One thing we forget is the sacrifice, it is better to rejoice then to be sorrowful, I as an American understand that this sacrifice had a great price, ironically it benefited America greatly by this war and tore Russia and Germany apart.
But, let us give our respect to both sides for the courage to stand up for their nation, even if their cause was morally wrong.
Zig...I am Captain Planet!Join Date: 2002-10-23Member: 1576Members
<!--QuoteBegin-Epidemic+Jun 6 2004, 01:07 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Epidemic @ Jun 6 2004, 01:07 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Hey, you seem to forget that many of the german soldiers were young men who had nothing to do with war besides being the one fighting it. Their lives should be honored as well. Reminds me of a certain bradlon hughley.. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> seems to me we already covered that part lol
Yea, let us remember the brave men who fought and sacrificed their lives.
This is no offence to anyone, and its slightly off-topic.
But with honest curiosity, I would venture to say that the people in the more battle hardened areas like Omaha and Utah (correct me) had it extremely bad. Not the point though, but a lot of people have this conception that D-Day was suffice to Saving Private Ryan for every single soldier in Normandy, which isn't true. From what I hear (correct me again), several beaches were barely touched when the allies crossed them (as in comparison to Dog 1, 'Fox Green?'. of Omaha), or the fact that the first waves suffered the shiz. Anyways, this doesn't account for the many actions that would later be fought with countless more lives. God bless these men, whether their motives were for naive glory, or true patriotism.
<!--QuoteBegin-Quaunaut+Jun 6 2004, 03:08 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Quaunaut @ Jun 6 2004, 03:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Its good to them because we have so many other kickass games that we could play, but were going to do this in memory of their horrors.
Anyone with me?
Ninja Edit: And about the British and Canadians- you say your own thing about your own men. I was just saying for America, and just letting the Germans know its okay. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<span style='color:white'>You need to cool off.</span>
To the British, American and Candian forces, I am glad of who i am today, i thank those people who gave their lives for ours and for generations ahead of us. All those brave people that stormed those beaches or dropped from the paratrooper planes. Today we shall remeber them and we shall never forget them, never forget them.
<!--QuoteBegin-Quaunaut+Jun 6 2004, 03:14 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Quaunaut @ Jun 6 2004, 03:14 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-CommunistWithAGun+Jun 6 2004, 08:12 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CommunistWithAGun @ Jun 6 2004, 08:12 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I don't know anyone who is german that would take offense to the defeat of the Nazis...it would be a blessing to them if anything. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Some Germans from where I live feel guilty about being German. They feel like even now, it was their fault.
And how dare I forget the RUSSIANS! The ones that fought the hardest during WW2, you guys too. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<span style='color:white'>You need to cool off.</span>
QuaunautThe longest seven days in history...Join Date: 2003-03-21Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
edited June 2004
<!--QuoteBegin-Spetsnaz+Jun 6 2004, 02:34 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Spetsnaz @ Jun 6 2004, 02:34 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Quaunaut+Jun 6 2004, 03:14 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Quaunaut @ Jun 6 2004, 03:14 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-CommunistWithAGun+Jun 6 2004, 08:12 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CommunistWithAGun @ Jun 6 2004, 08:12 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I don't know anyone who is german that would take offense to the defeat of the Nazis...it would be a blessing to them if anything. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Some Germans from where I live feel guilty about being German. They feel like even now, it was their fault.
And how dare I forget the RUSSIANS! The ones that fought the hardest during WW2, you guys too. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> seriously for a guy with 3k + posts it sounds like your just taking the freaking **** you ignorant **** <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> First off, thats flaming.
Second, off, I KNOW we didn't friggin win the war.
My Grandfather's brother was in the British army. He's told me countless stories of what he did- and the friends he lost on that day and days before and after it.
I simply didn't have the time at that second to say things on the others- I had to go eat breakfast before my Dad beat me over the head(lets just say getting to a meal on time is a BIIIIG deal at my house).
