Below Zero: Food/water management discussion

CptnHerpCptnHerp Join Date: 2019-02-04 Member: 250418Members Posts: 2 Fully active user
First off I'll state that I enjoy survival games with hunger and thirst mechanics when they are done right.

With the original Subnautica respectively, I felt the need to eat/drink was too fast to counter the sheer overabundance of food/water sources and the ease of which to get them. This made eating and drinking feel more like a high maintenance chore than a survival mechanic.

You could plant one indoor growbed with Marblemelons and you were setup for the entirety of the game. If either food or water was getting low, just pick 4 or 5 from the growbed to replenish both food and water, then harvest enough seeds from the same grow bed to completely replant it. And the regrowth time is extremely fast. I had one growbed on the Cyclops acting as mobile base.

So to throw out some thoughts on making food and water more "enjoyable":

* Substantially lower the degradation time of food and water. Aka so we dont have to eat/drink so regularly.
* The ability to store fish alive made salting food redundant. Fish should quickly die and decompose if stored.
* Cooked food IMO spoiled way too fast. Maybe add cooked food storage eg refrigerator.
* I dont know if Marblemelon is in Below Zero, but farming this one plant just made eating and drinking redundant.
* Farming is far too fast and growth rates could be slowed substantially to counter Marblemelon if this or an equivalent is to remain in the game.
* I'd like to worry less about the sheer amount I need to eat/drink and have resources more scarce. Eg farming very slow but reliable and being able to over fish areas of the ocean but manage storage etc.

How do others feel about this?

Comments

  • webmasterblastwebmasterblast tbd Join Date: 2019-02-06 Member: 250497Members Posts: 9 Fully active user
    I don't know about this, I think its one of those things that sucks but we just have to deal with it. The urgency of needing food and water causes us to look for alternate options for feeding
    ourselves.

    About the Marblemelon, In the original Subnautica I had 3 marblemelon plants and one tree of some kind in my Cyclops which allowed me to stay underwater for in game weeks at a time.
    This would not have been possible without the fast growing time. (I think increasing the time to grow by 1.5x wouldn't compromise that). And to supplement the lack of those plants we
    would need to have either more fish that we can eat (at all depths). OR a better way to store fish and breed fish. I think a fair option would be to be able to add a fish tank to Below Zero's
    version of the Cyclops and be able to add a water purifier too.
  • RequiemfangRequiemfang Join Date: 2015-02-22 Member: 201492Members Posts: 629 Advanced user
    edited February 6
    Reason for the hunger and hydration bar going down so quickly in Subnautica is because game days are simulated at 20 minutes, 16 for daytime and 4 for night. if the day/night cycle for days in total of time it takes for a day to pass were say increased to 30 mins or 40 mins per day cycle the hunger/water rate would decrease. Hunger and water loss is ticked down for every second that passes in game unless you happen to be sitting down in a chair or bench.
  • BenkyoBenkyo Join Date: 2019-02-04 Member: 250356Members Posts: 6 Fully active user
    edited February 6
    Hah, I just assumed you couldn't put a grow bed in the cyclops, so I went through the trouble of making a waystation in the tunnels with a grow bed. Now I know better...

    I agree that marblemelons made food and water trivial. I did struggle a bit in the depths when I ran out of water and had to hunt fish, until I built my waystation, but yeah, marblemelons on tap all the time is silly.

    Much slower day/night cycle, and slower food and water consumption would have been nice.
  • LethannLethann Jackson, MS Join Date: 2019-02-06 Member: 250534Members Posts: 3 Fully active user
    Frankly I don't really want resources more scarce, but agree that the marblemelons were way OP and should have been nurfed (make it so you can only eat like one or two at a time or you get sick). I think the current food/water degradation is ok, though currently I'm not enjoying the scarcity of water in Below Zero. Currently spending way to much time hunting down bladderfish to try and stock water and it starts running out so fast I can't stock pile it. Even with a gravtrap it's just a major pain. I know they will eventually add in the water filtration system so i'll just hold out on that.

    For me, the management/stress of managing food/water was something that was great early game but I was very glad that later on it was just a minor nuisance than a major stress point. There was enough to juggle with the more aggressive animals and heat/depth management. Below Zero will be adding the "try not to freeze" eventually which looks to be one more stat to monitor and manage. Once you get established it makes sense that food and water isn't that much of an issue. Remember, this time around we are NOT stranded on the planet, struggling to survive and escape. It makes sense that certain aspects are a bit 'easier'.

    One thing I always wanted to find was more food recipes. A way to combine food items to make meals that are more balanced. Mix a fish and some Creepvine for something like a kelp salad. Sub1 you were in serious emergency mode so it kinda made sense, but really it would be nice to have something like a futuristic camping stove to make better meals.
    JimboJamboinwaterinair
  • DrownedOutDrownedOut Habitat Join Date: 2016-05-26 Member: 217559Members Posts: 1,091 Advanced user
    Lethann wrote: »
    Currently I'm not enjoying the scarcity of water in Below Zero. Currently spending way to much time hunting down bladderfish to try and stock water and it starts running out so fast I can't stock pile it. Even with a gravtrap it's just a major pain. I know they will eventually add in the water filtration system so i'll just hold out on that.

