Europe Anyone?
gham
United Kingdom Join Date: 2003-05-01 Member: 15991Members
United Kingdom Join Date: 2003-05-01 Member: 15991Members
<div class="IPBDescription">..</div> Just wondering, upon a quick view of the NS top 10 clans why no european clans have been looked at, currently it seems only the american ns community gets a look in on anything.
You just leaving us to die Flayra?<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
You just leaving us to die Flayra?<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
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This is the deal. Clanbase isn't active for NS. I know of no other big European NS clan resource. If anyone can show me how the Euros are playing more NS then the Americans, then I'll admit that I chose poorly. As it is, Americans are playing NS more then anyone else, and the American clan scene is the most active, so that's where I chose the vets from.
what he said
<a href='http://subzeromedia.co.uk/mrmen/' target='_blank'>http://subzeromedia.co.uk/mrmen/</a>
Name: The Mr.Men Clan Server - Natural Selection 1.04
IP: 213.221.175.69:27018
IRC QuakeNet #The.Mr.Men
admin@themrmen.org - Steiner <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo-->
But yah, all I see is American clans too...
All I see is Euro clans, but that's because I'm in Europe.
Just because you don't see any european clans on gamesnet doesn't mean a thing. I want to know though, was any attempt made to find any of the european clans?
<a href='http://www.clanbase.com/rating.php?lid=756' target='_blank'>http://www.clanbase.com/rating.php?lid=756</a> < is a ladder of european clans.
<a href='http://www.uknsleague.com/' target='_blank'>http://www.uknsleague.com/</a> < is a ns league based in the uk, but allows european clans.
Clanbase is more inactive due to the way its run, and its messed up nature. Thats why its inactive, and of course the stale nature of 1.04 doesn't help much either. The site ukns.org is also hoping the cover the europe scene, with a design in the works, and just the coding and bug fixing to commence.
Come onto quakenet, pop into the #torment channel (due to them being the best clan, formally Blind Fury) and speak to them about who they believe to be the best in europe, since they've played with most of them. I don't know G personally, but he seemed like a good guy when i've played with him/seen him on irc etc...how about you speak to him? Or even easier, Immacolata, member of #team.relic is an active member of the ns community over here.
And a final question, do you honestly expect european players to play on servers accross the atlantic, where pings go through the roof? I never see american clans on the european servers i play on, does that mean there is no US ns scene..?
Although.... I'm not going into specifics of 'some' Euro clans.... *Cough Cough* Exploiting mofos *Cough*
<b>N.B</b> - Note, I didn't mention any. You got issues with that, maybe you should check your guilty conscience.
By American clans I don't he is excluding Canadians or anybody else in the Western Hemisphere. My team, #cri, actually has a member that plays from Panama (tiny country with canal between North & South America).
I know a lot of Canadians that are in predominately American clans, etc. All that is really needed is the same time zones.
I think right now, even if you guys think Flayra was unjust to pick just from American clans, the best you can do now is accept it. And try not to stress Flayra out anymore. The American clans can handle stressing him out enough!
There are quite a few European Playtesters/Veterans so its not like non-Americans have been deliberately excluded.
Btw, I've been getting to know a few Euro clans and some of them are quite good. I think if not for the horrible pings they would be able to compete with most of the American clans.
Lets just be happy and AWAIT the arrival of 1.1. I can tell you that 1.1 is infinetly cooler than 1.04 in terms of strategic differences. I've been playing it nonstop and there is so much more to learn!