Yeah, so I'm a bloody yank. You know what you are? You are merely sore that so far almost every video game has been off of our part of the conflict. Well guess what? It doesn't freaking matter. I know who fought in the war, I've studied countless things on D-Day itself, and all in all probably know 10x as much as you do on the damned subject. Like maybe how many times Americans screwed up. Or British. Or even the friggin Canadians. That day, we all fought hard, and I'm not just being proud of what the Americans did- I made this thread to commemorate ALL of those that fought that day, whether they fired off a shot, or not. This thread, or ANYTHING I do in my entire life won't amount to crap of what any one of those soldiers did that day, but I will be able to say I at least thanked them, unlike those who just lashed out at another side because of the same reason you have in just about every time you did- because we then told our stories[ninja edit:] and you didn't tell yours.[/endninjaedit]
[ninjaedit2] And to anyone who DARES say something against my gratitude for those that fought that day and throughout the war again- realize I was rightly **** off that today on American TV at least Ronald Regan, while being a great President, does NOT deserve this day, and that American TV should be dedicated to that day, and that day ALONE. A dead President can wait a day- Several Million men who fought throughout the war deserve this day.
<span style='color:white'>You guys can't even honor the dead without bickering. Shame on you. Stay on topic. If you have issues and wish to split hairs, take it somewhere else.</span>
<!--QuoteBegin-Nemesis Zero+Jun 7 2004, 06:11 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nemesis Zero @ Jun 7 2004, 06:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> This is going to sound harsh and everything, but...
What the hell are you talking about? Today marks the 60th anniversary of the D-Day, and reading through these posts, I'm getting the impression that many take it as just another reason to have a proud, patriotic, jolly celebration. Knock it off. Operation Overlord stained the water of the Atlantic red. People got torn in half by machine guns. More people than anyone around here <i>knows</i> died on that one day. Old men - men who saw things that would turn your and my hair white on every other day of that war and carried on- still wake up sweating over their memories of that day sixty years later. Wipe that smile off your face - there's nothing nice about the D-Day. Was it necessary? The historians argue, but I'm inclined to say 'yes'. Am I, as a German, thankful for the sacrifice the Allied soldiers made on that day? You can't imagine how much. But being thankful, I can not not be mournful for those who died and suffered - regardless of whether they attacked or defended the beach. And so, I will not be able to 'celebrate' the 60th anniversary of this day with fireworks and BBQ, and I will definetely not be able to 'pay my respect' by playing a computer game.
Just my 2 cent. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I'm not sure I follow you Nem. You are greatful for their sacrafice, you are extremely aware of the mass slaughter that ensued, yet you aren't mournful for them?
I wont celebrate with a BBQ and a game either. I'm satisfied to do what we do on ANZAC day, take a minute out where the whole nation stands in silence to remember their sacrafice, then gets on with it.
<!--QuoteBegin-Marine01+Jun 6 2004, 02:02 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Marine01 @ Jun 6 2004, 02:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Nemesis Zero+Jun 7 2004, 06:11 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nemesis Zero @ Jun 7 2004, 06:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> This is going to sound harsh and everything, but...
What the hell are you talking about? Today marks the 60th anniversary of the D-Day, and reading through these posts, I'm getting the impression that many take it as just another reason to have a proud, patriotic, jolly celebration. Knock it off. Operation Overlord stained the water of the Atlantic red. People got torn in half by machine guns. More people than anyone around here <i>knows</i> died on that one day. Old men - men who saw things that would turn your and my hair white on every other day of that war and carried on- still wake up sweating over their memories of that day sixty years later. Wipe that smile off your face - there's nothing nice about the D-Day. Was it necessary? The historians argue, but I'm inclined to say 'yes'. Am I, as a German, thankful for the sacrifice the Allied soldiers made on that day? You can't imagine how much. But being thankful, I can not not be mournful for those who died and suffered - regardless of whether they attacked or defended the beach. And so, I will not be able to 'celebrate' the 60th anniversary of this day with fireworks and BBQ, and I will definetely not be able to 'pay my respect' by playing a computer game.
Just my 2 cent. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I'm not sure I follow you Nem. You are greatful for their sacrafice, you are extremely aware of the mass slaughter that ensued, yet you aren't mournful for them?
I wont celebrate with a BBQ and a game either. I'm satisfied to do what we do on ANZAC day, take a minute out where the whole nation stands in silence to remember their sacrafice, then gets on with it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> He used dual negatives there, "not not", so I believe that means he is mournful.
<!--QuoteBegin-Confuzor+Jun 7 2004, 10:05 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Confuzor @ Jun 7 2004, 10:05 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> He used dual negatives there, "not not", so I believe that means he is mournful. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I do believe you are correct. Still, I cant see whats wrong with patriotism on a day like this. A lot of Americans (and yes, British, Canadians and Australian) fought and died and as a result Europe was eventually liberated.
