All Marines Refusing To Command

ViPr · February 2003

<div class="IPBDescription">increasing phenomenon</div> i remember in the first days of NS many marines would rush to get in the comm chair once the round started. nowadays this is what happens:

"what the hell?! where's our commander!?"
"why don't we have a commander!?"
"come on! somebody be commander!"
"not me"
"me neither"
"i don't want to be commander"
"i was commander last time"
"hurry up guys!!! !"
"well i'm not going to be commander coz i want to play"
"oh my god!! ! skulk rush!!"
"quick somebody build some infantry portals!"
"ok i put down IPs but i can't get out and build them coz there's like 50 billion skulks munching my chair!"
"hurry up and distress beacon!!"
"we can't you idiot, we never even got an observatory"
"oh sorry"
"noob!"
"ok, well, kill all the skulks and build the IPs then"
"ha! ok i will try. oh crap, they ate the IPs"
"crap we lost! ok just kill yourself then"
"no we didn't! come on we can win. if you just try hard enough you can do anything"
"shut up noob!!"
"ok i died"
*sad music plays*

i've been noticing this happening more and more over time; the marines losing games simply coz nobody wants to be the commander. has anybody else been noticing this trend?

ubermensch · February 2003

it is tru...this is a rising epidemic....

its not just you notcing this, i myself, one who previously enjoyed commanding, for whatever reason dont like to take it anymore either...

i duno, i guess every commander has a marine team once in a while that cant take a skulk 4 on 1, this leaves a mark on you (as it did me), and you simply dont feel like commanding. apparently this feeling (or somthing similar) has spread

Unipac · February 2003

I've only comm/ed once and we lost...

I don't take the comm cause I know I'm a total n00b at it. And if the marine team has a n00b comm, you can bet that all the marines will start harassing the comm... I've seen it happen a lot.

SoulSkorpion · February 2003

I've noticed this happening more often, but I've been using it as an excuse to go commander more. I'm interested in getting better at it, and the only way to do that is through experience. If nobody else wants the job, they can't yell at me if I stuff up <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'>

kolokol · February 2003

This happened to me yesterday...i joined a server part way through a game and none commanded, a few minutes later they had three hives and we died

Archilleos · February 2003

Tell you I y i dont go comm anymore.

Back in 1.03 I started being comm... after 2 or 3 knockbacks I got the point bout good commanding... with a decent marineteam following orders I won 3 of 4 games.
Then 1.04 came out... and ****, i have no more clue what to do! Hivelockdowns hardly work anymore, siegeoutposts are out of hiverange... If I try to get to some HA I cant reach it and... well, I´m lacking a good overall strat. And I truly hate JP Rushes... I WOULD like to Comm, but although I read the Frontiersman stratforum and play daily... somehow... im not getting enlightet what to do.... its...weird... <img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'>

moultano · February 2003

well the new features in 1.1 will make everyone want to comm at least once just to try them out. Im betting people will keep trying

Grimm_Spector · February 2003

commanding has become tedious, but with the new improvements to the mode, and hopefully with some more player enthusiasm for playing the game as a team this will improve.

I know exactly what you mean, I'm a pretty good comm, have been since the first time I comm'd back on CHI MAYHEM the first day NS came out, and always comm'd after that until players started being more ignorant and not allowing me to help them or do anything I needed done beyond building a few buildings. Now I completely decline commanding, but I plan to go back to comm'ing a lot come 1.1. I hope others will too.

OldManRipper-nC · February 2003

People don't like taking the blame for losing. For some reason it all gets foisted on the commander... not the fool building the resource tower and ignoring all the sounds of the skulk coming, or the guy in base saying "GIVE ME HMG" while you have waypointed, asked, typed, and screamed "CARGO PLEASE!" to him 30 times, or even the guy that runs straight up and jumps off the ledge into the pit over... and over... and over... saying "ROFL" as he falls. Nope, they never get the blame. Nor do the guys that just can't shoot a skulk if it does anything but run in a straight line or stand still. Apparently, commanders must be so good as to swat the skulks with their mouse-pointer (commonly known as "mousied") until the offending alien has perished.
As for motivating your troops... ask the to do it once... threaten them to do it like so:
"I will never drop you another med-pack unless <insert objective> now"
"Go through the phase gate and the HMG is on the other side"
"I need you to go build this here so I can drop you Heavy Armor"
"DON'T MAKE ME CRACK MY MOUSIE WHIP, *****!" (my fav)

-OldManRipper

Question · February 2003

I think it has something to do with the hordes of idiots who sit in base whining for "coolz stuffz" and blame the commander for their inability to obey orders when the marines inevitably lose.

Grimm_Spector · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (OldManRipper-nC- @ Feb 27 2003, 07:59 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> As for motivating your troops... ask the to do it once... threaten them to do it like so:
"I will never drop you another med-pack unless <insert objective> now"
"Go through the phase gate and the HMG is on the other side"
"I need you to go build this here so I can drop you Heavy Armor"
"DON'T MAKE ME CRACK MY MOUSIE WHIP, *****!" (my fav)

-OldManRipper  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
1) If I decline medpacks, other marines get mad at me.
2) They'll just come back when they realize the HMG isn't there, after yelling at me for 5 minutes asking where it is.
3) They don't seem to understand I have 6 res and I'm 2 minutes into the game so I can't drop you an HA an HMG (<b>n000000000000000000bs!!!!!!!!</b>)
4) I might try that one....

