Add average server hive skill back to the Server Browser

skav2skav2 Join Date: 2007-05-28 Member: 61037Members, Reinforced - Gold
edited March 2018 in Ideas and Suggestions
Hey all,

In a previous thread we have been talking about how to better separate low skilled players from higher skilled players so that everyone has a better time. One point that came up was in previous builds the server browser had an average Hive Score section. I believe this section should be added back but not in its last form. It was in a weird arrow format that was confusing and did not work the way it was intended. On higher and low ends of the player spectrum this skill would either always be 2 green arrows or 2 red arrows. This didnt give a good idea of the skill of the server. Hive Score isnt a perfect system but it gives a good idea of how a player is expected to perform. Ie 4k + will most likely be very good, <1k probably not very skilled or new.

That is why I suggest going back to the old system that was in place before the arrow system that @Nordic said had existed that listed the score as a numerical value like 1636 for example. However this will not be enough. Change will be needed for it to work. A colored number system would fit the bill so players who have no idea what Hive score is could visibly see if a server is right for them. The proposed system would look like what @Handschuh had proposed but with slight modifications. The column would be called "Average Skill" / AVG skill - Skill level? Column name WIP.
Player: Bimbo
Hiveskill: 1000 (Your own Hiveskill needs to be available in the browser/menu)

Name | Hive Avg Diff | Hiveskill Avg (doesnt need to be shownshow)
TTO | 2000 | 3000
IBIS | 250 | 1250
TA | 750 | 1750
Rookie| -600 | 400

Orange for "higher hiveskill" and Yellow for "lower", Orange for "higher" (diff <= 500), because most players are lowerskilled, so they need to be warned if they join into a higherskilled server<br> Red for above 1k Difference

We all know getting stomped by high skilled players is super demoralizing and causes newer players to end up leaving because "this game is too hard". The opposite is also true, Higher skilled players get bored with easy games. I believe this change will help both player groups play games in their respective skill groups more often leading to funner more fair games. Any changes that reduces the amount of unfair games is a plus in my book.

What do you all think?

Edit: couldnt see text colors. Fixed

Comments

  • HandschuhHandschuh Join Date: 2005-03-08 Member: 44338Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Community Developer
    edited March 2018
    Tiny adjustments for my quote
    Player: Bimbo
    Hiveskill: 1000 (Your own Hiveskill needs to be available in the browser/menu)

    Name | Hive Avg Difference | Hiveskill Avg (doesnt need to be shown)
    TTO | ↑2000 | 3000
    IBIS | ↑250 | 1250
    TA | ↑750 | 1750
    Rookie| ↓-600 | 400

    Orange for "higher hiveskill" and Yellow for "lower"
    Orange for "higher" (difference <= 1000), because most players are lowerskilled, so they need to be warned if they join into a higherskilled server<br> Red for above 1k Difference
    You could even implement the old Arrows.. but we higher skilled players need numbers to join the server with the highest skill (or knowing if it's even worth joining)...

    Yesterday, I wanted to play...
    Join Server 1 Avg 1k
    Join Server 2 Avg 1,3k
    Join Server 3 Avg 0,9k
    Join Server 4 Avg 1,5k
    Join Server 5 Avg 1,3k
    Join Server 6 Avg 2,4-2,9k

    So it took me 5 Servers which I easily could've stomped by for example going lerk without knowing if there was a higher skilled Server worth waiting for..

    For Higher Hiveskilled players above 3k the colours could change like this for the same servers
    Player: Veteran
    Hiveskill: 3500 (Your own Hiveskill needs to be available in the browser/menu)

    Name | Hive Avg Difference | Hiveskill Avg (doesnt need to be shown)
    TTO | ↓500 | 3000
    IBIS | ↓2250 | 1250
    TA | ↓1250 | 1750
    Rookie| ↓3100 | 400
    ENSL Comp| ↑750 | 4250
    Orange for "higher hiveskill" and Yellow for "lower"
    Orange for "higher" (difference <= 1000), because most players are lowerskilled, so they need to be warned if they join into a higherskilled server<br> Red for above 1k Difference
    Coloringexample to keep the same colorsystem:
    Starting with 3000 Hiveskill the values change:
    Green = -500 to +500
    Red = below 1500
    yellow = -1500 to -500
    orange >= +500)

