Commander Strategy
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aka RpTheHotrodDallas, TX Join Date: 2003-01-08 Member: 12027Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
aka RpTheHotrodDallas, TX Join Date: 2003-01-08 Member: 12027Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
My tip
Commanders:
Build your IP/armory and immediatly send 2 or 3 (more if many marines in the server) marines out to get some res nodes. A few to defend base, of coarse. Build a TF + a few turrets at your base a s a p along with an observatory. Just concentrate on securing your res nodes and creeping out to get more after that. Secure main RTs with electrify PLUS a TF base. Secure "out of the way" RTs with electrify.
Once you have 3 res nodes secure, start working on your offensive. A good target are 2 res node rooms, a choke point, or an empty hive. There...build a TF/PG base. ALWAYS build observatories at every outpost. This includes RT TF bases if you have the res. Eventually try to build mini-bases at every RT you own.
As long as you can keep your RT bases alive, you should have enough res to handle attacks.
When on the offensive, go in and build your siege bases by using HAs and take out any enemy buildings, and just keep pushing forward. Keep building a new PG every so often as you move and build your siege bases.
If you saw me in a game, you'd notice that every 2 or 3 screens from comm view, I'd have a turret/siege base, sorta like stepping stones.
By using ths strategy, I've commed about 12 so far, and I've lost 1. Problem with this strategy is there is a TON of micro-managing you must do, and it takes a lot of skill, patience, and sometimes time to make it work right. It is NOT easy.
The biggest counter to this strategy is to have the aliens collectively attack 1 RT base at a time. it whithers away your resources and distracts the commander from pushing forward on his offensive.
As you can see on my map...each choke point at a base, and they couldn't push through with my HA/HMG/GL/Welders guarding each and getting to each one via PGs. I had about 280 res when I took that screenshot, that's how well it ended up being. Again, don't worry aliens, your average commander isn't exactly capable of micromanaging everything like this.
Now it may seem difficult to break through all that defense. Remember, that was a relocation...so it's the marine home. However, if the aliens wortk together (gorges bilebomb, lurkers use their support skills, skuls/onos/fades do the grunt work), it can be taken down rather quickly unless the marines are extremely fast. Even then, they can be worn away. However, I knew that, so I made SURE to take a chokepoint that would prevent them from easily getting more hives. No, it isn't unbalanced, the aliens simply failed expanding and guarding expansions well, and they lost the game.
and just for fun, I put this together.
<a href='http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/nsdrawing.txt' target='_blank'>http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/nsdrawing.txt</a>
Commanders:
Build your IP/armory and immediatly send 2 or 3 (more if many marines in the server) marines out to get some res nodes. A few to defend base, of coarse. Build a TF + a few turrets at your base a s a p along with an observatory. Just concentrate on securing your res nodes and creeping out to get more after that. Secure main RTs with electrify PLUS a TF base. Secure "out of the way" RTs with electrify.
Once you have 3 res nodes secure, start working on your offensive. A good target are 2 res node rooms, a choke point, or an empty hive. There...build a TF/PG base. ALWAYS build observatories at every outpost. This includes RT TF bases if you have the res. Eventually try to build mini-bases at every RT you own.
As long as you can keep your RT bases alive, you should have enough res to handle attacks.
When on the offensive, go in and build your siege bases by using HAs and take out any enemy buildings, and just keep pushing forward. Keep building a new PG every so often as you move and build your siege bases.
If you saw me in a game, you'd notice that every 2 or 3 screens from comm view, I'd have a turret/siege base, sorta like stepping stones.
By using ths strategy, I've commed about 12 so far, and I've lost 1. Problem with this strategy is there is a TON of micro-managing you must do, and it takes a lot of skill, patience, and sometimes time to make it work right. It is NOT easy.
The biggest counter to this strategy is to have the aliens collectively attack 1 RT base at a time. it whithers away your resources and distracts the commander from pushing forward on his offensive.
As you can see on my map...each choke point at a base, and they couldn't push through with my HA/HMG/GL/Welders guarding each and getting to each one via PGs. I had about 280 res when I took that screenshot, that's how well it ended up being. Again, don't worry aliens, your average commander isn't exactly capable of micromanaging everything like this.
