Ns Can Be Interpreted As Capitalism Vs. Communism?

MantridMantrid Lockpick Join Date: 2003-12-07 Member: 24109Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Probably been discussed before...</div> I was thinking about this, and its probably been done before, but even if it has, there are new people with new opinions.

Is it valid to think of NS in some aspects to be Communism vs. Capitalism? I'm fairly sure that wasn't the developer's intent, but it can be though of this way.

The Frontiersmen represent Communism because...

They all follow one leader (the Commander) and obey his will.

The one leader decides who gets what and for what purpose.

They don't have their own "currency" (i.e., Resources), but instead it is shared with all.

The Kharra represent Capitalism because...

They each follow their own individual desires.

They aspire to whatever they wish.

They control their own means to achieve their ends (personal Resources).

They can build their own miniture empire (Gorge fortresses, WoL's, et cetera).

Through careful "spending", they can become a powerful force (through Evolving).


Thoughts?
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Comments

  • panda_de_malheureuxpanda_de_malheureux Join Date: 2003-12-26 Member: 24775Members
    .. the aliens are lean mean killing machines, the marines are trying to stay alive, the more the marrier.. no hidden symbolism behind this one buddy
  • ThE_HeRoThE_HeRo Join Date: 2003-01-25 Member: 12723Members
    Yeah, this has been said before. It was a good point.
  • MantridMantrid Lockpick Join Date: 2003-12-07 Member: 24109Members
    Of course its not deliberate embedded symbolism, I'm asking you to consider it from this stance.
  • eric_teric_t Join Date: 2004-03-18 Member: 27393Banned
    edited April 2004
    communism doesnt have leaders.
    <span style='color:white'>Be nice.</span>
  • KepaKepa Join Date: 2004-03-05 Member: 27160Members
    edited April 2004
    <!--QuoteBegin-eric_t+Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eric_t @ Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> communism doesnt have leaders.
    <span style='color:white'>Be nice.</span><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    You owned that guy!

    Except for the fact that you're completely wrong. Communism does include leaders.

    Like that Stalin guy and his eye-beam lasers.
  • FCCFCC Join Date: 2003-07-16 Member: 18218Members
    edited April 2004
    <!--QuoteBegin-eric_t+Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eric_t @ Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> communism doesnt have leaders.
    <span style='color:white'>Be nice.</span><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Don't know what history you studied, but a Communist govenment has a leader.
    For example, Communist Russia during World War II were lead by Stalin. Heck, China is Communist right now and they have a leader.
  • InsomniaInsomnia Join Date: 2003-06-10 Member: 17179Members
    edited April 2004
    It would be more of a monarchy than a communist state. Communism in theory shoudln't have a leader, however, in order to get to the classless system that it promotes a leader is needed in real life.
  • Salvation_r2Salvation_r2 Join Date: 2003-11-26 Member: 23606Members
    depends on what your talking about, compitive play or pub...

    though not meant to maybe, they have a huge difference in one another <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo-->
  • Status_QuoStatus_Quo Join Date: 2004-01-30 Member: 25749Members
    Well, actually, communism doesn't have a leader. States on their way to communism may have a leader.

    Russia and China never really went all the way. They sort of stopped at some form of extreme capitalism, where one person owned everything and therefor had the power. They never continued with the final step which was to distribute the resources and disband the government. I'm fairly sure Marx turn in his grave every time someone say that Russia was a communism.

    Either way, yes, it's been discussed before. I wouldn't get my hopes up about this thread, as it will inevitably be closed within a not-so-distant future.
  • rknZrknZ Join Date: 2003-10-23 Member: 21885Members
    In a true communist state, everyone is pretty much equal, there are no leaders and so on.

    What China and Russia represented was socialism.

    Communism would work fine in a perfect world, but in reality, the human race has it's lazy buggers & it's greedy buggers, meaning Communism would never be accepted by all.
  • panda_de_malheureuxpanda_de_malheureux Join Date: 2003-12-26 Member: 24775Members
    .. the marines could be communists but its missing one very important feature: forcing people/players to do what the leader says. in communism there is cops, in ns there isnt, noone can tell you what to do.
  • CommunistWithAGunCommunistWithAGun Local Propaganda Guy Join Date: 2003-04-30 Member: 15953Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-Kepa+Apr 2 2004, 02:46 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Kepa @ Apr 2 2004, 02:46 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-eric_t+Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eric_t @ Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> communism doesnt have leaders.
    moron. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    You owned that guy!