When my team loses, I always blame the guy that runs up and builds the building beside when he was told to cover 5 $#)(@&*$ times...and whenever I cover, I get grief for not helping get that SG up faster...oh sorry, I was too busy saving your **** while they fade walked up right in front of you and shot a bile bomb into your face....

and that's all for my bitchin for now <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'>

OldManRipper-nC · February 2003

Clarification:
1.) Only threaten this if you think that marine is better off respawning.
2.) Use this when you need someone to beat off an attack.
3.) Great for getting someone to build resources.
4.) Just fun to say.

Archilleos, check the Frontiersman Tactics board for:
"Marine Tactic #8: Arms Lab"

-OldManRipper

Rellix · February 2003

It could be something to do with people ignoring the commander thats why I dont bother.
The only time I'll comm is when I'm playing on LAN.

Shockeh · February 2003

Definitely.

I won't comm, and that's after 3 games in a <b>row</b> where we lost due to marines definitely not following orders.

Example : Aliens have 2 hives, 7v7 game, and I have 5 marines, all with HA/HMG/Welder & Level 2 both upgrades, and I lose. I lose because each marine, as they come to a T-Junction, decides 'I'll go this way, I'm nails, how could I possibly die?'

Marine no#6 lived the longest, but he sat in spawn with his HA/HMG (That'd he'd already picked up, forcing me to spawn one more for another guy) whining all game for a Shottie.

*Sigh*

Comming is great, but nothing can save a marine team that refuses to be a team.

Grimm_Spector · February 2003

I'm quite sick of people ignoring their comm, that's half the reason for the win percentages being slanted for the aliens on most pubs, notice it levels out on clan matches and privs with good players??

[OT] </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'>WOOHOO! Passed 400 posts, 100 more to go;)</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

Church · February 2003

I don't comm unless I know I have a good team. How do I do that? Hang out on good servers and only comm when you see regulars.

killswitch · February 2003

I'm usually asked to comm on the server, but that's mostly because it's quite boring. You don't really get to kill everything and the steps are generally the same:

1. Get hive 1
2. Get hive 2, if not possible, seige hive 2
3. Get resources. Upgrade like mad.
4. Drop a ton of cool **** you'll never use but you're ungrateful marines will.

It's a lot more fun to kill then to comm. Unless our current commander is a total moron I try to be a grunt.

TeoH · February 2003

Fewer people wanting to comm is a sign that the community as a whole is becoming more aware of which strategies are effective and which aren't. When half the server doesn't know what a distress beacon is, there is much less pressure on the commander to perform an effective clan style build. But people won't comm when the entire marine team expects them to perform to a certain standard, and will recognise (and complain about) anything you do which can be considered ineffective or non-standard. People know what strats work, and they expect you to execute them well - the environment puts alot of pressure on the commander and many people won't want to be placed in such a position.

Its a far cry from the beginning of the mod, when you could drop 2 IPs, a TF and 4 turrets and nobody would really question you.

pardzh · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kann_nix @ Feb 27 2003, 07:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> it is tru...this is a rising epidemic....

its not just you notcing this, i myself, one who previously enjoyed commanding, for whatever reason dont like to take it anymore either...

i duno, i guess every commander has a marine team once in a while that cant take a skulk 4 on 1, this leaves a mark on you (as it did me), and you simply dont feel like commanding. apparently this feeling (or somthing similar) has spread  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
That's precisely the reason I don't like commanding on pubs. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>

Error404 · February 2003

Theres like fewer people wanting to command but a greater number of <b>backseat commanders</b>. I often take the command chair if nobody else takes it, but as soon as I get in, it's like everybody starts telling me what to do... gimme this, gimme that, build RT here...

I'd rather be Gorge these days, commanding can be very boring aswell as very stressful.

tbZBeAst · February 2003

I know I'm not good at it, so I refuse. If I do take the chair its going to be a frustrating round for me and the whole side. I'm much better at securing objectives. Its not purely down to me enjoying action more, but I think it shows some consideration that I don't want to subject half the players on the server to a poor game.
That said, I will step up if no one else will, having appraised the squad of my lack-of-leetness

AngaDraug · February 2003

I think that the main reason people refuse to command (or at least my reason for doing so) is that if you lose because the n00bishness of your team is just so over whelming, the blame usually finds its way to the Comm. I mean seriously. if 4 marines can't take out 1 skulk what are you playing this game for?

