Why Build A Defense When They Got Gls?
T_T_H
Join Date: 2003-05-01 Member: 15977Members
Join Date: 2003-05-01 Member: 15977Members
<div class="IPBDescription">...or HOW to build a defense if...</div> Hi guys
Ok, I am a newbie concerning Kharaa tactics, so please forgive my possible cluelessness.
I am the Gorge and I got several resource towers and I even got the second hive. Ressources are incoming and now I want to secure one hive or one strategic important room against the marines who will attack sooner or later.
I tried everything concerning towers (dots are for spacing only):
| . . . . . |
|OO . O|
| . . . . . |
|DD .. O|
| . . . . . |
_____|. . |_____
O D O . . . O D O
. . .O . . . . .O . . .
---------------------
To build up that complex defense formations takes ressources and takes time. But then comes that damn marine with the gernade launcher <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> (Actually a friend of mine - the guy I told how to play marines and be a good commander - damn he is learning fast.....). He always does the same, dirty trick: strafe in, PLOPP-PLOPP-PLOPP-PLOPP (4 grenade shots), strafe out, BOOM-BOOM-BOOM-BOOM (4 explosions), reload, strafe in, PLOPP-PLOPP-PLOPP-PLOPP (4 grenade shots), strafe out, BOOM-BOOM-BOOM-BOOM (4 explosions), all Kharaa structures gone, he on 90% health. This can't be it!!! I spent 100+ res and he just needs a bloody GL. All this attack is way too fast for my skulks/fades to come back and help and I couldn't even prevent it with webs (well, maybe I placed them wrong). So pleeeeeaaaase, give me an advice what to do!
T.T.H.
Ok, I am a newbie concerning Kharaa tactics, so please forgive my possible cluelessness.
I am the Gorge and I got several resource towers and I even got the second hive. Ressources are incoming and now I want to secure one hive or one strategic important room against the marines who will attack sooner or later.
I tried everything concerning towers (dots are for spacing only):
| . . . . . |
|OO . O|
| . . . . . |
|DD .. O|
| . . . . . |
_____|. . |_____
O D O . . . O D O
. . .O . . . . .O . . .
---------------------
To build up that complex defense formations takes ressources and takes time. But then comes that damn marine with the gernade launcher <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> (Actually a friend of mine - the guy I told how to play marines and be a good commander - damn he is learning fast.....). He always does the same, dirty trick: strafe in, PLOPP-PLOPP-PLOPP-PLOPP (4 grenade shots), strafe out, BOOM-BOOM-BOOM-BOOM (4 explosions), reload, strafe in, PLOPP-PLOPP-PLOPP-PLOPP (4 grenade shots), strafe out, BOOM-BOOM-BOOM-BOOM (4 explosions), all Kharaa structures gone, he on 90% health. This can't be it!!! I spent 100+ res and he just needs a bloody GL. All this attack is way too fast for my skulks/fades to come back and help and I couldn't even prevent it with webs (well, maybe I placed them wrong). So pleeeeeaaaase, give me an advice what to do!
T.T.H.
Comments
but what i think the prob u got is not enough DC!
|WW|
________|WW|_______
WO. .O D O . . O D O . O W
. .W D D D O O D D D W .
-------------------------------
W=webs!
the basic here is... max the limit of dc+oc! and allways cover the DC's back with 1 OC+webs...
same for this:
| WWW |
|OOOOO|
| DDDD .|
| DDDD .|
| .OOO. .|
| WWW |
(if celling low make room for fade+onos to pass!!!!)
Only way to stop that is to attack against him. So when you next time see him attacking with GL, don't run away or try to heal spray your structures, instead evolve to skulk and KILL HIM. GL marines are quite easy to kill (if they just attack alone).
Or take celerity and carapace (so he can't kill you with knife and you are much harder target to GL and pistol aswell) to your gorge and try to get close to him and keep shooting web on the floor behind / front of him.
After you hear the web sound just keep shooting the web and heal spray (or spit), until he dies or you have some skulk / fade support.
Defenses are meant to slow marines down, thus enabling the skulks and other aliens to arrive and kill the intruders. There is nothing you as a gorge can do to prevent GLs from destroying your defenses - instead, you have to build defenses which will take as long as possible to clear, and which MUST be cleared for marines to get through. The aim is not to kill the marines, but to buy as much time as possible for help to arrive.
D towers have a pretty good healing range, so you can space them back from the O tower wall and still allow them to regenerate. This also helps protect them from the intial GL volley and allows your fortification to hold out a little longer so reinforcements can arrive.
Cheers,
Alias20
But some following questions:
1.
What is better: build the OC-DC-combo in the middle of a long hallway (long line of sight) or right behind the corner of a hallway (short line of sight)?
2.
If the hive has two entrances (like ns_nothing "Great Viaduct") how to defend it? Both sides or one big defense in the center?