    Except for the fact that you're completely wrong. Communism does include leaders.

    Like that Stalin guy and his eye-beam lasers. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Uh...the ideaology has no leadership. It means to commune. One for all all for one. Like a hive mentallity almost...hmm


    What you are referring to is a spit in the face to communism. Stalinism. Dictators are evil kthx.
  • GeronimoGeronimo Join Date: 2002-12-18 Member: 11056Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-FCC+Apr 2 2004, 03:21 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (FCC @ Apr 2 2004, 03:21 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-eric_t+Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eric_t @ Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> communism doesnt have leaders.
    moron. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Don't know what history you studied, but a Communist govenment has a leader.
    For example, Communist Russia during World War II were lead by Stalin. Heck, China is Communist right now and they have a leader. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Ahem!:

    Communism in its true form has _no_ leaders. It is described as the transfer from the ultimate capitalism(where one person owns everything) to communism. In this form, noone owns anything, but shares everything. With no ownage( <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> ) , you get no power, as theres nothing to threat with nor anything to gain from personal archievemnets. With no power, we get no leaders.

    Soviet, China, Cuba etc. are not communisms, rather dictatorships following the communism ideals(more or less).


    I just had to get it off my chest...
  • RedfordRedford Monorailcatfjord Join Date: 2002-04-28 Member: 528Members, NS1 Playtester
    Cue pointless over-anaylsis of game on my mark.

    *points finger*
  • SajberToffeSajberToffe Join Date: 2004-01-22 Member: 25571Members
    edited April 2004
    When I first read the topic title, my first thought was that the aliens would be the communists, not the other way around. They share everything, not their res tho, but one mind and they work together to achieve this. No one is more important than another, and there is no difference between the players, no commander holier than the marines. Except for 1.0 where there were one gorge.

    But I wouldn't call the marines capitalists either. Monarcy.

    Communism is fun. But not possible in our world. Perhaps we all get more civilised in the future.


    <span style='font-size:8pt;line-height:100%'>I got here before lock! yay!</span>
  • th0r0nth0r0n Born again n00b Join Date: 2003-06-12 Member: 17313Members
    edited April 2004
    <!--QuoteBegin-eric_t+Apr 2 2004, 08:33 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eric_t @ Apr 2 2004, 08:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> communism doesnt have leaders.
    <span style='color:white'>Be nice.</span><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    <span style='color:white'>Be nice.</span>
  • JummehJummeh Join Date: 2003-04-07 Member: 15276Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-FCC+Apr 2 2004, 09:21 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (FCC @ Apr 2 2004, 09:21 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-eric_t+Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eric_t @ Apr 2 2004, 02:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> communism doesnt have leaders.
    moron. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Don't know what history you studied, but a Communist govenment has a leader.
    For example, Communist Russia during World War II were lead by Stalin. Heck, China is Communist right now and they have a leader. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    pffft china is not communist.

    It has more of a resemblance to Capitalism than most western European countries.
    I can't even say they are socialist! The real socialist contries are the Scandanavian countries where they tax lots but almost every public ammenity is free.

    PS: I am chinese
  • GaidinTSGaidinTS Join Date: 2003-08-10 Member: 19319Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    Right, communism doesn't have leaders, but the messed up nature of humans could almost never allow for a true communist state. The only way this could work would be if everything were controlled by a computer hivemind! A greedless, inhuman dictator of efficiency sharing all the wealth equally. Hell, if someone made a computer hivemind, I'd vote it for president.
  • AaronAaron vroom vroom der party startah Join Date: 2002-11-05 Member: 7020Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Ns Can Be Interpreted As Capitalism Vs. Communism?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    <lil john><b><i>huh-what?!?!</b></i></lil john>
  • PalinPalin Join Date: 2003-03-24 Member: 14848Members
    while communism in principle has no leaders, the community must still be represented by a single authority (or panel authority) in order to interract with outside entities that are not communistic in nature. Without such a representative, what you have is "pure" communism... but that requires that everyone play along. With a representative or "leader", what you have is "practical" communism. Not all communist leaders are evil dictators. We haven't really seen enough of them to justify that claim.

    However, as nice as communism seems to be at the outset (even socialism with a benevolent and moral leader for that matter), the idea is naive to think that everyone will play along. It can really only work best in very small communities... if not smaller. These principles are usually found in small groups like athletic teams, development teams, management teams. Even in these cases you can turn up a rotten apple though.