    Values could be tweaked, but for those times that there is no server inside the range between -1500 and +9999 every highskilled players above 4000 Hiveskill needs to be able to see the numbers instantly!
  • skav2skav2 Join Date: 2007-05-28 Member: 61037Members, Reinforced - Gold
    I like it but I was thinking it would work more like:

    -Red | Too low for you
    -Orange
    -Yellow
    -Green | Just right
    -Yellow
    -Orange
    -Red | Too high rank

    After looking at this, what about a different color scheme for lower skilled servers compared to your own? For example you are 3k HS. The one server is Average 1k hive score. Red would normally indicate it would be too high skilled for you as these have double meanings. This is obviously not the case. What could we do to make it easier to understand without adding too many colors? I suppose this system could work as it could just indicate a difference in skill. I was thinking maybe White for servers that are > -1500 lower than you.

  • MephillesMephilles Germany Join Date: 2013-08-07 Member: 186634Members, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
    I would still need the numbers though. As a 4k player even the high skill pub server (which are about 2.3k average I think) would show as way below my skill and therefor would look like the rest of the servers for me. I had the same problem with when the arrows got introduced, which made it useless for me
  • skav2skav2 Join Date: 2007-05-28 Member: 61037Members, Reinforced - Gold
    edited March 2018
    @Mephilles I was describing the color scheme for Hive skill either at, above or below your rank. They would remain numbered.

    I was thinking each color difference would be 500 skill points

    like-a so

    Based on this:
    -Red | -2000 or less
    -Orange -1001 to-1500
    -Yellow -501 to -1000
    -Green | +-500
    -Yellow +501 to +1000
    -Orange +1001 to +1500
    -Red | +2000 or more

    Your current hive score: 3000

    Ibis | AVG Skill 1100
    DMD | AVG Skill 2545
    TA | AVG Skill 2161
    SubAmerica | AVG Skill 1833
    Captains Night | AVG Skill 3678


    Example If your Hive skill was 1400

    Ibis | AVG Skill 1100
    DMD | AVG Skill 2545
    TA | AVG Skill 2161
    SubAmerica | AVG Skill 1833
    Captains Night | AVG Skill 3678


  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited March 2018
    What the 90 or so people above 4000 hive skill would see:

    Ibis | AVG Skill 1100
    DMD | AVG Skill 2545
    TA | AVG Skill 2161
    SubAmerica | AVG Skill 1833
    Captains Night | AVG Skill 3678

    Except the average server hive skill would be far lower, making most servers red all the time. 3000+ skill games are very rare events. So the server browser would probably look more like the following more often for a very high skill player. Look, the captains game stands out because it isn't red.

    Ibis | AVG Skill 800
    DMD | AVG Skill 545
    TA | AVG Skill 2161
    SubAmerica | AVG Skill 1833
    Captains Night | AVG Skill 2678

    Even though the majority of the servers would be red, the feature would be useful to the players that use it.
  • skav2skav2 Join Date: 2007-05-28 Member: 61037Members, Reinforced - Gold
    Good point. Like I said though the numbers can be changed to suit the average player rank better. I just threw some numbers in there to show how it would work. What do you think could make it work so that the top 5% and bottom 5% dont see all red servers?



  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited March 2018
    skav2 wrote: »
    What do you think could make it work so that the top 5% and bottom 5% dont see all red servers?

    Make the color not red.
    Build a larger player base.
    Reduce the skill ceiling.
    Raise the skill floor.
    Force skill segregation.
    Make the top and bottom 5% not play anymore.
    Get the United States and EU to make NS2 a legally required activity for at least one hour each day.
    Obtain world peace.
  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    It'd be interesting to put a range on each, rather than just the average. Say, mean +/- a standard deviation. That way, as a high skilled player where every server is far below you on average, you can still pick the servers that have at least some players at your skill level.
  • ShrimmShrimm Join Date: 2012-10-05 Member: 161652Members
    Came to these forums just to suggest putting average hiveskill in the server list. Glad to see a topic already exists and others think the same. playing on a server where the average hiveskill is 700 is not fun at all and I wish I could just avoid joining them all together.
  • jrgnjrgn Join Date: 2006-11-03 Member: 58289Members
    There is a mod that does this, at least partially: Enhanced Server Browser. You can find it in the workshop.
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