***Kill the Fatty***
<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'>

Rellix · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Duff-Man @ Feb 27 2003, 06:53 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kann_nix @ Feb 27 2003, 07:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> it is tru...this is a rising epidemic....

its not just you notcing this, i myself, one who previously enjoyed commanding, for whatever reason dont like to take it anymore either...

i duno, i guess every commander has a marine team once in a while that cant take a skulk 4 on 1, this leaves a mark on you (as it did me), and you simply dont feel like commanding. apparently this feeling (or somthing similar) has spread </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
That's precisely the reason I don't like commanding on pubs. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
Thats why I joined a clan!
I'm a very orginised person, so when some n00b doesnt listen it throw my plans off.
My tactics tend to work 50% of the time, depends on a few things, mainly the alien stratagy.

Wile_E_Coyote · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (ViPr @ Feb 27 2003, 02:30 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> i've been noticing this happening more and more over time; the marines losing games simply coz nobody wants to be the commander. has anybody else been noticing this trend?  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
Bottom line = Too many intolerant people on servers scare everyone from being commander. The sad part is, it's usually the more experienced players, not the n00bs, screaming at someone because he's not the "-best -friggin -commander -since -Patton". Attitudes like this create an atmosphere where almost everyone is afraid to try.

Case in point: I had the exact same scenario a couple of days ago. Nobody wanted to comm, so I did just so we wouldn't lose outright. I hadn't installed the RC Bot yet, so I had no practice at giving orders and such and didn't have any hotkeys bound. Immediately had 1 or 2 wonderful people who refused to command themselves yelling about what a crappy commander I was.

Side note: For those of you who do not have a clan or a LAN party to practice comm, I reccomend at least trying the RC Bot. It has a lot of waypointing and AI bugs BUT it will get you practice doing commander stuff and reveal to you what hotkeys you need to setup for yourself. Will help you out in the long run when you do have to comm.

Aminal · February 2003

The only map i've seen this be a problem is ns_hera.
i can't stand commanding on hera, and it seems no one else can either...

no problem with people comming on any other other maps.
The worst thing is that if you drop into the chair, drop a couple of IPs and get the first hive underway - you're stuck there for the rest of the game. i frequently tell people to get to vent dropping a node on the way, then they can't hold vent. so i go to holo, and they can't hold that, so i try and get someone to open the door to storage behind marine start and they run off trying to weld skulks, then i spam JPs & hmgs they all die, loose the obs, proto and armslab and demand more JP's and upgrades.

i guess i just suck at hera, but i'm only comming because no one else will

NSCypher · February 2003

Just like a lot of other people here its the fear of being screamed at by your entire team because its only your third go at comming and you put down loads of turrets at your spawn and lose that keeps me out of the chair...

I just wish people would be nicer to me sometimes when i screw up <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>

Vimstl · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TeoH @ Feb 27 2003, 06:26 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> People know what strats work, and they expect you to execute them well  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
I have a lot of RTS experience (much more than FPS), and when I command I win a lot more than I lose. But I rarely command anymore, because it's not worth the hassle. There are several effective marine strategies, but on pub servers it's likely you will have several people on your team protesting because you haven't used THEIR favourite strategy.

"Shut up, Comm, and give us jetpacks."
"If you build a turret, we're kicking your **** out of the chair."
"Gimme shotty/HMG/whatever that players favourite toy is ..."

When I command, I like to keep it simple. I post a couple of sentries in key positions, and tell the rest to move AS A GROUP to the target I have selected (usually a hive). Is that too complicated? What I generally see is every marine player sprinting off in a different direction to go to their favourite hunting ground, or to "capture" a hive location other than the one I have designated.

There is far too much chatter on the marine comm circuit, as various lamers discuss current events, or crow about their latest kill, or shout detailed instructions as to how I should be comming, or sing, or play sound files. What is the point of the Comm having voicecom if he/she can't get a word in edgewise?

The solution is as simple as it is unlikely. Marines who are not in the comm chair need to be quiet and obedient. But they won't be. So folks choose not to comm.

Thus endeth the lesson.

NSCypher · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>The solution is as simple as it is unlikely. Marines who are not in the comm chair need to be quiet and obedient. But they won't be. So folks choose not to comm.

Thus endeth the lesson. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

amen to that...

Rue · February 2003

1.1 should help with alot cause of the new features that it will have in it , as for the currect problem i realy dont think that u can complain if that happens some people realy dont like being commander , like not liking defence in TFC, if u have a full team of people like that normaly one goes comm just to build IP and basic buildings so they can enjoy the rest of the match

edit:
i have to say im so abd for the basck seat commanding , but most of the time if u are in the feild ur commander cant see what u can see.

kingmob · February 2003

Yeah its true

i don't know how many pub games i've seen with no commander
or a commander who gives himself cool stuff then takes off

suggestions

a) Join a clan...its like TFC sometimes its hard to find a pub game where everyone isn't DM
b) Try the reward system, I've notice some pub commanders do this and it works, someone would ask for something and he'd say kill 2 things and i'll get you one...worked like a charm...cracked me up too

c) just cry <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>

ainfect · February 2003

i dont comm in a noob pub. i will only comm in our server if i know the guys im playing with will listen. plus i can kick rambos who dont listen at all (after several warning of course <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'> ).

All Marines Refusing To Command

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