    Same. I hope the devs will add in at least one other drink source next update. Or if nothing else, add bladderfishes to more areas for the time being so I'm not forced back to the starter area every few bottles.

    As for the topic at hand, I disagree the food and drink gauges go down too fast, but I do agree with all the rest. That is, while I agree those parameters shouldn't hold you back from adventuring, they shouldn't be a triviality either (as fast as they do). Changes I think I'd like to see are:
    • No storing life fish (they can stay alive as long as they're in your inventory).
    • Breeding in the alien containment unit goes faster the more fish there are. I'd prefer it to go slower the more fish there are. Not only would that make sense with the cutoff point, but it would make the containment just a little more a matter of management.
    • I'm all for fridges being added, including as upgrades for the storage modules for the Seamoth (not sure how it'd work for the PRAWN).
    • Nerfing several plants would be good, yes.
    • I'd like growth rates to be reduced too, but with the ability to recreate the current growth rate if you add fertilizer (crash powder for a short boost, sea treader poop for a long boost, maybe something else inbetween - basically, the way the bioreactor works but then with planters).
    • For other reasons but not unrelated to food, I'd like a crossbeam construction or something of the kind for alien containment units, so that if I have several stacked the plants aren't only all the way on the bottom.
    • I still would really like ambergris to wax fruits and veggies with in the same way salt keeps fish edible longer. It makes sense gameplay-wise and would give a reason to check out the surface waters more.

  • pie1055pie1055 Join Date: 2016-12-05 Member: 224603Members Posts: 133 Advanced user
    I would suggest;
    • Creepvine seed clusters - These can be consumed in Below Zero to replenish 10 thirst. Dunno if they're renewable but there's plenty of Arctic Kelp biomes around to make this a valid method of replenishing thirst on the go for quite a while.
    • Freedom Mode - Hunger and thirst too much of a pain? This mode ignores them and only them completely.
    • If hunger and thirst is tied to the day/night system I reckon you might be able to activate the console and use the daynightscale command to slow it down, thus reducing how often you have to 'fill up' on these resources. You will have to deal with longer days and nights, however.
    DrownedOutRezca
  • MichloMichlo Originally Wallasey, UK now Los Angeles, US. Join Date: 2016-09-10 Member: 222215Members Posts: 81 Advanced user
    edited February 9
    Farming can't really be slower as some of us don't want to eat animals even in a game.

    We need plant-based options. I don't want to live off kelp forever. :p

    And given the technology at our disposal in these games, food and water really shouldn't be that difficult to obtain.

    Cheers.

    Gaming since they were loaded via cassette tape.
    From Wallasey, UK to Los Angeles, USA.

    http://www.IanMWalker.com
    RezcaFearXI
  • DrownedOutDrownedOut Habitat Join Date: 2016-05-26 Member: 217559Members Posts: 1,091 Advanced user
    Michlo wrote: »
    Farming can't really be slower as some of us don't want to eat animals even in a game.

    We need plant-based options. I don't want to live off kelp forever. :p

    We're probs on the same page there. I'm not vegetarian irl, but conscious of my meat consumption and I've asked in the past for a feasible way to play herbivore in SN. Especially some bean-type plant with the options to make soy milk and tahu/tofu would be nice.

    I don't think slower growth times would have to be a problem. At most for the Cyclops with its limited space, but that's where the wish to keep veggies edible for longer with ambergris and a fridge comes in. Plus you can always make a planter outpost.
    Michlo
  • MichloMichlo Originally Wallasey, UK now Los Angeles, US. Join Date: 2016-09-10 Member: 222215Members Posts: 81 Advanced user
    DrownedOut wrote: »
    Michlo wrote: »
    Farming can't really be slower as some of us don't want to eat animals even in a game.

    We need plant-based options. I don't want to live off kelp forever. :p

    We're probs on the same page there. I'm not vegetarian irl, but conscious of my meat consumption and I've asked in the past for a feasible way to play herbivore in SN. Especially some bean-type plant with the options to make soy milk and tahu/tofu would be nice.

    I don't think slower growth times would have to be a problem. At most for the Cyclops with its limited space, but that's where the wish to keep veggies edible for longer with ambergris and a fridge comes in. Plus you can always make a planter outpost.

    Thanks.

    Not ambergris, though if we have to kill animals to obtain it.

    Cheers.

    Gaming since they were loaded via cassette tape.
    From Wallasey, UK to Los Angeles, USA.

    http://www.IanMWalker.com
  • DrownedOutDrownedOut Habitat Join Date: 2016-05-26 Member: 217559Members Posts: 1,091 Advanced user
    Michlo wrote: »
    Thanks.

    Not ambergris, though if we have to kill animals to obtain it.

    Cheers.

    Ambergris does not require dead whales. Ambergris leaves the body naturally, usually through the front. The "historical romance" of ambergris is that it can be found drifting around on its own and some lucky chap finds it washed up on shore one day. Of course, this led to unsavory types going for the "kill the goose that lays the golden eggs" route, which is what got ambergris its bad rep. (Or maybe you're thinking of spermaceti, which does demand dead whales.)

    Irl, ambergris is rare, but this is a game about an ocean planet with whale-like aliens. They can be made to vomit up enough of the stuff that there won't be any wanting.
    RezcaMichlo
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