3.
What are the ranges of the different towers (OC, DC, sentry, siege)? Where are they written down? (note: I do know the "Stratplan" tool)
My conclusion of your posts is that it is not possible for the Kharaa to build up a "indestructible" defense as the marines can do with their turrets, right!? The advice "defense slows them, creatures kill them" is a good one - only that my few fellow alien brothers are not that skilled yet to perform such an attack in minimal time. Newbie aliens can't be "controlled" and "directed" as good as newbie marines, I think.
Thanks,
T.T.H.
I use OCs as warning tools and damaging tools, if I kill with them, woo hoo. OCs just don't have the accuracy to wall them up with.. a marine peeking out around a corner can destroy that 50+ wall you just made without getting damaged once.
Could someone tell me about this? Searching brought nothing up except this current topic.
Defenses are meant to slow marines down, thus enabling the skulks and other aliens to arrive and kill the intruders. There is nothing you as a gorge can do to prevent GLs from destroying your defenses - instead, you have to build defenses which will take as long as possible to clear, and which MUST be cleared for marines to get through. The aim is not to kill the marines, but to buy as much time as possible for help to arrive. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
rah
Could someone tell me about this? Searching brought nothing up except this current topic. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
www.mercior.com
I use OCs as warning tools and damaging tools, if I kill with them, woo hoo. OCs just don't have the accuracy to wall them up with.. a marine peeking out around a corner can destroy that 50+ wall you just made without getting damaged once. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thats how I have my OC placement done
the only time I WoL is right outside of marine base <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
What is better: build the OC-DC-combo in the middle of a long hallway (long line of sight) or right behind the corner of a hallway (short line of sight)?
2.
If the hive has two entrances (like ns_nothing "Great Viaduct") how to defend it? Both sides or one big defense in the center?
3.
What are the ranges of the different towers (OC, DC, sentry, siege)? Where are they written down? (note: I do know the "Stratplan" tool)
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
1) OC's are more effective at killing at close range, so they are best build near doors or corners. If the intent of the ocs is to stop people from running past them, rather than fire support during an assault, spreading them out works better. Spreading out your OC's also makes it much harder to GL them.
2) Put your OC's in places that hit marines that skulks will have a hard time with. In the viaduct example, you want at least a few ocs down near your res node (spread out, most likely), and an OC or 2 up on the high walkway if you can manage it. If you want more security, place another couple OC's on the entrance walkway, as close to the entrances as you can get without blocking the OC's shots at jetpackers flying around in the hive room.
Coverage is the issue here: you don't want to give the marines a place to hide, because they will find it. Putting all of your structures in one big block in the center leaves lots of blindspots, plus it's easy to GL.
3) Effective ranges on OC's you just have to get a feeling for. They are quite horrible, often missing a sitting duck target at even medium ranges. Sentries are (fairly) accurate at a decent range, but they have a hard time tracking fast enough. DC's and sieges are equally effective anywhere within a certain radius. The DC range is actually fairly large, and you can get a good feel for how large by seeing how close you have to get to one to get healed as a skulk. Sieges are easy; they have the nice green radius indicator on the command screen.
On the original topic: The solution to keeping a WoL fairly safe from a GL is not building more structures, but rather building them smart. DC's after the first 3 don't add a whole lot of effectiveness, so I wouldn't bother (only 3 dcs can heal a player/structure at a time). Instead, just spread your buildings out a little. The damage decreases the further a building is from an explosion, so leaving some space between them prevents them all from being taken out at once. Even just leaving a few feet between your forward OC's and your DC's is enough to make a big difference.
I only lost eclipse because of the siege guns. I took out like 20 JP HMG guys before that though, keeping the hive at full health with DC and healthsprays
So if I do attack the marine main base and have to get past all those sentries to destroy the infantry portal and the command station, is it possible to build DCs right outside of the marine base so that my attack aliens get healed by them while attacking/dodging the marine structures?!
Once again a big "thanks" for the very informative answers!!!
Bye,
T.T.H.
You can NEVER defend yourself from GLs, but you can halt the progress some by doing following:
1. DCs heal trough walls, try to place them aroun a corner, in another room etc..then they will not be hurt and die either, but healing is just as good...
2. OCs needs to be stacked high, not deep, to prevent jets to fly past to easy...
3. Webs are your best friend....place them on the floor by corners, so the marine stucks just as he turns...then hes toast with only 3 OCs...placing several webs after eacjh others stops entire squads, but never have them to visible...
Also make sure to have a line high in the air to stop any jetpackers...
4. Best place to create a chokehold is somewhere you cant "bounce" grenades in...like behind doors that needs to be opened maually(messhall), on higher ground behind corners in large rooms(on Southloop(EC)platform or on the rail around hive in Noname hive(Nancy))
Hope it helps...GLs should be used more though...