Marines Got 2 Hives. So What?
Gargamel
Join Date: 2003-01-04 Member: 11773Members
Join Date: 2003-01-04 Member: 11773Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Its not the End fellow Aliens!</div> So, the Marine **** have rushed and secured 2 Hives.
"OMG!!!! Its the End! We have lost!"
Yeah you could sit there and start crying.
But how about working together as those little Lerkis, hmm?
Yeah! Lets all be Lerkis and go to ONE Hive, not split up!
Get 5 Lerkis together and start shooting at that flashing Phase Gate!
Oh, what a pitty, Marines must now run all the way across our little waiting skulky.
Then consentrate fire on one turret each time and there you go!
The Hive is clear!
So stop running around the map thinking its the only thing you can do!
You got res? Go Lerk and help the others get out those plastic guns.
No res? Go Skulk and watch over your little flyers!
Even 2 lone Lerkis can kill a Turret farely quick.
USe your voicecom! ITs TEAMWORK after all!
POWER TO THE LERKIS!!!!
"OMG!!!! Its the End! We have lost!"
Yeah you could sit there and start crying.
But how about working together as those little Lerkis, hmm?
Yeah! Lets all be Lerkis and go to ONE Hive, not split up!
Get 5 Lerkis together and start shooting at that flashing Phase Gate!
Oh, what a pitty, Marines must now run all the way across our little waiting skulky.
Then consentrate fire on one turret each time and there you go!
The Hive is clear!
So stop running around the map thinking its the only thing you can do!
You got res? Go Lerk and help the others get out those plastic guns.
No res? Go Skulk and watch over your little flyers!
Even 2 lone Lerkis can kill a Turret farely quick.
USe your voicecom! ITs TEAMWORK after all!
POWER TO THE LERKIS!!!!
Comments
But trying to win back a hive is always a good idea. I like the skulk/lerk combo personally. Screwsup the turrets and gives marines lots of targets that they can't shoot too readily.
The last time I played marines, it was on ns_eclipse. Aliens started in CC, and we grabbed maintenance and eclipse command hives immediately. Then the real game began: can we hold off a concentrated alien attack long enough to reinforce both hives? For us, the answer was no. Maintenance folded under a concentrated alien attack. We had stretched our team and our resources to breaking to hold both hives. Once we lost one, the game was over for us.
The point of this story is that the marines aren't superhuman. If they seem to be everywhere, it's because they're spread really thin. Yeah, they'll eventually reinforce, but you've got a good five minute window in which you can cripple an overextended marine team. The aliens just need to pull together, attack intellifently, and ultimately have the deathmatchy skills to power through the marine defense.
I always get so annoyed when I see someone type "ok that's it, we're screwed now" because more than half the times a teammate's typed that we've gone on to win...
One of the things people neglect to notice about 2 hive lockdown stratagies is it usually amounts to marines only taking the hive resources and thier base. That leaves the rest of the map for you. This means that the flood of resources a gorge can get allows him to put up a net of turrets and def chambers super fast once the hive is re-taken.
Situation: 2 hive lockdown; marines didnt attack our primary hive.
We used 'decoy tactic' 5 skulks, 1 gorge.
Key player to our success: Gorge
1 skulk found a spot hide behind TF so the turrets would have a target, 4 skulks hide at the ceiling then gorge moved in and placed OC on the phase gate, turrets started to fire it..skulks moved in attacking TF. Then 4 marines came there. Ah, the sound of guns firing everywhere.
Skulks attacked the marines, at this time our gorge had enough resources for two more OCs ..he spammed them somewhere and kept healing, building, running, jumping around somehow he managed to stay alive, pure miracle as all the skulks were dead. 1 marine had survived the skulk ambush..he started to chase gorge around with his knife. Race against time began.
Who can reinforce first, those 3 marines or our skulks.. Will the gorge survive the knifing marine?.
Skulks and marines didnt get there because they started to fight againts each other near the hive. Gorge had spit the marine to death. At this point, 1 OC was destroyed but so were the turrets and TF was going down too. Our gorge had 100/100 resources, he decided not to waste anymore time and started the hive building process. "Lifeform is under attack!" - 1 skulk was alive, but not for long so gorge decided to build OCs for his own backup since the marines were coming again. .. ah <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
You can imagine the rest by yourself but it was such a good game. Aliens won the match in the end, but it wasnt easy.
anyway, i got the general idea to skulk rush the hive to regain it. took awhile, but we managed to regain it. despite the turrets. hmm.
needless to say, we won the match. teamwork was impressive, to say at the very least.
teamwork saved the aliens from failure.
