David And Goliath
relsan
Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 3720Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 3720Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">Winning endgame stalemates</div> Let me guess, you have all three hives, all the res nodes except for one, and the marines are for some mysterious reason, still alive. Oh but it's not really mysterious at all is it? They have a massive turret farm with several electrified turret factories and campers with GLs and HMGs aiming at anything that comes close. You've sent several onos to their deaths in an attempt to break their gauntlet to no avail. Sound familiar? Well I've ran into this scenario a lot of times and I've lost some and won some. But one thing I'm starting to realize is that sometimes bigger isn't better.
Onos are simply too slow to get the jump on an entire team of trigger happy commandos that have automatic bot aimed turrets doing most of the job for them anyway.
There are two solutions to this problem that you must realize:
1. Hit them quick before this scenario happens.
<b>2. XENOCIDE. </b>
As soon as you have beaten the marines down to the point where they only have ONE stronghold left, MOVE TO ATTACK IMMEADIATELY. This is CRUCIAL if they are in a hive spot.
Now if you have the option of getting 3 hives, keep them contained at their stronghold until that last hive comes up, and when it does, <b>XENOCIDE THEM TO HELL</b>. See rule #1 and hit them before they get a chance to set up a routine. Sneak as far into their base as you can and blast as many of them as you can with skulk kibble and bits. I'm recommending you do this because there are only three ways I have ever seen this scenario won:
1. The commander got bored and recycled everything.
2. The commander was dumb and did not keep his front line fortified.
3. The commander did everything right and we resulted to Xenocide, admittedly with some backup from other classes.
Notice the third way was the only one that had to do with aliens? I've taken down heavys with Xenocide. It works because its fast and it hits hard when you time it right. It's like David and Goliath; you don't need a lot of strength if you are precise and accurate. And if everyone is doing it, there's no way the marines can stop an entire team of rushing skulks before one of them pops. And as anybody who has witnessed Xenocide knows, it only takes one skulk to kill half the team with a properly orchestrated Xenocide.
Onos are simply too slow to get the jump on an entire team of trigger happy commandos that have automatic bot aimed turrets doing most of the job for them anyway.
There are two solutions to this problem that you must realize:
1. Hit them quick before this scenario happens.
<b>2. XENOCIDE. </b>
As soon as you have beaten the marines down to the point where they only have ONE stronghold left, MOVE TO ATTACK IMMEADIATELY. This is CRUCIAL if they are in a hive spot.
Now if you have the option of getting 3 hives, keep them contained at their stronghold until that last hive comes up, and when it does, <b>XENOCIDE THEM TO HELL</b>. See rule #1 and hit them before they get a chance to set up a routine. Sneak as far into their base as you can and blast as many of them as you can with skulk kibble and bits. I'm recommending you do this because there are only three ways I have ever seen this scenario won:
1. The commander got bored and recycled everything.
2. The commander was dumb and did not keep his front line fortified.
3. The commander did everything right and we resulted to Xenocide, admittedly with some backup from other classes.
Notice the third way was the only one that had to do with aliens? I've taken down heavys with Xenocide. It works because its fast and it hits hard when you time it right. It's like David and Goliath; you don't need a lot of strength if you are precise and accurate. And if everyone is doing it, there's no way the marines can stop an entire team of rushing skulks before one of them pops. And as anybody who has witnessed Xenocide knows, it only takes one skulk to kill half the team with a properly orchestrated Xenocide.
Comments
Onos are simply too slow to get the jump on an entire team of trigger happy commandos that have automatic bot aimed turrets doing most of the job for them anyway.
There are two solutions to this problem that you must realize:
1. Hit them quick before this scenario happens.
<b>2. XENOCIDE. </b>
As soon as you have beaten the marines down to the point where they only have ONE stronghold left, MOVE TO ATTACK IMMEADIATELY. This is CRUCIAL if they are in a hive spot.
Now if you have the option of getting 3 hives, keep them contained at their stronghold until that last hive comes up, and when it does, <b>XENOCIDE THEM TO HELL</b>. See rule #1 and hit them before they get a chance to set up a routine. Sneak as far into their base as you can and blast as many of them as you can with skulk kibble and bits. I'm recommending you do this because there are only three ways I have ever seen this scenario won:
1. The commander got bored and recycled everything.
2. The commander was dumb and did not keep his front line fortified.
3. The commander did everything right and we resulted to Xenocide, admittedly with some backup from other classes.
Notice the third way was the only one that had to do with aliens? I've taken down heavys with Xenocide. It works because its fast and it hits hard when you time it right. It's like David and Goliath; you don't need a lot of strength if you are precise and accurate. And if everyone is doing it, there's no way the marines can stop an entire team of rushing skulks before one of them pops. And as anybody who has witnessed Xenocide knows, it only takes one skulk to kill half the team with a properly orchestrated Xenocide. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Omg... That post was so gramatically correct I actually took the time to read it <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Your totally right... But I've seen it won one more time, another way... Entire team was onos, we made "peace" and secretly ate them all... lol <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
That's definitely right. Let's amend that then.
