About Comm View

uffo

<div class="IPBDescription">how it works</div> Didn't find anything about this from guidelines so I have to rely on your professional opinions.
Since i'm new in NS mapping I really don't know how it works (and my comp crashes too much
when launching HL just for little tests, so I figured that it would be faster just ask).

First of all, does comm see automatically trough the first ceiling (1st pic), or do i have to add something?
The second thing is, that if comm sees trough 1st one, does he see trough 2nd, 3rd and so on until he
reaches the empty space what we handle as empty room (2nd pic)?

would be very clad if you clear things out to me <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->

Candy_Man

In both one and two the comm would be able to see into the level. Anything that doesnt touch the cieling you cant see through i.e. a pipe 12 units below the cieling would block the view as opposed to a pipe thats touching the cieling on more than just a point (flat pipe <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> )

If you think about, if you had to make the cieling a func_seethrough well....entities cant be in the void so...wouldn't work.

uffo

<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->If you think about, if you had to make the cieling a func_seethrough well....entities cant be in the void so...wouldn't work.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

well i really thought about it, and came up with this idea:
comm is in certain altitude from the level, so i could build ceiling above him and then put func_seethrough
for other ceilings. but that wouldn't be any good for hl engine, would it?

and that 2nd pic would cause "Leaf portal saw into leaf" btw <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->

taleden

<!--QuoteBegin--uffo+May 7 2003, 11:57 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (uffo @ May 7 2003, 11:57 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> and that 2nd pic would cause "Leaf portal saw into leaf" btw <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It would? How? The blue and red are both solid objects, and I'm assuming the blue piece under the red piece in #2 would actually be created with three brushes (one for each angle, one for the flat piece in the middle), since brushes have to be convex..

uffo

well i presumed that it wouldn't be convex anymore since the middle bush isn't seperated to three brushes.

taleden

well, I presumed that his drawing wasn't meant to portray literal brush placement, since he was only asking whether having a second layer of brushes between the void and the ceiling would obscure comm view.. but, if he actually makes his ceiling with one convex brush, then his map won't compile anyway and he won't have to worry about anyone getting in the comm chair. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->

uffo

good thing i'm not that dumb <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
but yes, it wasn't literal drawing

Cagey

It's not the #1 item on my list, but I am going to overhaul the Commander Mode Notes from the NSTR 2 distribution; that document addresses these sorts of questions directly along with discussion of how to make the commander view look as good as possible. Once it's done it will become a linked companion document to the Mapping Guidelines.

The "current" version from NSTR 2 uses out-of-date entities (e.g. it was written before there was an actual comm chair--the commander hit a switch to enter comm mode and dissapeared), so it might do more harm than good as a reference. The Guidelines don't discuss commander mode in depth because it was traditionally discussed in the separate document.

Insane

When compiling, faces that touch the void are removed. Therefore, you can see through into the level in dev_overview 1 and suchlike, because there is no face blocking your view. I would think that commander mode would take advantage of this as well, so you wouldn't need to do anything to cielings. Anything that does not touch the void, but could obstruct the commander's view therefore has to be made a func_seethrough (I believe that that is the right entitiy to use).

I think that's the basic premise of it. If I'm totally wrong feel free to slap me.

Fam

<!--QuoteBegin--Insane+May 7 2003, 06:39 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Insane @ May 7 2003, 06:39 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> When compiling, faces that touch the void are removed. Therefore, you can see through into the level in dev_overview 1 and suchlike, because there is no face blocking your view. I would think that commander mode would take advantage of this as well, so you wouldn't need to do anything to cielings. Anything that does not touch the void, but could obstruct the commander's view therefore has to be made a func_seethrough (I believe that that is the right entitiy to use). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I do believe this is correct, and if I remember, to get rid of the hall of mirrors effect, a large black box/sprite is drawn beneath the map. Clever. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->

Insane

Ohoho. I always wondered how that was done.

taleden

..hence the min z value on the info_mapinfo - where to draw the big black box. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->