Balance

SDJason

<div class="IPBDescription">a discussion</div> Balance is achieved through counters, and opposites, and mostly counters.

List here all the strategies, tech's, buildings, evolutions and counters for them.

From this list we may be able to discuss changes needed, and present suggestions to the Developers of this mod with reasoning to back it up

Ill start out

Umbra-No known counter other than mass attack
Spores- No known counter (find and kill lerk)
Turret farm- No known counter other than whittle it down
Meelee attacks-Standoff attacks
Standoff attacks-Vents/o chambers/rushing/find a new route/sensory
Camping-Umbra/sensory
Sensory- scan/obs/find the sensory and kill it
Defense chamber-Siege/mass attack/grenades
WOL-Siege/Mass attack/grenade
Bilebomb-Weld since it does no damage to units
Onos-Turret farm


This is an extremely limited list, but you get the idea.. from here we can theorize the rock paper scissors method that most rts's follow, and then be able to more accurately suggest improvements to the dev teams from the fanbase

Globber

Let's see if we can prevent this from turning into a flame-fest...

First off, spores don't work against HA (I think), so an HA with good aim can take the lerk down.
Umbra is not as useful in this version, and grenades and shotguns do wonders against it.
That said, shotguns are also incredibly useful for nailing aliens that want to get in close and is pretty much the best gun in the game

Smithy

I dont see where your going with this? Are you trying to get everyone of the above taken out of the game or something?

Sorry if I sound rude but I dont know what you mean.... Theres a counter to everything it just takes more than a standard marine with an LMG and thats how it will always be.

include

I fixed it.

Umbra- Mass Attack/Grenade Launcher
Spores- Heavy Armor is immune
Turret farm- BileBomb
Melee attacks- Keep your distance
Standoff attacks-Vents/o chambers/rushing/find a new route/sensory
Camping-Umbra/sensory/siege
Sensory- scan/obs/find the sensory and kill it
Defense chamber-Siege/mass attack/grenades
WOL-Siege/Mass attack/grenade
Bilebomb-Weld damage or kill gorge
Onos-Turret farm/Shotguns

CommunistWithAGun

The counter to spore is running away from spores/HA
The counter to Turrets is clan-quality(ha-ha, look, irony) attacks/tactics/whatever to take them out
The counter to umbra is explosives/avoiding it
I could be a real pain and just say the counter to the kharaa are the hax0r turrets.


Everyone else has them pretty well covered.

SDJason

no.. im starting a discussion...

In order for a game to be balanced... everything must have a counter... at present many dont, and some dont need to, since aliens and marines employ different strategies, however by listing all the counters to each strat... we can better suggest ideas to counter the uncounterable strats without upsetting the balance of the game...

~Jason

monkeymaster

nope i dissagree, i think everything has a counter. u cant say it doesnt because nsv2.0 hasnt been out long enough for you to figure out what has a counter and what doesnt. after 3 or 4 months of playing u will notice that this version is as balanced as it can get.

Jaml

<!--QuoteBegin--monkeymaster+Aug 11 2003, 07:44 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (monkeymaster @ Aug 11 2003, 07:44 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> nope i dissagree, i think everything has a counter. u cant say it doesnt because nsv2.0 hasnt been out long enough for you to figure out what has a counter and what doesnt. after 3 or 4 months of playing u will notice that this version is as balanced as it can get. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Please enlighten me on the counter to nade spam if the marines relocated to the vent room in tanith for example. You would make me very happy and i could have fun again on that map. Every time i play it some marine lamer comm relocates there and drags the game out for hours.

Redford

We have allready had about 100 posts so far that were either "NS SUX AND THIS IS WHY, CHANGE IT NUBS", or "THIS WILL MAKE NS BETTER!, I AM POSTING IN THE WRONG FORUM BECAUSE MY IDEA IS IMPORTANT!". Your post falls into the latter.

We do not need anymore balance posts. Go away.

monkeymaster

i said it will take more then 2 weeks or so to find a counter to everything. but try this. while they are busy hammering that place with grens u go and save for the other hives. or onos, or fades, or if they dont have HA yet use spores. hives only 35 res. im sure if you get a team of skulks to get them from behind or something you will take out enough of them to boost your res. just keep hastling them while your gorges save for the other hives.

Cheez1

<!--QuoteBegin--Redford+Aug 11 2003, 01:26 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Redford @ Aug 11 2003, 01:26 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> We have allready had about 100 posts so far that were either "NS SUX AND THIS IS WHY, CHANGE IT NUBS", or "THIS WILL MAKE NS BETTER!, I AM POSTING IN THE WRONG FORUM BECAUSE MY IDEA IS IMPORTANT!". Your post falls into the latter.

We do not need anymore balance posts. Go away. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Here here!! *thumbs up*

<!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->

coil

Your belief that spores and umbra have no counter proves that you don't really understand NS balance enough to comment on it. Please take your opinion to the Public Beta forum, where it might help if you take the time to flesh out your arguments and provide some actual gameplay to back it up.