Hey UWE and what's left of the community

CrispixCrispix Join Date: 2007-01-10 Member: 59543Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 424 Advanced user
Hey everyone. Long time player of both NS games.

It's been a blast to be playing lots of NS2 again after a couple year hiatus due to work/personal reasons. When I came back to playing NS2 again around March/April of this year, I was pleasantly surprised to see a number of servers still being played on with an active community.

As of now for the last few weeks, I've noticed a massive decline since a few servers that will not be named were taken down which in my opinion, has had a huge impact on the number of players remaining that are playing this game.

In all honesty, I love this game. This game (and NS1) have kept me happy and given me an escape from reality while I'm not working or doing other things. Despite what people in the community think of me when I play the game, I respectfully thank everyone who actually still plays this game because without you, I wouldn't have anyone to play with. I almost guarantee that those who are still playing are saying exactly the same thing.

The purpose of this post is more of a direct message to UWE/community developers because as a long time fan whose put in so much time and love (and for a lot of NS1/NS2 merch purchases -- Wasabi, if you got a Gorge Plushie lying around, I'll need the link!), I don't want this game to eventually disappear. Who knows, maybe there's plans for an NS3 hence UWE wanting to hire an artist for a new IP, I don't know. But the current games that UWE have that have active players are Subnautica and NS2.

I love Subnautica. It's great! But if it weren't for NS2, I'd probably be more miserable than anything.

The point I'm trying to get at is that I wish there was a way that UWE/Community devs can push a lot more attention for NS2. The game isn't perfect, but it's definitely a lot more polished than when it was Alpha if anyone remembers those days. In fact, I would even say that with the way the game is right now, it's near damn perfect for the genre of game that it is. I'm sure a lot of people would disagree with me. But hey, if I'm having fun, then the game is working then. Of course there's always room for improvement so I say bring it on.

I know it may not be the business model UWE/community devs want to hear, and it's been asked hundreds of times by other community members, but is there the chance that this game can go F2P? Even if not, how about bundling NS2 for free with the purchase of Subnautica. The idea of keeping your cosmetic DLC as a way for income would probably work well if there are higher volume of people who would be actively be playing.

I know in rebuttal that the problem with opening the flood gates for anyone to start picking up the game for free is that, it would allow a lot of smurf players which ultimately affects the rank matching. I almost feel as if hive skill matching in the game is what has declined the player community in NS2 to begin with. If you think of it, it never existed in NS1. You would just find a server, join up and play. Sure people complained about teams being stacked but the point is, is that it was easy to get a game to get going, and everyone was having fun for the most part. Now we have people shuffling teams non-stop because everyone is worried about a number. I get that the game is competitive and more modern hence why having a way to scramble teams to even balance, but if a game is difficult to start because of a mechanic that allows people to keep delaying the start of a game, then there's the problem. Maybe leave a mechanic like that on competitive ranking servers, and leave it off for normal public game servers. The problem then becomes, who's going to run the servers, because since now we have a decline in servers because of a low player base, then eventually the game is going to dwindle down to no one playing. Seeding near empty servers to just wait for people to join up and then shuffling teams for 5 minutes can get pretty frustrating.

So I guess, I'm eagerly asking if there are any considerations or business model plans to get active players playing once again and keep the community consistently growing. I don't want this game to die

From a fan.

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NordicMouseSquishpokePOOPFACE

Comments

  • PelargirPelargir Join Date: 2013-07-02 Member: 185857Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, WC 2013 - Silver, Forum staff Posts: 1,198 mod
    Crispix wrote: »
    As of now for the last few weeks, I've noticed a massive decline since a few servers that will not be named were taken down which in my opinion, has had a huge impact on the number of players remaining that are playing this game.

    Steam charts don't show this shutdown had a huge impact. There are other reasons for that.

    You can also note that a year ago, in August 2018, NS2 had the same amount of players: https://steamcharts.com/app/4920

    As for the rest of your message, I don't really have an opinion as going F2P has already been discussed a lot in the past.

    "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"

    "However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results."


    Nordic
  • KasharicKasharic Hull, England Join Date: 2013-03-27 Member: 184473Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer Posts: 680 Advanced user
    Going F2P can only be done once, and it stops a source of funding in its tracks by doing so... the game is currently still being developed purely off of sales of the game and DLC, if you cut the sales out of the budget, there will be less money to pay for development.

    Now, its okay to say that skins etc would work fine for a source of income, but that requires development time and is a small sum compared to game sales.

    There is also a minimum expected from F2P games, such as matchmaking and other mechanics, a DLC store and easy integration of said DLC... many things that are expected of a F2P game, ns2 simply doesn't have at the moment... and as we saw with Evolve, if you do F2P wrong, your game dies.

