adblock is just heavenly.

camel_fetus · September 2004

i use firefox for ad-blocking, tabbing (becausde i sometimes have quite a few aim windows open) and for the increased stability (viruses, spyware, crashing, etc.). also i like the download manager for some unkown reason.

NeonSpyder · September 2004

firefox is indeed a wondrous thing, so full of magic and pixies. not to mention the neon-dynamic-mood lighting. yeash, its ni ece.

SkulkBait · September 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (camel fetus @ Sep 7 2004, 08:59 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>i use firefox for ad-blocking, tabbing (becausde i sometimes have quite a few aim windows open) and for the increased stability (viruses, spyware, crashing, etc.). also i like the download manager for some unkown reason.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
This is off topic and all, but did you know you can tab you're AIM windows too? Well actually, only if you're using <a href='http://gaim.sourceforge.net/' target='_blank'>this</a> third party messenger.

<img src='http://gaim.sourceforge.net/images/screenshots/docklet.png' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

I use it all the time. It does require GTK for Windows though (so does GIMP). And it also supports Yahoo, MSN and Jabber.

Anyways, enough with plugging....

camel_fetus · September 2004

sounds pretty good, ill check into it later. i was gunna get DeadAim, but by the time i realized its tabbing capabilities, they were charging money for it <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' />

NGE · September 2004

Basically, firefox is better.

Seph_Kimara · September 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DiscoZombie @ Sep 7 2004, 11:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I think tabbed browsing is overrated, though. 5 firefox tabs are just as hard to keep track of as 5 IE windows, and you can't alt-tab between them... even if you set up a macro or mouse gesture to switch between em, it's still not the same... </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Ctrl+tab and Ctrl+shift+tab to cycle forwards and backwards through tabs. Ctrl+<number key> to switch from current tab to the tab which is <i>n</i>th from the left side of the tab bar.

BeRzErKeR · September 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DiscoZombie @ Sep 8 2004, 01:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> the thing I miss most about IE is the way it handles new windows... I loved being able to press ctrl-N and have a window pop up that was truly identical to the one I already had open, 'back' history and all. say there was a link a couple pages back that I wanted to open without closing this page - I could ctrl-n and go back a couple pages and there I was... with firefox, I have to do my 'open this page in new tab' gesture, and that copy has no 'back' history so I have to switch back to my first tab to go back... and then the copied tab is 'marooned' where it is because it has no history...  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Duplicate Tab. I've set my Firefox to duplicate a tab when I click on it with my middle mouse button, works wonders. I'm not sure if you need to have the Tabbrowser Extensions plugin installed to do it, but that should be one of the basic plugins to have installed anyway <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' />

RaVe · September 2004

I'm going to put out a limb and say that tabbed browsing is worth it. Especially when you do NOT want to clutter up your Start Bar at all.

Firefox has more features, plugins, more customibility, and so much more. I don't see why I should go back, because hey, IE always had problems with spyware (never had trouble with virii) and security holes.

And Firefox has better skinning capabilities without the use of a 3rd party program like WindowBlinds for instance. Whereas IE is only able to switch around the skins behind the buttons. Other than that...i was just basically graffiti over IE instead of a brand new skin.

TheWizard · September 2004

My company dislikes anything even remotely open source.

The day we get firefox is the day that.... well we are never getting firefox.

DiscoZombie · September 2004

so no IE defenders? I really do think I'll probably stick to firefox, but I'm sure there must be SOME reasons people use IE besides the fact that it comes with most of their computers...

as for firefox, even with tab duplication, the duplicated tabs don't have a back-and-forward history, and that still bothers me... probably not enough to switch back to IE, but still...

Geminosity · September 2004

The reason I defend firefox is out of love and concern... I know if I was the IE user I'd want someone who cared for my well-being to inform me of how I was living an inferior net-life. It's like giving someone who's only ever known black and white television a free colour TV. It's like handing someone a nice big roast chicken when all they've ever known in the way of food are used chipshop bags to lick the sauce off... I do it to let them know they don't have to live their lives in such a bad way and show them how much nicer it could be =3

That's why I want to tape all the diablo fans to a chair and forcefeed them Phantasy Star Online until they weep blood or repent their clickfest deity <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' />

TheWizard · September 2004

I will defend IE.

Only for my own personal use. I keep my computer patched/firewalled/Vscanned regularly. Never had any instance of malware on my computer. I do have a lot of the normal features turned off however.

edit: No. 1 reason I probably never had malware on my computer: Intelligent computer use. (I know how to read email w/o opening attachments)

I like IE because it is the standard that people aim for when designing sites. Like it or not, many people design a site once and do not debug it for use with other browsers. I don't think I have ever visited a site and got a compatability error or had forms and tables act screwy.

Personal preference on my part. Each time a new browser comes out or is updated I try it out. Eventually I find some bug or 'feature' I don't care for so I go back to IE.

I will be installing firefox one more time when I get home to see how I like it. I'll let you know.

(I have also written a few programs that hook into IE and provide additional functionality. I have not found equivalent features in the 3rd party browsers and do not have the time to port them)

Jim_has_Skillz · September 2004

Personally I prefer IE just because it works on almost any site whereas Firefox is more limited. I also like it for its memory usage(Firefox can use a lot more memory than IE can at times).

As for tabbed browsing, I would enjoy that feature but it's not enough to make me switch browsers. Also the google toolbar fixes the pop-up problem that IE has.