End game:
<!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> should Xenocide.
<!--emo&::lerk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/lerk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='lerk.gif'><!--endemo--> should Primal Scream.
<!--emo&::fade::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/fade.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='fade.gif'><!--endemo--> should Acid Rocket.
<!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> should Web marines that leave stronghold.
<!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> should devour heavies that leave stronghold.
All these things together should prove to be a winning strat.
Setup:
DCs just outside siegerange.
SCs just outside siegerange
MCs just outside siegerange
Lerk with adren, carapace en freaking SOF.
If you got a MC closeby forget adren and go for silcense or speed. I prefer the silence to make it even more hell.
Spike, spike, spike, spike... heavely underestimated move. I took entire HA teams down on one hive spiking. Aslong as you got a right spot and first nail there OBS you are ok. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I left the game after some time because I knew hat we wont win that way and they wont win either.
Any good tactics for this one?
<!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--><!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
bs
Good skulks might consider cloaking/silence and taking out the ips/tfac quickly and quietly while marines are bouncing around to xeno.
Once the marines are half strength or so, you can rush in your other evolutions. Usually I find once you clear the turret wall, you can hide behind other marine structures and use them as cover.
IE a fade hiding behind the armory and blinkslashing anything fool enough to try to get near. Or the aforementioned stealth skulk taking out the IPs.
If the marines spawn back in en masse, merely retreat, rinse, and repeat. It is VITAL that once the tfac goes down, everyone rushes. The sheer chaos generated should give you all enough time to clear the turrets, with onos stomping everything they can under spore spam and gorgies going ape with bb spam on the ips/cc.
Another, riskier solution is letting the rines leave base............. then hit the base when its half staffed. Chancy, and only to be used in those situations where even coordinated xeno hits are doing sweet FA damage.
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Bile.
Chamber rush.
Web rush.
Gorges are cheap, quick to evolve into, and require minimal effort to do gobs of structural damage. With some skill, they can shut down turrets (by spamming OCs) and stop rines in their tracks (with targeted webs).
IME, the lowly gorge, he who maketh RTs, is the key to breaking stalemates.
"I see a problem with xenociding: Marines will get a lot of resources through RFK by killing skulks"
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Erm, if you're cara, celer, and sof, there's no way marines can kill you before you boom them. Well, unless you're on your own and they all see you.
TBH its rare that a marine shoots me before I boom, because celer allows me to "trigger" myself wayy outside the base, I go in along the roof to my big pile of sof sprites, and cara means i've enough armour to take a few seconds of fire - more than long enough to explode and scatter rines.
If you've ever been on the receiving end of concerted xeno, then you will KNOW how hard it is to get a bead on one skulk when you're bouncing around like a pingpong ball.
An even better support for acid rocket is primal scream. Most underused ability ever.
This is what I recommend, and yes I know its quite a cheap way to win. Anyway if you have three hives and you're in a stalemate situation, then go build atleast 4 mcs that are near an entrance to the marines base but far enough back to be out of siege range. Then go fade, and don't forget the adren. Then continuously blast the hell out of their base with acid rockets. This is an easy way to win even if teams are uneven, as long as some bothersome heavy doesn't come along with a gl. Oh yeah incase that happens make sure to have a few dcs and scs in your little sanctuary of stamina. Now if a few lights wonder out of the base hmging, sguning, ect. then blink into them and slash em a few times (only takes 2 slashes to kill a light who's not upgraded, 3-4 if he is), but be very careful of the ol' sgun to the face, it can be dangerous to your health. If its a heavy who wonders out; play around with him a bit and acid rocket his feet, then when you've hit him a good number of times pounce on him, get 2 hits, then back off and wait for hp to regen, and repeat! Anyway back to the acid rocketing; you should be able to take out their tf, ips, armory, a few turrets, whatever. Hopefully after a while some other fade will catch on and help you out, and if not then ask one!!! Team work is the key to winning this kind of situation. Anyway try it out, see what you think.
And yes, the onos is pretty useless at LAST STAND ASSAULTS since the marines will fight to the death, won't scatter, will be in good positions usually above ground, and the floor is covered with mines or turrets.
Onos aren't meant for that. So you've to clear a path, thin the marines, then send the onos in to raise almighty hell.
while I would not pick carapace this round its a habbit of comms to put most turrets up front.
if you can get in with a gorge (this is the big if part) and to the back you might find a spot where you can stay with regen.
Now BB and web. if you got a clear view you can also web from great distance completely bypassing this if.
main goal is the IP. use all your webs on the IP. then its just a few xeno skulks to get them killed. While rines are hugging your webs the others can start taking out sentries. It will take long but eventually it works cause they can't move to weld it. (you webbed)
aslong as ppl concentrate on structures, not the webbed rines. this helps.