If only r_speeds didn't exist...
DoctorJuice
Join Date: 2002-02-13 Member: 212Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2002-02-13 Member: 212Members, Constellation
Comments
Yeah, apparently concrete is reflective now. It's ridiculous how every one of these maps apparently needed to reflect itself in something.
/me rolls his eyes
In other words, it takes a lot more skill to create something visually stunning <b>and</b> keep the r_speeds under 700.
What most people have done with their NS maps is far more revolutionary than that... Like I said: Letting yourself go, and to disregard r_speeds is a pretty easy way to get people to say "Cool."
Let's see some <i>real</i> quality work. Like NS.
<!--EDIT|ken20banks|April 14 2002,12:10-->
(Relic - it's the pic I pointed out where all the cars in the parking lot are reflected in what appears to be solid concrete)
<!--EDIT|KungFuSquirrel|April 14 2002,13:12-->
Ok, so there's a ridiculous amount of detail there. I have to say, when I first saw the thumbnail, I was quite impressed. Upon viewing the full screen, though, most of that feeling disappeared. It looked like Half-Life again.
Granted, the detail of this level is no small feat. However, it doesn't really take all that much skill to keep throwing in more and more polys. True, the alignment and vertex placement isn't EASY by any means, but most anyone who can make a decent map has enough understanding of vertex placement and texturing to be able to create something similar. If you want a truly challenging contest, give those original reference pics used in this contest, and give first prize to the person who has the most visually impressive map within the given limits for HL. I bet it could be done. It wouldn't be easy, no, but it would give a much greater sense of challenge to the whole thing.
That's one of the reasons I've stuck with HL this long without moving on (or even branching out) to other games -- it's the ultimate challenge. Every time I or anyone else here, for that matter, is creating a map, we're trying to create an immersive environment in an engine that was made 7 years ago and a game that hit shelves 3 and a half years ago. Trying to create images that compare with newer games while still being playable on any machine that can run HL is at least as challenging (and, in my opinion, more challenging) than creating a map with no regard for polycount or framerate.
Yes, this was a contest, and the maps were not intended for play. I understand that. However, I personally feel the time spent on this contest would have been better spent by putting these scenes into a better engine -- Q3, UT, SS, etc, where they could actually be enjoyed in-game rather than just a few screenshots.
<!--EDIT|KungFuSquirrel|April 14 2002,14:44-->
Ken and KungFu hit the nail on the right on the head.
That is.. beautiful!
Take a look at this one:
<img src="http://www.cyberhost.ch/~gunny/final/vermeer.jpg" border="0">
I love the small people, the castle in the woods and the water! <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->
Sure theirs a certain amount of technical and personal accomplishment from making any engine do things like this but what’s the point when there are plenty more suited and capable engines/applications/mediums out there?
Exactly... besides, I personally think Bast's maintenence corridor, and/or other similarly styled areas within the map look far more realistic than that...
And I'm simply not impressed with the cartoonish appearence of that castle shot... wasn't the purpose of the contest to create something realistic looking?
I'm in no way trying to vut down on these guy's work... A lot of time and effort must have been spent doing this... I just hate it when the people out there who don't fully comprehend what is really difficult to manage in level design look at shots like this and consider them to be far superior to what is truly note worthy.
And another thing... there is such a thing as terrain editors you know... all these rolling vistas that all the non-mappers out there consider to be astonishing don't actually take much effort on the mapper's part other than a few bar slides and mouse clicks... some people's work is far too over-rated in this way. And don't even get me started on cartoonish tree and grass sprites. If you want to see some truly innovative and amazing outdoors stuff, take a look at HALO or Unreal II... there's actually design behind that.. regardless of whether or not they use their fancy terrain tools..
(Sorry, yes I'm prideful and defensive... who isn't?)
The shots are fine, but do not particularly impress me. The only question I have is how were the reflections done? Is it just an upside down copy of everything above it, with the floor having a lower opacity so you can see through it?
-Jacius
I wanna be able to download some of these maps and see how they run =D
<a href="http://www.inside-webdesign.de/maps/de_vermeer.zip" target="_blank">http://www.inside-webdesign.de/maps/de_vermeer.zip</a>
You have to run it in CS.
R_speeeds are in the 7000. I dont have all that of a fast computer so my fps went down to about 6~7. Utterly unplayble... Pretty slideshow though. <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->