Now it may seem difficult to break through all that defense. Remember, that was a relocation...so it's the marine home. However, if the aliens wortk together (gorges bilebomb, lurkers use their support skills, skuls/onos/fades do the grunt work), it can be taken down rather quickly unless the marines are extremely fast. Even then, they can be worn away. However, I knew that, so I made SURE to take a chokepoint that would prevent them from easily getting more hives. No, it isn't unbalanced, the aliens simply failed expanding and guarding expansions well, and they lost the game.
and just for fun, I put this together.
<a href='http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/nsdrawing.txt' target='_blank'>http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/nsdrawing.txt</a>
Comments
This is working in many games now, however, not all. If you wait too long, good alien gorges take choke points, like holoroom and maintenance. They just grab the res nodes, like normal gorges, and then decide to defend the area, and voila, you're cutoff. We won a game just by taking those 2 res nodes, fortifying with sensories and ocs, and camping them while gorges built hives and more res nodes leisurely (we had to take maintenance with some ocs first). Thus, if they're expanding rapidly and undefended this can work, but if they're grabbing chokes (the Khaara version of this strat?), you'll have to be more aggressive early on if you want to control them.
pod...why dont you look at the minimap. The aliens couldnt even GET to our base. Those turrets where there just to take out any stray aliens who got through a vent somewhere....and I had plenty of spare res to blow. Even if an alien got to a blindspot, we immediatly had 6 HAs with HMGs PG to base and take care of it.
and we won, all that matters.
Bad turret placement? Here is what buildings the turrets could cover without marine help
<a href='http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/ggcomm2.txt' target='_blank'>http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/ggcomm2.txt</a>
Every building is covered.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm saying that can be too late.
When I comm, normally I get them to take 2 res node rooms first....like holoroom. I'm just posting a "general" strategy for all maps here.
I think I see a blind spot or two by the left res... if only it weren't electrified. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Yes, I'll tell you right now, there is no "perfect strategy". It ALL depends on the situation.
When I say build a TF a s a p, it's not really to prevent rushes, it's so you can electrity your res nodes. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
btw...I commed using the same strat, another success. You can see my "base-creeping"
They had engine hive and refinery hive and all res nodes not near our base, until we creeped over them.
<a href='http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/baststrat.txt' target='_blank'>http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/baststrat.txt</a>
here is a picture of me starting a forward base. Note, there is a PG just below the screenshot.
I also built more regular turrets in front of the sieges after the screenshot.
<a href='http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/forwardbase.txt' target='_blank'>http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/forwardbase.txt</a>
Believe me, it was NOT easy. The aliens kept combining attacks at locations and I had to split my forces to several spots. Eventually, as we attacked engine, I had to keep several HAs in the tram tunnel to keep the aliens at bay there as well (they nearly took feed a few times). They also took down the forward base at the circle elevator room and I had to again, rebuild it there. Ton of micro-managing.....a ton. However, we pulled through and succeeded.
As a gorge player I have to say what ends up for us is that skulks/lerks go to the choke points and gas the hell out of marines. The gorges then set up camp at the nearest RTs to the hives, linking them all up while the Comm is desperately trying to pile into holoroom. 10 minutes later all 3 hives are up, marines finally take holoroom, then its the Onos Rush and bye bye marines. Make no mistake, sometimes it takes a while, but in every game where its happened it has ended in a marine loss.
If as a marine you notice this sort of pattern I'd warily suggest focusing on the other RTs before the gorges get to them. Aliens communicate a lot and a lot faster than marines, so watch for this sort of thing suddenly happening.
Some comms will send out a big squad to take it early, like you said (big or well equipped, no difference) and bump into lerk defence. Which *usually* convinces them that the aliens want it bad, so they chunnel vast resources into that one room while the aliens are all over the hives and rest of the map. I'm not saying all aliens do this, or that all comms would build a PG and TF and send everyone in at a time.... just saying that comms need to watch for clever alien teamwork designed only to tie you up rather than cap rts.
As a commander, I have shotgun gank squads chase down gorgies who aren't protected, so that my other guys can build chokepoints. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
pod...why dont you look at the minimap. The aliens couldnt even GET to our base. Those turrets where there just to take out any stray aliens who got through a vent somewhere....and I had plenty of spare res to blow. Even if an alien got to a blindspot, we immediatly had 6 HAs with HMGs PG to base and take care of it.
and we won, all that matters.
Bad turret placement? Here is what buildings the turrets could cover without marine help
<a href='http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/ggcomm2.txt' target='_blank'>http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/ggcomm2.txt</a>
Every building is covered. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
against a good alien team looks very risky.