It's kinda hard to remember their sacrafice and not feel proud that they called your nation home and fought for it. Patriotism is a feeling of pride for your country, and those who made the ultimate sacrafice for it. The fact that it was a bloody slaughter in which a lot of people died on both sides doesnt change that.
<!--QuoteBegin-baconflaps+Jun 6 2004, 09:49 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (baconflaps @ Jun 6 2004, 09:49 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I agree with Nem. Today is a day to remember, reflect, and thank.
So here's to all those that fought at Utah, Omaha, Juno, Sword, and Gold. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Don't forget the paras, the naval support etc... there's a lot to take into account <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-Marine01+Jun 6 2004, 10:29 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Marine01 @ Jun 6 2004, 10:29 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I do believe you are correct. Still, I cant see whats wrong with patriotism on a day like this. A lot of Americans (and yes, British, Canadians and Australian) fought and died and as a result Europe was eventually liberated.
It's kinda hard to remember their sacrafice and not feel proud that they called your nation home and fought for it. Patriotism is a feeling of pride for your country, and those who made the ultimate sacrafice for it. The fact that it was a bloody slaughter in which a lot of people died on both sides doesnt change that. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It being 3am, this might not make much sense, but here it goes:
I was not trying to discredit the feeling of patriotism many feel upon this (I can't understand patriotism as a concept, but that's another days sleepy rambling), I was talking about the way it is often being displayed, about the behaviour dubbed hooray-patriotism.
EpidemicDark Force GorgeJoin Date: 2003-06-29Member: 17781Members
Well, I doubt many of them would die for their country, they just simple fell because they took a bullet, they didnt trow themself into certain death to save their country.. With that being said, all my pities to the participant in the ww2 :/
Comments
But, let us give our respect to both sides for the courage to stand up for their nation, even if their cause was morally wrong.
seems to me we already covered that part lol
This is no offence to anyone, and its slightly off-topic.
But with honest curiosity, I would venture to say that the people in the more battle hardened areas like Omaha and Utah (correct me) had it extremely bad. Not the point though, but a lot of people have this conception that D-Day was suffice to Saving Private Ryan for every single soldier in Normandy, which isn't true. From what I hear (correct me again), several beaches were barely touched when the allies crossed them (as in comparison to Dog 1, 'Fox Green?'. of Omaha), or the fact that the first waves suffered the shiz. Anyways, this doesn't account for the many actions that would later be fought with countless more lives. God bless these men, whether their motives were for naive glory, or true patriotism.
Anyone with me?
Ninja Edit: And about the British and Canadians- you say your own thing about your own men. I was just saying for America, and just letting the Germans know its okay. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<span style='color:white'>You need to cool off.</span>
To the British, American and Candian forces,
I am glad of who i am today, i thank those people who gave their lives for ours and for generations ahead of us. All those brave people that stormed those beaches or dropped from the paratrooper planes. Today we shall remeber them and we shall never forget them, never forget them.
Some Germans from where I live feel guilty about being German. They feel like even now, it was their fault.
And how dare I forget the RUSSIANS! The ones that fought the hardest during WW2, you guys too. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<span style='color:white'>You need to cool off.</span>
Some Germans from where I live feel guilty about being German. They feel like even now, it was their fault.
And how dare I forget the RUSSIANS! The ones that fought the hardest during WW2, you guys too. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
seriously for a guy with 3k + posts it sounds like your just taking the freaking **** you ignorant **** <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
First off, thats flaming.
Second, off, I KNOW we didn't friggin win the war.
My Grandfather's brother was in the British army. He's told me countless stories of what he did- and the friends he lost on that day and days before and after it.
I simply didn't have the time at that second to say things on the others- I had to go eat breakfast before my Dad beat me over the head(lets just say getting to a meal on time is a BIIIIG deal at my house).
Yeah, so I'm a bloody yank. You know what you are? You are merely sore that so far almost every video game has been off of our part of the conflict. Well guess what? It doesn't freaking matter. I know who fought in the war, I've studied countless things on D-Day itself, and all in all probably know 10x as much as you do on the damned subject. Like maybe how many times Americans screwed up. Or British. Or even the friggin Canadians. That day, we all fought hard, and I'm not just being proud of what the Americans did- I made this thread to commemorate ALL of those that fought that day, whether they fired off a shot, or not. This thread, or ANYTHING I do in my entire life won't amount to crap of what any one of those soldiers did that day, but I will be able to say I at least thanked them, unlike those who just lashed out at another side because of the same reason you have in just about every time you did- because we then told our stories[ninja edit:] and you didn't tell yours.[/endninjaedit]
[ninjaedit2] And to anyone who DARES say something against my gratitude for those that fought that day and throughout the war again- realize I was rightly **** off that today on American TV at least Ronald Regan, while being a great President, does NOT deserve this day, and that American TV should be dedicated to that day, and that day ALONE. A dead President can wait a day- Several Million men who fought throughout the war deserve this day.