The first question I'm addressing is how do I change my tactics so panda/HAM quits owning me!!!!!! LOL Its bad when they've collected 1200 resources and your team has only collected 156 resources. Hehe
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Gamesnet has servers in Europe too! Join eu.gamesnet.net. It's just that the author of mIRC hasn't figured that out - yet.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Come onto quakenet, pop into the #torment channel (due to them being the best clan, formally Blind Fury) and speak to them about who they believe to be the best in europe, since they've played with most of them. I don't know G personally, but he seemed like a good guy when i've played with him/seen him on irc etc...how about you speak to him? Or even easier, Immacolata, member of #team.relic is an active member of the ns community over here.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually, if you look to your left, yes, under my name.... <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> Anyways, biggest problem with Europe is the usual myopic approach. "Hey, let's make a UK league. Non, we shall make le French coupe. Nein, es must german sein! Sai italiano? Etc. So clanning in europe, ns wise, is splintered all over the place. Probably due to sponsors not seeing any idea having freeloading frenchies and german play on their uk servers since they perfectlywell know that they wont get more customers for the uk run operations. And the other way around. Me, I'm danish but quickly realized all the hot NS action is outside our borders. So, quitcher whining! The veterans doing the playtest now is already A LOT more forthcoming towards balance than I'd ever had imagined. Be content that at least some veterans are playtesting NS 1.1 for better clanning balance, than none at all.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And a final question, do you honestly expect european players to play on servers accross the atlantic, where pings go through the roof? I never see american clans on the european servers i play on, does that mean there is no US ns scene..?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm connecting to a handful of american servers at 130-150 ms. Thats good enough for playtesting, but perhaps a bit too high for some's taste when it comes to clan play. Thats probably why we dont see much crosspondial clan action.
I know you're a playtester...thats why i thought you may be someone who could advise about the clan scene over here <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Its one thing to have some random guy saying "yeah, well...this clan is great, this one isnt" etc, but someone you know you can rely on saying it is a different thing altogether.
I know you're a playtester...thats why i thought you may be someone who could advise about the clan scene over here <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Its one thing to have some random guy saying "yeah, well...this clan is great, this one isnt" etc, but someone you know you can rely on saying it is a different thing altogether. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, I probably could, but at this point of time it's is not the time for petty bickering about who got chosen and whom did not. I think I'm doing everone a favour by not bringing the topic up now - but now that it HAS been brought up ... <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> I want NS 1.1 finished just as much as everybody else, and starting to have to take into consideration many more clans or players will just sour the milk. So let it lie, and make sure to make yourself know on these boards APART from just registering to post and ask why you werent asked. And if anyone got any suggestion for a unifying clan ladder for europeans - apart from clanbase, do tell, do tell!
Alas I meet many clans who claims "Clanbase sucks because they only play to win". True, but if that is the reason NS clanning doesnt evolve in Europe, dont blame the developers for not discovering our tiny community. If we cant even agree to play clanbase, what can we agree to?
/me savours the irony of that the splintered Euro clan scene is so much like EU political scene.
I'm in Brisbane and there's a good clan scene emerging here. Our clan plays on the gamearena ladder frequently and there is some serious competition going on here. I note that a few of the pts are from Australia and certainly the servers here are always packed with players.
I dunno, it's the dev's call on this one obviously, I just feel like the rest of the world get's left out. Not just in NS though, it's a widespread thing. I mean yesterday I signed up with paypal to throw some money into the Constelation program, labouring under the strange belief that when paypal's main page said you could transfer money into your paypal account from a bank account they ment I could actually do that. How wrong I was.
As long as the veterans don't get all "elitest" on the rest of the NS community I suppose I have no problem with them being only from the US. Doesn't stop me being annoyed that the rest of the world is kinda "dismissed"...
I live in europe
All I can say is, if you want a european league or whatever it is you are talking about, TAKE INITIATIVE, Flayra isn't your mommy.
FFS, stop complaining and start organizing whatever it is that you want so badly!!! <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
I live in europe
All I can say is, if you want a european league or whatever it is you are talking about, TAKE INITIATIVE, Flayra isn't your mommy.
FFS, stop complaining and start organizing whatever it is that you want so badly!!! <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Clanbase. It's there. Yeah it's slow as a continental drift, but it's there and ready to use. So use it for crimineys sake <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<a href='http://www.clanbase.com/rating.php?lid=756' target='_blank'>http://www.clanbase.com/rating.php?lid=756</a>
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Well speaking for Australia we have a full ladder setup with challanges, private servers, active clan vs clan orgainisation and matches as well as IRC channels and forums. Of course there's only around 50 clans on the ladder but hey, we're a small country. However I would say that what we have qualifies as at least an orgainisation, if not a league. It's certainly australia wide.
