A Request To The Ns Community
MonsieurEvil
Join Date: 2002-01-22 Member: 4Members, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
Join Date: 2002-01-22 Member: 4Members, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
<div class="IPBDescription">Everyone was new once</div> Heya NS fans,
Lately, the forums have been getting a little, well, snooty. People have tended to reply a bit more condescendingly, or perhaps treat new players with less respect then they are due. There's also been a tendency to try and moderate threads by people who aren't mods. And there've been too many flamewars, by NS forum standards.
<b>This needs to be stopped pronto.</b>
A lot of effort has been spent in the NS community to keep it very friendly, social, and PG. We want our forums, channels, and servers to be a refuge from the majority of the online world where anarchy reigns, and admins are nowhere to be seen. We can only do this with <b>YOUR</b> help.
In the next few weeks, the countdown to NS 1.1 is going to begin. This means that the publicity campaign is going to swing into high gear. All those screenshots, movies, battlefield stories, and the rest are going to bring a lot of new faces into the NS community. A lot of new faces that are not NS experts, who have not been playing since October 2002, have not been following the mod since July 2001. Basically, a lot of 'newbies'.
<b>These players are what will keep NS alive!</b>
They need to be welcomed, and treated with patience and respect. Again - <i>patience and respect</i>. This means that when someone asks some silly question for the 20th time that day, and you have nothing good to say, <i>then you have no reason to post.</i> First impressions are what counts in the online world, and if the first response someone gets to 'how do I evolve into an Onos?' is 'SUYF read the manual, n00b!' then that player is likely never to ask anything again. You and the NS team cannot afford for this to happen.
So, on behalf of the dev team, the mods, and the ops, I am asking you think before you post that flame. My moderators have also been told that we're tightening up, and they are going to enforce this new mindset with extreme force if necessary. This means you will get a thread lock and a PM if we find you getting out of hand. Then a temp ban. Then you will be gone forever. We don't want to ban anyone, but this is what it will take to maintain the peace and goodwill in here, we will.
That's all. Please make sure your friends and mates read this post (it will be stickied in a while). Ignorance will not be an excuse.
Thanks, and get ready for NS 1.1. It's going to be affecting your grades and work performance sooner than you think! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Lately, the forums have been getting a little, well, snooty. People have tended to reply a bit more condescendingly, or perhaps treat new players with less respect then they are due. There's also been a tendency to try and moderate threads by people who aren't mods. And there've been too many flamewars, by NS forum standards.
<b>This needs to be stopped pronto.</b>
A lot of effort has been spent in the NS community to keep it very friendly, social, and PG. We want our forums, channels, and servers to be a refuge from the majority of the online world where anarchy reigns, and admins are nowhere to be seen. We can only do this with <b>YOUR</b> help.
In the next few weeks, the countdown to NS 1.1 is going to begin. This means that the publicity campaign is going to swing into high gear. All those screenshots, movies, battlefield stories, and the rest are going to bring a lot of new faces into the NS community. A lot of new faces that are not NS experts, who have not been playing since October 2002, have not been following the mod since July 2001. Basically, a lot of 'newbies'.
<b>These players are what will keep NS alive!</b>
They need to be welcomed, and treated with patience and respect. Again - <i>patience and respect</i>. This means that when someone asks some silly question for the 20th time that day, and you have nothing good to say, <i>then you have no reason to post.</i> First impressions are what counts in the online world, and if the first response someone gets to 'how do I evolve into an Onos?' is 'SUYF read the manual, n00b!' then that player is likely never to ask anything again. You and the NS team cannot afford for this to happen.
So, on behalf of the dev team, the mods, and the ops, I am asking you think before you post that flame. My moderators have also been told that we're tightening up, and they are going to enforce this new mindset with extreme force if necessary. This means you will get a thread lock and a PM if we find you getting out of hand. Then a temp ban. Then you will be gone forever. We don't want to ban anyone, but this is what it will take to maintain the peace and goodwill in here, we will.
That's all. Please make sure your friends and mates read this post (it will be stickied in a while). Ignorance will not be an excuse.
Thanks, and get ready for NS 1.1. It's going to be affecting your grades and work performance sooner than you think! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Comments
it says... hm...
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->In case you didn't catch it, the description of this forum lists a single rule.
<b>This forum is -not- for questions about how to map. This forum is for questions about how to use the NS specific entities, NS specific design specifications, and NS concepts within a map.</b><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I read this faq, therefore question from my side will be like "how to block the commanderbuild AND the player movements in a simple way?" and not "how do I make glass?" because its explained on every second thread in this forum. I can understand why some guys really get nuts when reading "help! how I make doors?" and get a little angry. to avoid a real war <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> starting in this forum they should be forced to read chrome angles tuts at least. not only this guy knows what hes talking about,... hie maps are great <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
A. Ignore the post (Unless it emits some dangerous light rays out of your computer and will blind you)
B. Politly refer him to a link that he can go to so he can learn more.
c. Answer the poor guys question.