And a nice piecefrom OWA :
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->One of the things people neglect to notice about 2 hive lockdown stratagies is it usually amounts to marines only taking the hive resources and thier base. That leaves the rest of the map for you. This means that the flood of resources a gorge can get allows him to put up a net of turrets and def chambers super fast once the hive is re-taken. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This happens most of the time as ALiens CANT spent that many res other than lerking <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
I also like the 5 Skulk Strat <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
If Marines start getting HA HW its game over man! game over! <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
im sure 1 of em can speak english <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Also, a lerk with adrenaline can do a huge amount of damage to phase gates and turret factories. Even taking out one turret can create a blind spot for a skulk to rush in and chomp the factory in safety.
If they got more than the main base res and the 2 hive res then u only let them have those HA/HW faster, or if the comm is lame he would build another 10 turrets at each hive.
Then its game over if you dont stealthly kill the cc (2 hard) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Ok, 2 hive lockdown in progress, the marines are evenly distrobuted in the 2 hives, what to do? likely the command dosn't have any turrets in his base, also likely his res are pretty slim as he's dropping turrets ect in those hives as fast as he can. So gather up 3 or so skulks outside the marine base. tell everyone else on your team to keep harassing them with parasite, but not to kill anyone. Also, no one attacks the main base until the word is given, you wnat to lull the commander into a false sense of security that you're focusing on the hives and not his base. Wait for all the marines to be spawned.
Your 3 buddies rush the base, the phase will fall in seconds, now the marines are all stranded at the hives. no one is going to respawn because you're not killing anyone. Next get the inf portals, then the obs, then go to the comm chair. You can probaably get all the portals and the obs down before even one marine makes it back to base on foot. If the command jumps out, you all jump his bones. Boom no more marine main base.
Best case scenerio the marines are done for with no portals and no chair. Worst case is the comm managed to drop a new chair. Have everyone else on your team attack the hives, don't bother with equipment, just get the marines dead, every one that dies can't respawn. If they manage to get the chair up and more spawn portals built, all is not lost, now you've managed to deny them another res node. with only 2 RTs you can easily control the map with turrets and lerk a hive back as the marines won't have the RPs to keep up with your destruction or to upgrade the troops.
You know what, the 2 hive lockdown games are the best to be played. The more challenge the better, i kinda get bored if its too easy for us. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->. Keep up your morale and convince others not to give up!.
Its about keeping the morale high even your team might be pinned down to 1 hive, remember to give more good feedback to your team instead of whining how bad things are going.. it really helps. (commanders mistake but can be our mistake too). Ah, never give up! NEVER!. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> Its for wussies!.
2 things u must do.
1-Rush as one. A great trick is for a lone lerk to pound away a empty hive while the skulks and co hit the other hive. Stretch em thin baby <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
2-Grab ALL the res asap, starve em and keep there expansion uber slow with a max of 3 res spots.
2 other suggestions.
Aint seiged? Have a gorg save up 50-100res then behind skulks, or at a emtpy hive dump 2-3 DC out of site but close then hit them hard point blank with OC, dotn worry about healing them untill your res-less as u actually can build faster than turrets can take down ya OC. OC rock vs buildings and marines at close range.
-watch for the emergency seige to go up!
-Tell your team to not lerk.
2 hives secure? Hit there main spawn, often lite defense. Wats the point? Your killing res, arms labs, (hit observ first, weakest building.) inf port etc. Sure theyll re-base into a hive but lose res/time and lose the spawn res spot giving them 2 res (hehe thats slow)
Depends on the number of players. Ten marines can finish the game with two resource nodes (2x10 rp per resource tick). Three marines will take forever to build all the 2-hive-lockdown equipment (2 ips, obs, 3 pg, 3 tf, 9 turrets) with only two nodes (2x3 rp per resource tick).
Marines got our 2 hives, we got nameless. They were sort of relaxing they obviously thought that they had won already, but oh boy..were they wrong <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
I said that "I will try out something very crazy in a moment..", Evolved to skulk from gorge and kept looking that no marines got killed, waiting for my time.. I went past their turrets, hide inside their base. evolved back to gorge and waited until the respawned marines went trough phase gate.
I got resources like mad.. 80/100 . I started to drop Offense chambers as much as i could, then DCs behind. And kept on building as much i can. Seconds later marines started to get wasted <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->. First they didnt even realize where was the fire coming from <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->. Their entire base got destroyed, and we won .. with 1 hive <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
The ONLY way to beat the lockdown is to have two gorges, and the rest skulks or lerks.