I find that most Firefox users either use it for their distaste for Microsoft or because they think it will make them cooler online for some reason. This doesn't mean everyone thinks this way, this is just what I have seen.

Daedalus · September 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DiscoZombie @ Sep 8 2004, 11:59 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> as for firefox, even with tab duplication, the duplicated tabs don't have a back-and-forward history, and that still bothers me... probably not enough to switch back to IE, but still...  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
The best way to browse with Firefox is for example, to do a Google search, then go down the list and middle click all the likely sites. Then you can browse through each tab, leaving the ones you like, and closing the ones you don't like, and you still have the original search window open.

My initial reason for switching to Firefox from IE was the security. IE is like a sieve, it lets everything through. After using Firefox for about 5 mins I was converted. Tabbed browsing, neater interface, fully customisable. It's great.

mirrodin · September 2004

I use Deepnet Explorer. It has the same look as Firefox, tabs, plugins, etc. Built in Peer 2 Peer Network, Built in RSS feed/reader thing. Supports everything IE supports. BTW Ctrl+Tab lets you switch between tabs in this too.

www.deepnetexplorer.com I think. Google it if you care.

marce · September 2004

I'm using firefox (and loving it) but I have 1 or 2 problems that I wonder if anyone can clear up.

1. Some windows media player 9 things that are inset in web pages screw up; and you cant right click and save them for some odd reason when they screw up...

2. Is there any way that you can set the built in google search bar (and you can get others like dictionary.com, urban dictionary/ IMDB etc) to open in a new tab? Because a lot of the time that I need to search something in google/dictionary its related to what I have open in the current tab.

Pre-emptive thanks =D

PS I have windows update set as my homepage for IE, 'cause that's the only time I use IE; and I don't have to use it that often either because most of the downloads are IE security patches =D

Gliss · September 2004

I believe the reason people associate viruses with IE is the same reason people associate hacking with CS. They're horribly biased--for instance, there are people who will say that IE attracts spyware and viruses, but they download all that Gator stuff. Then, once their computer gets crappy, they go, "WTH IT'S IE'S FAULT!".

I myself use FireFox, although I <i>loved</i> MyIE2. Avant browser, too. They're essentially the same thing as IE, except with all the features that everyone thinks is awesome in FireFox, such as tabbed browsing, mouse gestures, etc.
FireFox is probably better because of all those nifty extensions, though. Adblock and all.

PS: I will never use a browser that doesn't support the Google bar. Haven't visited google.com for at least a year or half a year or something.

Geminosity · September 2004

uh... pj? I use firefox like I used IE but IE managed to collect a vast amount of spyware while Firefox has literally next to zilch in all the time I've used it =P

It's not biased when it's the truth ^^

Wheeee · September 2004

the only real reason i use IE is it comes with windows and i am too lazy to install/learn another browser (or download plugins).

Darkns · September 2004

For me...Firefox shakes up and down by a few pixels for awhile after it opens a new window...
Other than that it seems to work fine...

Anyone have any idea what's wrong...?

Talesin · September 2004

Short version. <i>Lazy people use IE.</i> It's not standards-compliant (hell, it doesn't even deal with PNGs properly, much LESS the MIME filetype stupidity, or even handle HTML properly in the case of about 30% of the tags in the list). Claims of faster startup are incorrect as well, given that it DOES draw the window... but the browser is not actually ready for use at that point. It continues loading in the background, and makes you wait for it to finish if you try to visit a site, rather than just loading everything up-front.

Personally, I use full-on Mozilla. Has extra options that were cut from Moonpanda, that I don't want to have to find the plugins to re-enable. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' />

Oh, and as for those saying that they've never run into a problem using IE to browse... try using the top search-button on the forums. The ONLY people who have problems using the 'advanced search' are IE drones.. as it's coded with proper HTML, rather than IE-centric hodgepodge crap. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' />

panda_de_malheureux · September 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>as for firefox, even with tab duplication, the duplicated tabs don't have a back-and-forward history, and that still bothers me... probably not enough to switch back to IE, but still...</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
<a href='http://www.twannos-extensions.tk/' target='_blank'>duplicate tab</a>

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Like it or not, many people design a site once and do not debug it for use with other browsers.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Yep, but that's the only thing IE has going for it.

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>2. Is there any way that you can set the built in google search bar (and you can get others like dictionary.com, urban dictionary/ IMDB etc) to open in a new tab? Because a lot of the time that I need to search something in google/dictionary its related to what I have open in the current tab.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Well there is
<a href='http://dictionarysearch.mozdev.org/' target='_blank'>dictionary search</a>, I have dictionary search $, define $ (google's define: x) and go to $ for those text links.

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>I believe the reason people associate viruses with IE is the same reason people associate hacking with CS</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Yes and there are a lot of hackers in CS, just like there are way way more viruses for IE than Firefox. I am not saying you can really compare the two but I don't trust Microsoft with my security. I'm just not that stupid.

TheWizard · September 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Talesin @ Sep 12 2004, 08:00 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Short version. <i>Lazy people use IE.</i>  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Nice generalization.

I would phrase it: People who have more important things to do than mess with things that work fine for them use IE.

TOmekki · September 2004

its a question of taste. i used ie for many years, then once tried firebird. i switched immediately and havent regretted since. i dont have problems with ie, but i prefer firefox. and ive never visited a site that's messed up in firefox. so go figure =/

<3 the tab system, adblock and popup blocker. ive used firefox so long that ive forgot popups exist.

Browser Wars

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