But instead people respond with an impatient/rude attitude. Whats worse is this kind of attitude is more of a global attitude that I find in many forums.
Learning how to do things takes time and really when it come right down to it there isn't a definitive source for mapping. There are a million tutorials spread out all over the place, but finding them can be a real pain. So it makes sense people would ask in a place where mappers hang out.
There is never a reason to make someone feel stupid or unwelcome. There is an old saying that has been lost on this younger generation.
"If you can't say something nice. Don't say anything at all."
BE NICE!!!
This is a big problem in the models forum too, which is a hotbed of flames. Made rather worse by there being very few active modellers and many people making unrealistic requests, so people can get rather short-tempered and annoyed with them from time to time.
However, there's not much that can be done about it. It seems like most people like to be spoon-fed information while only a handful would try to seek it out themselves (by reading FAQs, searching the forums, etc). I don't know what the solution would be, because there's not much more you can do to highlight important topics (ie the FAQs) other than stickying them.
However, there's not much that can be done about it. It seems like most people like to be spoon-fed information while only a handful would try to seek it out themselves (by reading FAQs, searching the forums, etc). I don't know what the solution would be, because there's not much more you can do to highlight important topics (ie the FAQs) other than stickying them. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I totally agree with you, but my point is people dont have to get mean about it. There just seems to be to few "Please" and "Thank yous" in the online world.
ok I admit the online world leads to that behaviour. what to say? the world changes. there are many different people out there you know...
Social and... phase gate?? What are you talking about... there's no need for phase gates here..
what is he talking about?? <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Calm down I'm only joking (although if I do say so myself this appendix RUINS it).
Social and... phase gate?? What are you talking about... there's no need for phase gates here..
what is he talking about?? <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Calm down I'm only joking (although if I do say so myself this appendix RUINS it). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
No fun...
Well, would be fun if I knew what PG meant, but now youre just making me feel really really stupid...
PG is part of the American movie rating system... it stands for <b><span style='color:white'>P</span></b>arental <b><span style='color:white'>G</span></b>uidance Suggested. Most children's movies released in the US these days have a PG rating.
Monse is basically asking for clean language and thread topics that would be safe for all ages (which makes sense since this is a public forum).
Because he is an american guy i guess, speaking about what he knows. "Be polite, blabla" : ok for this but .. what "SUFY" means ? Is it supposed to be a flame word ? I never saw it anywhere. And what's the point to ask for evolving to Onos on a mapping forum !?
The mapping forum will remain gentle and accurate if moderators do their job and if the Maus' suggestion is copied
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->However, there's not much that can be done about it. It seems like most people like to be spoon-fed information while only a handful would try to seek it out themselves (by reading FAQs, searching the forums, etc). I don't know what the solution would be, because there's not much more you can do to highlight important topics (ie the FAQs) other than stickying them.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
SUYF is before my time, but my understanding is it evolved in the NS community as a sort of joke replacement for another four letter acronym, and means "Shut up your face".
There has once again been a relative jump in the flaming and snooty comments. The "elitism" lately has grown annoying. Don't deny it. When people have to state "please don't flame me" in the first line of the post, you know there is something wrong. I know people that don't browse these forums because of all the crap going on and some won't show there work here because it'll get flamed and bitched at. People should not need thick skins. If you don't like something, give useful feedback. If you don't like fun maps in general, don't post your opinion on them in someones thread. Etc, etc. Come on people, you can do better.
I am not reviving this for the discussion, simply to bring the first post back into light.
There has once again been a relative jump in the flaming and snooty comments. The "elitism" lately has grown annoying. Don't deny it. When people have to state <b>"please don't flame me"</b> in the first line of the post, you know there is something wrong. I know people that don't browse these forums because of all the crap going on and some won't show there work here because it'll get flamed and bitched at. People should not need thick skins. If you don't like something, give useful feedback. If you don't like fun maps in general, don't post your opinion on them in someones thread. Etc, etc. Come on people, you can do better.
I am not reviving this for the discussion, simply to bring the first post back into light.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't fully agree with your logic after that statement. I think there is a fair majority of the time when people put that line in somewhere they don't want to be flamed b/c they did not feel like taking the time to read some FAQs or search the forums some. There're have been some problems with flames but it's a two fold problem. We have one group that feels that they don't need to read the stickys or search the forum if only for a few min. Then we have another group that is bored and wants to cause some excitement.
