Valve Drops Support For Wonid's
ARES-Sparks
Join Date: 2003-09-10 Member: 20716Members
Join Date: 2003-09-10 Member: 20716Members
<div class="IPBDescription">So What !!!</div> I'm not concerned that Valve is droppong support for WONid's. Someone, something, somewhere will provide support for them in the future just as Sierra did in the past. Whether its a new enterprize company providing a centralized server, or user-created standalone programs installed on their own machines doesn't matter to me. Consumers will still be able to use a product that they have purchased, and connect with other users of the product, just as they always have in the past. So what if the manufacturer of the product tells you it's obsolete and they will no longer support it. Doesn't matter, that's MY choice, I own it, you can't take it away from me, and you can't force me to quit using it.
There is nothing unique about WON id's. It's nothing more than a number (and I am not a number). How this effects the use of a software package named Halflife doesn't matter. You don't need this specific number to play Halflife on your computer. You do need the cd key that was supplied on your legal purchased copy for installation, but beyond that, you are not required to have anything else.
Why cry that "I need this number to play over the internet!" That's only because of the method that the WON servers used. That does not mean it's a requirement that all servers must use this same method to activate YOUR product (Remember, your product was already activated by using the cd key you typed in). It was just a method of getting the software online by the server system responding to the request. The server responding to the request does not have to be the ones provided by the software distributor, does it? I can make that request go to any server I feel like. If the one I send the request to responds ok, what difference would it make? Will that number be used for verification? Doesn't matter. Was it a requirement that you MUST have a WONid to use your software over a network, for permission to connect to other users of their purchased copy of Halflife? I don't think so. LAN game, anyone?
Dropping support for arbitrary ID numbers won't force anyone to purchace a new product using a new verification system, no matter how much a marketing or sales guru wants to wave their hand in the air and say "Make it so." Over a million previous (now obsolute, because I said so) copys sold, makes it not so. I don't need the lastest and greatest version of anything. What I've spent my money on previously does me quite well, thank you very much.
ps - Has anyone been able to get Gordon running around, killing headcrabs and zombies? I don't have an internet connection and want to use my upgraded program. What happened to my single player experience?
Robert S. Delinsky
There is nothing unique about WON id's. It's nothing more than a number (and I am not a number). How this effects the use of a software package named Halflife doesn't matter. You don't need this specific number to play Halflife on your computer. You do need the cd key that was supplied on your legal purchased copy for installation, but beyond that, you are not required to have anything else.
Why cry that "I need this number to play over the internet!" That's only because of the method that the WON servers used. That does not mean it's a requirement that all servers must use this same method to activate YOUR product (Remember, your product was already activated by using the cd key you typed in). It was just a method of getting the software online by the server system responding to the request. The server responding to the request does not have to be the ones provided by the software distributor, does it? I can make that request go to any server I feel like. If the one I send the request to responds ok, what difference would it make? Will that number be used for verification? Doesn't matter. Was it a requirement that you MUST have a WONid to use your software over a network, for permission to connect to other users of their purchased copy of Halflife? I don't think so. LAN game, anyone?
Dropping support for arbitrary ID numbers won't force anyone to purchace a new product using a new verification system, no matter how much a marketing or sales guru wants to wave their hand in the air and say "Make it so." Over a million previous (now obsolute, because I said so) copys sold, makes it not so. I don't need the lastest and greatest version of anything. What I've spent my money on previously does me quite well, thank you very much.
ps - Has anyone been able to get Gordon running around, killing headcrabs and zombies? I don't have an internet connection and want to use my upgraded program. What happened to my single player experience?
Robert S. Delinsky
Comments
1) Valve releases a patch that removes WON-ID authentication (why would Valve do this?)
2) Another company does the WON-ID authentication (Valve won't let this happen)
3) Someone writes an internet-based NAT-like server to use on the HL server. The NAT-like server would mask IPs so that they look like they are on a local LAN server and thus not require authentication. There would also have to be a similar program to use on people's clients that would connect through the internet as if they were on that local network and use a local IP (as far as HL is concerned).
4) A VPN is used and operated similar to option #3. This is the easiest solution as there are products that can do this right now. However, it could pose some significant security risks to the people on the VPN and would make it a pain to change servers.