    As for the desire to see more development, I can assure you I feel the same, I would LOVE to see a huge team behind ns2 and really pushing for it to be the best it can be, but unfortunately there just isn't the funding to do it. Behind the scenes you'd be amazed at how much such a small team is able to accomplish, its genuinely crazy to see this team work at the speed they do and how much work they put into things that unfortunately just don't pan out and as such, the public never sees (as is the way in development).

    The team are incredibly hard working and don't get nearly enough credit for the time and effort they put into the game, I know that if I were to win the lottery or something, I would be donating a large sum of money to ns2 to keep it going, give the devs and income they deserve and potentially boost the number of staff working on it in general.
    Meph isn't an NSL admin anymore!

    #blameHefty
    Nordic
  • prevertmaximusprevertmaximus Join Date: 2002-12-30 Member: 11630Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 157 Advanced user
    Like Crispix, I have played this game from the start of NS1 and now have played NS2 from the Beta. It is one of the best FPS games other than HL1 that I have played. I also have noticed much less servers to join lately. With the 10v10 which is great , but most players seem to only like a few servers. With the extra players just taking up the spec spots. So other servers just idle with no players. Also the constant shuffling to get the right team sides is really boring. That seems to have happened since the different color badges started. No one wants to lose there ELO. But the game in general is still great to play and will continue doing so.

    Thanks , Max
    Nordic
  • SquishpokePOOPFACESquishpokePOOPFACE -21,248 posts (ignore below) Join Date: 2012-10-31 Member: 165262Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,618 Advanced user
    Yes, there needs to be some kind of aggressive seeding mechanic and an incentive to use it.

    Yes, I like the idea of free NS2 for Subnautica players. I'm not too sure about F2P unless the seeding problem is solved.

    The game right now is honestly brilliant and arguably at its peak gameplay-wise. Balance somehow seems better than a few weeks ago. Perhaps Marines have their shit figured out now?
    To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to play Natural Selection 2. The gameplay is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of military strategy and advanced mathematics you won't even win a single game. Theres also the game's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into the game. The maps and artwork draw heavily from Riddley Scott's Alien franchise, for instance. The players understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of the game, to realise that it's not just great, that it also says something about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike Natural Selection 2 truly ARE idiots. of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in the Marines' existential catchphrase "how do I get to be so good", which itself is a cryptic reference to the high degree of intelligence required to play the game as intended. I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion when spectating a game. What fools... how I pity them. And, yes, by the way, i DO have a Fade tatoo. And no, you cannot see it. it's for the ladies' eyes only, and even then they have to demonstrate that they are within 50 hive skill points of my own (preferable lower) beforehand. Nothin personnel kid.
    Nordic
  • RammlerRammler Join Date: 2013-06-18 Member: 185607Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 192 Advanced user
    Well i had no computer for about 1.5 Years. I started playing again a few days ago.
    In my opinion the game 1.5 years ago was nearly perfect. Good balance, good mechanics.

    I dont know why the Balance is changed over and over again. For what? The balance was fine 1.5 years ago.

    Also the introduction of the skill badges was not a good idea imo. People go crazy about their elo, what leads to bad teams. I woule hide skilltiers again. There should be no way for players to look their skill tier up.

    A good thing is to see combat mode back in ns2. Big points.

    At least the playercount is not that low for summertime. Normally it rises in winter again.
    Ns2 was always an skill focused niche game with high learning curve. Unfortunatly such games are not that popular anymore like years ago in times of half life or quake. Today people love to play on their couch after work and want to be able to be good in games without putting that much time in it.

    They play pubg or fortnite today where you are able to get at least a few kills even when ypu are complete retarded. Then they play ns2 get completly stomped and blame the game for that. Then they switch back to the game where they can win or have a hidden comeback mechanic. Best example is fifa here...
    wya3p5tg.png
  • SquishpokePOOPFACESquishpokePOOPFACE -21,248 posts (ignore below) Join Date: 2012-10-31 Member: 165262Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,618 Advanced user
    edited September 10
    I used to be leery of the skill badge system but now I see that it works amazing compared to the stackable yesteryear.

    Plus there is an added bonus to being able to see at a glance whether to trust a player to understand an order, hold a lane, or be fair game to receive criticism. Previously I would be appalled at bad play and get mad, but now I can see a pink badge ahead of time and plan accordingly. If a Sanji or Spec Ops makes a horrible gaff it's fun to rib them because they should.know better.