Aliens need to cap all the RTs on the map, and save up. Once they both have 100, both run in, spamming OCs and a DC or two all over the place, while the skulks eliminate most/all of the marines the second before. One gorge should drop an OC on the phase gate ASAP (Most of the time it blocks marines from coming back through it), while the other builds them next to turrets, in order to draw their fire away from the skulks. Of course if they have sieges, you wont be able to take the hive back, but most commanders will not build sieges until they need them. I say two gorges, as they can heal eachother. If you only have one, and two marines focus fire, mr gorge dies before he can lay all his towers, or stay and heal the ones that are finished.
A slow tower offense is USELESS. Do not make walls slowly moving towards the marines, it is just a tip-off for them to get sieges, effectively killing any chance you previously had for taking the hive back. A quick rush is what you HAVE to do.
5 Skulks together can tear apart a tf/phase setup pretty fast with cara as well, don't forget this..
I've died about 20 times cleaning a hive but i bloodi well did it and had a right victory dance as a fade.
Lerks as well...you can get into the most horrible areas, unseen shadows people do nto even know exist away from turrets beig able to see you. Takes a while but spike shooter takes down a turret quite nicely.
I remember on hera, in maintace, the vent tha tlooks at the entrace to the maintace corridor, that comes away from the hive. Went there as a lerk, someone laughed at me for being lerk as they suck. He soon shot up when i took down the turret factory the turrets and siege he had been moaning about.
Taking back two hives will be difficult if
a) commander is very turret happy 10x turrets in one hive, and they know not to build tf near walls, but in the middle. no blind spots.
b). Marines are listening what commander says, if one turret gets attacked over 3 marines goes there cleaning the threat.
c) they dont waste time taking down the last one.
So remeber kids:
<b>Good games can easilly go wrong when moneys not watched!</b>
nah
/quit
yesterday's match on Hera took hours , and I'm pretty unsure about its aftermath (got disconnected while I was lerking , marine base seemed to collapse though) , as marines relocated to that evil spot between Processing and Datacore (where you can siege 2 hives at once)
As often , the marines were smart and effective at controlling the said place to relocate , and fortified the position when we started attacking their first base. Then they failed at holding the holoroom. We slowly surrounded them and took the whole map , but couldn't keep an additional hive alive. They started camping , mining and turretfarming their base , yet the comm was relentlessly pinging both hives to activate the many siege turrets here (doubled or tripled TF I think)
The comm dropped a few HMGs once , but after a while he didn't have the ressources for that (they had one friggin node) ; sometimes JPers attacked our main hive , but they hadn't the skills to take it down.
So we went lerking and harrassing their base from datacore (marines simply can't defend this place) and removed their mines with painfull sacrifices. They probably managed to get an other stronghold somewhere else in the map , but they simply weren't enough to keep their base clear. Since a gorge dropped a DC far enough from siege turrets , I presume the other lerks kept harrassing the base from Datacore and won the game.
But this game was WAY too long !... skulks vs turrets is BORING. And without the aid of a gorge , lerks are too weak to effectively damage a base (especially when marines use welders)
2 hives relocation games are usually less interesting than classic ones...
All the while, the third hive had been building, and now it was up. We all went onos, save the gorge, and we slammed the marine base. In the end, a lone skulk had to chase the marine commander into a vent, where he was attempting to build CC walls around him. He made the mistake of hopping out in an attempt to get himself an easy fade kill, I paralized him, and the skulk ate his meal of marine meat. The game had lasted about 4 hrs and 5 minutes. The Combat had been fierce and an alien team of two had grown to equal the players of the marine team, six. The Alien team that didn't have any second hives, that only had two players fighting 6 enemies for half an hour, managed to get all three hives and annihilate the marine team utterly in less than two minutes once the hives were up.
the aliens will almost always win a war of attrition, just keep taking out the RTs, and stick a few oc's and dcs in strategic locations around them, don't even bother with the RT becuase it just draws the marines to attack it, but I build it, and then find a hive that you want to attack, and then if they have seige, build 4-5 dc's (redundancy is your friend) and a few oc's to cover your DC nest (this is outside of seige range) and then voila! you have a staging area where from which you can run, bite a turret one or two times, and heal, keep it up and you will eventually take back the area. if the majority of the team is doing this, and one or two is out chomping res, then the marines will become overburdened, and also while this is going on, the marine's start base is usually turret less, so you can go in there and gorge rush (with 1 gorge <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->)
but remember...teamwork is key!