You delay your offensive; well a good alien team may decide to go immediately for chokepoints. They will almost all be there and will probably slaughter your marines.
second, only combined alien attacks work? Well, WTH are aliens doing all the time, while you have built turret bases? Do they prance around the map, checking up on your good work? Do they sit around in the hive, chatting with one another? They had better freakin attack your outposts, and decide to attack together; otherwise they are a newbie team.
These will cause problems with the strat; I do not say you will lose the game, but you must account for competent enemies.
With chokepoints for instance you could perhaps set up a siege base nearby, or bring a grenade launcher.. I do not profess to have the answers to the counters however
About half the time, I take off immediately after a portal and armory, leaving one guy to build the rest... That's four marines with two shotguns and two lmgs crossing the map right off the bat... I normally beat the sensories to the first two or three res points, and then can scan from then on.
Of course, I switch it up, to keep the 'liens on their toes.
pod...why dont you look at the minimap. The aliens couldnt even GET to our base. Those turrets where there just to take out any stray aliens who got through a vent somewhere....and I had plenty of spare res to blow. Even if an alien got to a blindspot, we immediatly had 6 HAs with HMGs PG to base and take care of it.
and we won, all that matters.
Bad turret placement? Here is what buildings the turrets could cover without marine help
<a href='http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/ggcomm2.txt' target='_blank'>http://www.geocities.com/rpthehotrod/ggcomm2.txt</a>
Every building is covered. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
against a good alien team looks very risky.
You delay your offensive; well a good alien team may decide to go immediately for chokepoints. They will almost all be there and will probably slaughter your marines.
second, only combined alien attacks work? Well, WTH are aliens doing all the time, while you have built turret bases? Do they prance around the map, checking up on your good work? Do they sit around in the hive, chatting with one another? They had better freakin attack your outposts, and decide to attack together; otherwise they are a newbie team.
These will cause problems with the strat; I do not say you will lose the game, but you must account for competent enemies.
With chokepoints for instance you could perhaps set up a siege base nearby, or bring a grenade launcher.. I do not profess to have the answers to the counters however <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I dont delay the offensive.
As for my outposts, each have at least 2 sieges (small outposts), or 5 (large/main outposts), just in case.
and what were the aliens doing? Attacking my outposts, but many times they split in into 2 attack groups, for different outposts, which my HAs tore them up. The only way they could take it down is with a group effort (lurker support, onos grunt, etc...), and they did that occasionally, but we kept pushing back and re-gaining lost ground, and won the game.
As you can see with the minimap, I use outposts, and defend them well. It's like pushing an offensive wall towards the enemy.
like this
<img src='http://www7.wwiionline.com/map/belgium_front.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
You just keep pushing, reinforcing, push, reinforce. If you lost an outpost, fallback to a previous outpost (within range of sieging) and eventually re-take it again.
and as for risk....every strategy has risk. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
There's nothing essentially wrong with your strategy but I want to keep other readers aware that sensories will be all over the map within the first 2 mins - they go up before anything else, usually.
This will make for a long thread. Yes we know that no matter what possible comment is made, someone will have a counter for it. Thats how the game works. However it's constructive to have it as less of a counter counter counter argument and more of a "how to spot a counter" tip. Its all very well saying "I'll sensory" "I'll obs" "I'll rush your obs first" "I'll electrify" "I'll go fade" etc etc etc but it'd be handy if we add on the reasons.
I am merely pointing out that early game, sensory will be up faster than obs, and in greater numbers. This CAN be countered, however, the trick is to spot the sensories and never assume all the sensories are gone until you can see everything <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> While Obs are the counter, and yes you could build loads at each outpost, players also need to know that IMHO you can't realistically expect obs so early in the game that they will dent a sensory start. Nor will obs at outposts prevent the gorges from building outside the obs range and biding time.
No offence intended btw - just on a lot of strategy game threads it does start to degrade down to "you do that, i do this" backchat and less about the actual *reasons* or clues to spotting the counters.
Some of the tricky things gorges can do with sensory. Which reminds me, I was alien as a skulk with cloak. I got in and took out their base obs then cloaked. The comm built another right next to where I was. Marine runs up, builds, CHOMP...cloak. Another marine runs up, builds, CHOMP. I got about 7 marines before they got a clue. *rolls eyes*