What the hell are you talking about? Today marks the 60th anniversary of the D-Day, and reading through these posts, I'm getting the impression that many take it as just another reason to have a proud, patriotic, jolly celebration. Knock it off.
Operation Overlord stained the water of the Atlantic red. People got torn in half by machine guns. More people than anyone around here <i>knows</i> died on that one day. Old men - men who saw things that would turn your and my hair white on every other day of that war and carried on- still wake up sweating over their memories of that day sixty years later. Wipe that smile off your face - there's nothing nice about the D-Day.
Was it necessary? The historians argue, but I'm inclined to say 'yes'. Am I, as a German, thankful for the sacrifice the Allied soldiers made on that day? You can't imagine how much. But being thankful, I can not not be mournful for those who died and suffered - regardless of whether they attacked or defended the beach. And so, I will not be able to 'celebrate' the 60th anniversary of this day with fireworks and BBQ, and I will definetely not be able to 'pay my respect' by playing a computer game.
Just my 2 cent. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not sure I follow you Nem. You are greatful for their sacrafice, you are extremely aware of the mass slaughter that ensued, yet you aren't mournful for them?
I wont celebrate with a BBQ and a game either. I'm satisfied to do what we do on ANZAC day, take a minute out where the whole nation stands in silence to remember their sacrafice, then gets on with it.
What the hell are you talking about? Today marks the 60th anniversary of the D-Day, and reading through these posts, I'm getting the impression that many take it as just another reason to have a proud, patriotic, jolly celebration. Knock it off.
Operation Overlord stained the water of the Atlantic red. People got torn in half by machine guns. More people than anyone around here <i>knows</i> died on that one day. Old men - men who saw things that would turn your and my hair white on every other day of that war and carried on- still wake up sweating over their memories of that day sixty years later. Wipe that smile off your face - there's nothing nice about the D-Day.
Was it necessary? The historians argue, but I'm inclined to say 'yes'. Am I, as a German, thankful for the sacrifice the Allied soldiers made on that day? You can't imagine how much. But being thankful, I can not not be mournful for those who died and suffered - regardless of whether they attacked or defended the beach. And so, I will not be able to 'celebrate' the 60th anniversary of this day with fireworks and BBQ, and I will definetely not be able to 'pay my respect' by playing a computer game.
Just my 2 cent. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not sure I follow you Nem. You are greatful for their sacrafice, you are extremely aware of the mass slaughter that ensued, yet you aren't mournful for them?
I wont celebrate with a BBQ and a game either. I'm satisfied to do what we do on ANZAC day, take a minute out where the whole nation stands in silence to remember their sacrafice, then gets on with it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
He used dual negatives there, "not not", so I believe that means he is mournful.
I do believe you are correct. Still, I cant see whats wrong with patriotism on a day like this. A lot of Americans (and yes, British, Canadians and Australian) fought and died and as a result Europe was eventually liberated.
It's kinda hard to remember their sacrafice and not feel proud that they called your nation home and fought for it. Patriotism is a feeling of pride for your country, and those who made the ultimate sacrafice for it. The fact that it was a bloody slaughter in which a lot of people died on both sides doesnt change that.
So here's to all those that fought at Utah, Omaha, Juno, Sword, and Gold. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't forget the paras, the naval support etc... there's a lot to take into account <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
It's kinda hard to remember their sacrafice and not feel proud that they called your nation home and fought for it. Patriotism is a feeling of pride for your country, and those who made the ultimate sacrafice for it. The fact that it was a bloody slaughter in which a lot of people died on both sides doesnt change that. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It being 3am, this might not make much sense, but here it goes:
I was not trying to discredit the feeling of patriotism many feel upon this (I can't understand patriotism as a concept, but that's another days sleepy rambling), I was talking about the way it is often being displayed, about the behaviour dubbed hooray-patriotism.
With that being said, all my pities to the participant in the ww2 :/
I'll watch the boards until you get back. I promise nothing bad will happen.
Heh. My fingers spastically crossed themselves...