    Like mentioned earlier, communism is the perfect solution for a perfect world... but then you add the human race to the picture and it is all bunk.
  • xectxect Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9807Members
    I'm with the ones saying that communism couldn't work in reality. Not for a whole nation. It would be like an alien team with a million players trying to work together. No teamwork at all, everyone would be saving for onos and no one would be building.
  • Cereal_KillRCereal_KillR Join Date: 2002-10-31 Member: 1837Members
    edited April 2004
    I wonder why people have to see symbols in everything, it's just a freakin alien versus humans game

    (edit: pressed submit too soon <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo--> )
  • ThrillhouseThrillhouse Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 3178Members, Constellation
    Yea, never use Soviet Union, Peoples Republic of China, Cuba etc as true examples of communism, as they are all 'interpretations' (IE Stalinism, Maoism). Now true <b><i>Marxism</b></i> doesnt truely have a leader per-se, rather a 'dictatorship of the proletariat', which is basically a workers counsil.
  • HAMBoneHAMBone Probably the best Commander Join Date: 2003-04-02 Member: 15139Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
    Aliens split the resources equally, and even if they are the best they won't get much more than anyone else on their team. That's socialism.
  • ForlornForlorn Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2634Banned
    I consider the game to be more about socialism vs. Dictatorship


    Dictatorship being the marines, and socialism being the aliens.

    As HAMBONE pointed, aliens are socialists, and take a close look at any military installation today, it's done with dicatorship principles and the such.


    Now, the real question is this:

    - What kind of dictatorship are the marines? I'd say it resembles more of a Facist dictatorship, with the racism being against the aliens? lol who knows.
  • ahhoahho Join Date: 2003-02-22 Member: 13854Members
    edited April 2004
    so are you saying that have one commander leading the marines to kill is Communist.
    Dosen't all army have a commander leading it's troops?? You can say that it was a joke for the American to get rid of Communist people in their country, but actually their army is running in communism ideals with a leader?


    really why put ns into politics. it was a meant to be enjoyed

    and also as mention befored, why the symbolism in everything
  • TeKniKaLTeKniKaL Join Date: 2003-01-27 Member: 12802Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Now, the real question is this:

    - What kind of dictatorship are the marines? I'd say it resembles more of a Facist dictatorship, with the racism being against the aliens? lol who knows. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    LOL.
  • BlueNovemberBlueNovember hax Join Date: 2003-02-28 Member: 14137Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin-Jummeh+Apr 2 2004, 08:18 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Jummeh @ Apr 2 2004, 08:18 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
    pffft china is not communist.

    It has more of a resemblance to Capitalism than most western European countries.
    I can't even say they are socialist! The real socialist contries are the Scandanavian countries where they tax lots but almost every public ammenity is free.

    PS: I am chinese <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    !?!?!?

    My GCSE history just became contradicted 50 times by the first page of this topic.

    "China and Cuba are the only 2 remaining Capitalist states". :S

    Would I be right in saying China just does not think it's communist? *Cough* Propagand / censorship / Taiwan *cough*.

    Acutally, if I include the word "Taiwan" or "Capitalist" doesn't that prevent any chinese ISP from loading the page? I read somewhere that all ISPs must router connections though a massive Government Proxy Server. :o


    --

    I think this is an interesting comparasion; boo to the "NS is a game, ****" people.
    Commanders are the perfect dictators, I mean, they control *health*!

    And for anyone who does not follow this political mumbo-jumbo, here's the Cow Politics page I finally found:
    <a href='http://www.tysknews.com/LiteStuff/cow_politics.htm' target='_blank'>http://www.tysknews.com/LiteStuff/cow_politics.htm</a>

    <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
  • neko1neko1 Join Date: 2004-02-28 Member: 26950Members
    Let's make a movie based off of the Cold War but in Natural Selection!
  • ahhoahho Join Date: 2003-02-22 Member: 13854Members
    well i am chinese(actually i am brn in Hong Kong) and i have a lot of cousins in china.
    the government is buffing about the restcted site, actually there is no restriction except postin chinese government sensitive info
    china now adays is different not to much restrictions.


    Also There is a lot of different communist state, eventhough china are using some capitalistic ideas, they are still communist. Capitalist ideas are just ideas
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