5) Someone hacks the hl client and server code. This is probably not legal and thus most web sites wouldn't support it. It also has a negative aspect that any future updates would need to be cracked again. I do not personally support this one.
All of these options have the potential to happen. However, unless Valve officially supports it, making one of these options available is only a fraction of the problem. You must then figure out a way to get people to use it. Standard server browsers will no longer work so people won't know that they exist so software will have to be written to make that work. Also, if there are no servers, then people wont use the service. Finally, if steam works with HL, who is going to want to use this?
Note, I would love for one of #1-4 to happen in HL and would be the first to use it. In my opinion, a modified VPN specifically allowing many HL servers on it has the best chance of working. It could allow browsing all servers in the VPN and potentially create a community very quickly. However, logistically, I consider all of these options a big long shot given the current situation.
5) Someone hacks the hl client and server code. This is probably not legal and thus most web sites wouldn't support it. It also has a negative aspect that any future updates would need to be cracked again. I do not personally support this one.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You should support it though... unless you mean that you think it's far too un-optimal so you'd prefer another method.
The only thing you own is the the manual, the CD itself, and the cardboard box the stuff came in. Everything else belongs to Valve, and they have the legal right to determine when and where you can and cannot use <b>their</b> software. They have the right to terminate licenses altogether. If you don't agree to those terms, you have the right to discontinue using the software and uninstall the application from your system. They DO have the right to force you to quit using the application. Happens all the time in the business world. Software is no longer supported, the company wants you to upgrade... boom... your license is now invalid and you are running an illegal copy of the software. How do you think Microsoft makes their billions? The company I work for spends millions every year renewing software licenses to stay legal.
Your only solution for this "dilemma" is to either A) hack around the WON limitation like Racer mentioned, B) pray that Valve doesn't do what you don't want them to do, or C) uninstall and find something else to play. Valve wants you to buy HL2. They want mods to convert to HL2 to increase their sales. Natural-Selection, and other free mods for HL1 like NS, will at some point stop bringing in additional money for Valve. Hundreds of thousands of players are online all the time, playing some mod for HL1. Valve doesn't get money for any of that. Far too many players steal CD keys or have CD-key generators. They bought out CS so they could put otherwise "free" software in a retail box and get some more money that way. Same for Day of Defeat. Might also happen with Natural Selection, but for HL2.
If they know you'll buy HL2 because WON is dead and NS is out for HL2/steam, then that's what they're going to do. It'd be nice if they would open up the WON basket and allow people to keep playing the games/mods they love, but that doesn't make much business sense. They are expecting those hundreds of thousands of players to purchase HL2 and play their mods on that platform. In the end business and cold-hard cash wins over altruism.
/me holds icecream in mouth
can i get my steam Id same way as wonid? by typin in stat right?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Your only solution for this "dilemma" is to either A) hack around the WON limitation like Racer mentioned, B) pray that Valve doesn't do what you don't want them to do, or C) uninstall and find something else to play. Valve wants you to buy HL2. They want mods to convert to HL2 to increase their sales. Natural-Selection, and other free mods for HL1 like NS, will at some point stop bringing in additional money for Valve. Hundreds of thousands of players are online all the time, playing some mod for HL1. Valve doesn't get money for any of that. Far too many players steal CD keys or have CD-key generators. They bought out CS so they could put otherwise "free" software in a retail box and get some more money that way. Same for Day of Defeat. Might also happen with Natural Selection, but for HL2.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh and the CD key generator stuff is incorrect, they do not work for online games(just for singleplayer). Anyone who plays a pirated Half-life online did not generate their key. They either borrowed it from a friend, or stole it from somewhere.
If far too many players stole their Half-life online experience, then Valve would go out of buisness. If the pirates are too severe a problem, companies will barely hang on or die. Maybe to you far too many players steal their half-life experience, but the numbers can't be that high. And since HL is mainly an online game, a CD key generator will not work, so the ease of pirating it is greatly reduced.
There probably is not much point to cracking the HL software to play online, by the time it's necessary, there will be far less players, and HL2 will really make HL1 look ****.
Or you could capture the packets from a current won query, and create a program that plays them back..
then just set the autserver to that program <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
There is no such thing as security if someone has 24/7 access to said thing, the same applies for software. I hope Vale does not do something stupid like making HL not work in multiplayer any more, it would be bad for their PR. <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->