    Skill badges are a definite improvement.
    To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to play Natural Selection 2. The gameplay is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of military strategy and advanced mathematics you won't even win a single game. Theres also the game's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into the game. The maps and artwork draw heavily from Riddley Scott's Alien franchise, for instance. The players understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of the game, to realise that it's not just great, that it also says something about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike Natural Selection 2 truly ARE idiots. of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in the Marines' existential catchphrase "how do I get to be so good", which itself is a cryptic reference to the high degree of intelligence required to play the game as intended. I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion when spectating a game. What fools... how I pity them. And, yes, by the way, i DO have a Fade tatoo. And no, you cannot see it. it's for the ladies' eyes only, and even then they have to demonstrate that they are within 50 hive skill points of my own (preferable lower) beforehand. Nothin personnel kid.
    NordicSupaFred
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,735 Advanced user
    Discord killed the forum star!
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
    Vetinari
  • SquishpokePOOPFACESquishpokePOOPFACE -21,248 posts (ignore below) Join Date: 2012-10-31 Member: 165262Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,618 Advanced user
    I forgot my discord login so here I am :#
    To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to play Natural Selection 2. The gameplay is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of military strategy and advanced mathematics you won't even win a single game. Theres also the game's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into the game. The maps and artwork draw heavily from Riddley Scott's Alien franchise, for instance. The players understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of the game, to realise that it's not just great, that it also says something about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike Natural Selection 2 truly ARE idiots. of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in the Marines' existential catchphrase "how do I get to be so good", which itself is a cryptic reference to the high degree of intelligence required to play the game as intended. I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion when spectating a game. What fools... how I pity them. And, yes, by the way, i DO have a Fade tatoo. And no, you cannot see it. it's for the ladies' eyes only, and even then they have to demonstrate that they are within 50 hive skill points of my own (preferable lower) beforehand. Nothin personnel kid.
    Nordic
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,735 Advanced user
    I forgot my discord login so here I am :#
    The NS2 subreddit still has some juice in it.
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
  • SquishpokePOOPFACESquishpokePOOPFACE -21,248 posts (ignore below) Join Date: 2012-10-31 Member: 165262Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,618 Advanced user
    Someone hacked my reddit account and now I have a hard time leaving my front page ;)
    To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to play Natural Selection 2. The gameplay is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of military strategy and advanced mathematics you won't even win a single game. Theres also the game's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into the game. The maps and artwork draw heavily from Riddley Scott's Alien franchise, for instance. The players understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of the game, to realise that it's not just great, that it also says something about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike Natural Selection 2 truly ARE idiots. of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in the Marines' existential catchphrase "how do I get to be so good", which itself is a cryptic reference to the high degree of intelligence required to play the game as intended. I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion when spectating a game. What fools... how I pity them. And, yes, by the way, i DO have a Fade tatoo. And no, you cannot see it. it's for the ladies' eyes only, and even then they have to demonstrate that they are within 50 hive skill points of my own (preferable lower) beforehand. Nothin personnel kid.
    Nordic
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,735 Advanced user
    edited September 11
    Someone hacked my reddit account and now I have a hard time leaving my front page ;)
    I don't understand. How would a hacker prevent you from leaving the front page? Usually hackers go for personal information while this sounds malicious. You should protect yourself.
    I forgot my discord login so here I am :#
    You should make a new discord account and join me on the worst ns2 discord in history. We miss you. https://discord.gg/vYDyJQA
    I hear TA's politics channel is a pretty happening place, and maybe the most fun ns2 discord though.
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
  • SquishpokePOOPFACESquishpokePOOPFACE -21,248 posts (ignore below) Join Date: 2012-10-31 Member: 165262Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 1,618 Advanced user
    Yea dude. I have a entire novel's worth of stories about this year's adventures
    To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to play Natural Selection 2. The gameplay is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of military strategy and advanced mathematics you won't even win a single game. Theres also the game's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into the game. The maps and artwork draw heavily from Riddley Scott's Alien franchise, for instance. The players understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of the game, to realise that it's not just great, that it also says something about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike Natural Selection 2 truly ARE idiots. of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in the Marines' existential catchphrase "how do I get to be so good", which itself is a cryptic reference to the high degree of intelligence required to play the game as intended. I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion when spectating a game. What fools... how I pity them. And, yes, by the way, i DO have a Fade tatoo. And no, you cannot see it. it's for the ladies' eyes only, and even then they have to demonstrate that they are within 50 hive skill points of my own (preferable lower) beforehand. Nothin personnel kid.
    Nordic
  • aeroripperaeroripper Join Date: 2005-02-25 Member: 42471NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation Posts: 2,396 mod
    This game is in it's twilight nearing 7 years after its release. It's had an impressive run for a niche indie game and it's still doing pretty well for its age with the amount of players still playing it. Also, that picture :(
    Nordic
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