But, the second group is far more hurtful to the community than the few people that don't use the faq's. You see, the lazy types who don't see the faqs are not usually repeat offenders, flamers and such ARE.
But, the second group is far more hurtful to the community than the few people that don't use the faq's. You see, the lazy types who don't see the faqs are not usually repeat offenders, flamers and such ARE. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Again, I disagree. I think it's often the first group who refuses to read the FAQ's or search the forums first are the ones that provide the second group of flamers ammunition to use in their flame attack. I know from reading several flame threads that the flaming often starts after some one failed to read the FAQ or search the forums and they bring up at topic that has been brough up dozens of times and answered dozens of times. I know that I grow tired of reading the same questions time and time again. Some people just grow more tired of seeing/answering the same question over and over again and hence the flames. I don't condone the flaming but I think it will take more than just reviving this old topic to cure some of the current flame wars.
A) Run a NS fansite
B) Create maps
C) Create modifications
This is just plain silly. We're all human beings and we're all fans of NS, we shouldn't be snobby, vindictive, or condescending towards one another. Nothing hurts more than when I see yet another flame war crop up or another shot taken at someone who revived an old thread, made a positive comment, added their objective opinion, or whatever. It needs to get put into perspective. These are forums, meant for open discussion, and they should not be a war zone. People should feel welcome here, and should not feel like they are walking into a firefight. Be good to each other.
If you're tired of answering a question over and over again, then don't answer it. Nobody's coercing you into doing it, and if you flame you're probably making it worlse for yourself anyway. Chances someone else will come along and be able to answer it in a level-headed fashion. If you really feel like getting in there and dishing out some juicy insults, take a break and go get a nice cold drink. If you come back later and <i>still</i> want to flame, perhaps you should go back and take a nice cold mallet to the head. There really is no excuse.
either way, i agree, the flaming needs to stop
if you don't like someone's model, then thats your problem, but if it's an actual mistake, point it out nicely, not like 'OMFGZ0RZ j00 FUBARED TEH HANDUL11!!!!!1!!!!!1!!'
EDIT::
<!--QuoteBegin-Insane+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Insane)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The fact of the matter is that there's no excuse for flaming somebody, whether they've read the FAQ or no. BigDXLT is right, it's the flamers that cause the biggest problem, not those that don't read up.
If you're tired of answering a question over and over again, then don't answer it. Nobody's coercing you into doing it, and if you flame you're probably making it worlse for yourself anyway. Chances someone else will come along and be able to answer it in a level-headed fashion. If you really feel like getting in there and dishing out some juicy insults, take a break and go get a nice cold drink. If you come back later and still want to flame, perhaps you should go back and take a nice cold mallet to the head. There really is no excuse.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>Exactally.</b>
Step down off your high horse. If Thursday- is going too far, use that "report" button which is on each and every post. Leave the moderating to the moderators.
The moderators have been getting soft on these forums. I shouldn't have to report every single flame. PEOPLE SHOULD JUST STOP IT THEMSELVES. I will continue to keep this thread at the top until it is stickied. (I suggest all discussion be removed as well as it is irrelevent.)
The moderators have been getting soft on these forums. I shouldn't have to report every single flame. PEOPLE SHOULD JUST STOP IT THEMSELVES. I will continue to keep this thread at the top until it is stickied. (I suggest all discussion be removed as well as it is irrelevent.) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The reason for the report button is to call a moderator. I've asked NemesisZero to "patrol" these forums, or make a dedicated mapping moderator, but he simply told me to use the report button more.
That's what it's there for, reporting rule violations. As i said, leave the moderating to the moderators.
And by the way, i fail to see what's ironic about me pointing out a forum feature to you. I'm neither trying to enforce the rules nor "moderate" this thread in any way. I'm merely pointing out that you should report posts rather than trying to "handle" flamers in your own way. Once again, please, leave the moderating to the moderators, they have the power to do something, neither you nor i do.
That isn't the point. The moderators shouldn't have to do all the work. The members of the community have to do some themselves. The moderators will talk to a specific person. This post is TO EVERYONE. I have yet to see the mods do anything to stop the "elitism" that is occuring among established members of this community.
The mods don't pro-activly moderate this forum? Well, that's good to know. (Yay for reactive policing, which is quite the opposite from what I remember in the old days of this board.)
This thread is not for debate. It's to get people to stop treating others with disrespect. I will continue to bump this thread every time I use the report button though.
On retrospect, yeah, I shouldn't have put a certain name in with the bump. But you can't tell me that I'm wrong for wanting to see that kind of crap put to an end. I know you hate when people don't use the trouble shooting forum. I hate when people say a thread is "crap" just because it's not their favorite topic. (When they could easily EASILY ignore it.)