Some of the clans in the top five can just sit there and refuse to play matches, and just stay there. There is no real incentive for them to play matches and attempt to keep their place.
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Well speaking for Australia we have a full ladder setup with challanges, private servers, active clan vs clan orgainisation and matches as well as IRC channels and forums. Of course there's only around 50 clans on the ladder but hey, we're a small country. However I would say that what we have qualifies as at least an orgainisation, if not a league. It's certainly australia wide. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thats the problem, EU are many markets, so there's a german community, french, uk, swedish, etc. etc. etc. etc. Australia is like USA a rather homgenous entity. Clanbase has 43 active clans. That's out of a 450 mio. population >_<
Some of the clans in the top five can just sit there and refuse to play matches, and just stay there. There is no real incentive for them to play matches and attempt to keep their place. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah Clanbase seems a bit stale. The leader can sit on top of the ladder for ages without actually taking any serious matches. They played Torment it seems, and lost. But thatas about the only visible activity in a month.
But I am sure that Torment, d/y, Nova and other clans can get an easy shot at it.
And as to vets, I have never heard of any d/y being a vet.
you should try to get some Euro vets to see how 1.1 plays on this side of the atlantic <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
So why not at least take a look at some of the Aussie clans? We all speak english and occupy similar time-zones; hell veterans from Australia could test NS while the devs and pts in the states are getting much needed sleep <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> I'm not saying this SHOULD happen, I just want to point out that there are exceptions to the language and nationality problems. I'm sure the UK would be a similar situation to Australia. But that aside, shouldn't any clan who can speak English fluently and can provide constructive feedback be eligable for the veteran program? We certainly have the experiance...
I've played in many cross-continental matches in Kingpin, and it simply wasn't pretty. The connections were absolutely dire (OK it's going back a few years now) and the time difference meant we had to stay up until 2 in the morning just to get started on a match, and the US players had to come home early when we played on our terms.
I prefer to keep official cross-continental scrims under the covers. The only true way to match up is to have one clan fly out to the US/Aus, then fly the opponents the other way and have 2 matches <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> That's just silly though.
Back to topic, those in Europe (eg immac, lo m8) who CAN playtest easily with moderate connections and who don't mind the time difference aren't exactly being denied the opportunity, and at the end of the day it's Flay's decision.
Finally, All of the dev team (incl the playtesters) are working VERY HARD for the rest of us (as well as for themselves!) and they're to be commended, US, Aus or EU. Keep up the good work!!
Roo
I've played in many cross-continental matches in Kingpin, and it simply wasn't pretty. The connections were absolutely dire (OK it's going back a few years now) and the time difference meant we had to stay up until 2 in the morning just to get started on a match, and the US players had to come home early when we played on our terms.
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Why make it cross-continental? For testing purposes why not have a British 1.1 server, an Aussie 1.1 server ect which the veteras from each country can join. They send the info and reports back to Flayra and the devs or report in the secret forums here.
I wasn't suggesting connecting to the 1.1 servers in the states; it's simply not feasible, and looking at some of the screenies from 1.1 which show Aussie pts playing the pings are still a problem. But would there be a serious problem with regional servers? Blizzard does similar things with their playtesting, could not NS do the same?
*flameshield*
If NS wasn't such a big mod, it wouldn't matter if there were no Europeans. But from what I see, there's as much NS in Europe as in the States.
I'd think you could go maybe at least 2 non-US PT servers. 1 for Europe 1 for aus. I am sure there are some Europeans and Australians that are as experienced, if not more, than most American players. We don't live under a rock ya know.
*flameshield*
If NS wasn't such a big mod, it wouldn't matter if there were no Europeans. But from what I see, there's as much NS in Europe as in the States.
I'd think you could go maybe at least 2 non-US PT servers. 1 for Europe 1 for aus. I am sure there are some Europeans and Australians that are as experienced, if not more, than most American players. We don't live under a rock ya know. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Shant we just let this die now? Accept things, move on.