What to do with gorge tunnels now?

13

Comments

  • StardogStardog Join Date: 2004-10-25 Member: 32448Members
    Remove tunnels. Roll back to NS1.
  • .trixX..trixX. Budapest Join Date: 2007-10-11 Member: 62605Members
    Stardog wrote: »
    Remove tunnels. Roll back to NS1.

    Piggies would lose an important ability... in NS1 they were the [:: Builders of Chambers ::]

    Restricting them to a fast builder and field medic would be boring. Maybe increase hydra + web limit?
  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation
    No one is forcing people to go gorge at the first second of the game. Even a bad skulk in an early engagement uses 9-10 bullets of a marine and that can be help.

    He can die as skulk, spawn as gorge and have a 2nd tunnel by the time he gets to where hes going.
  • WakeWake Join Date: 2003-03-05 Member: 14351Members, Constellation
    @Frozen No, no one is forcing anyone to do anything ... except yourself in the rest of your post ? :p

    Let's adapt and try to find alternative to die as a skulk then respawn as a gorge, like going gorge first and team up with skulks to support early engagments.


  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation
    edited June 2016
    Lol @Wake that's what I mean. You don't need to drop tunnels right away, there's other ways to support. Both examples we just said are valid examples/options of what to do in lieu of running to drop a tunnel.

    I don't even think tunnels should be in the game, it was a ceappy shoehorn UWE put in removing asymmetry. If aliens were faster they wouldnt even need the parity with phase gates. But now we're stuck balancing around existing features because no one wants to waste work.

    One thing you'll notice in every suggestion I throw out wherever is that they don't involve wasting other features that were already worked on, because that's lame as hell

    edit: The only reason that skulk use is even viable is because of the UWE band-aid of removing "no res while dead"
  • WakeWake Join Date: 2003-03-05 Member: 14351Members, Constellation
    edited June 2016
    Like everyone, I resist changes, despite the fact I'm an IT guy and that I am specifically dedicated to move things forward.

    When tunnels appeared, I disliked it, for the reason you invoke: an assymetry killer. But I got used to it, and finally liked it.

    When 250 was released, it drove me away from the game, literrally. It took monthes before I try it again and in fine, dealed with structutres you can build on infestation, JP/Exo with only one CC etc.

    When I came back, I was so sorry the base shrinked like an innuit ding a ling peeing in the heart of the pole 6 months night.

    When I saw large servers, I stayed away saying no way I'll get in there, i'ts not NS, it's decadence. But one evening, I eventually joined, and saw that NS could have more dimensions. I had fun, with nice people.

    Derail (we have a spoiler button, can we have a derail button?): I'm upset that this subject is dividing the community, I guess that some nasty words were exchanged in the past, 294 left jailed and banned users as casualties. Like if we had too many ! It pisses me off there can be so much bitterness between a faithful metal war horse and woozever offers so much hosting since, afaik, both earned sniploads of thanks for supporting this game


    Yes, we don't like changes, what we know is safe, what we don't know is unsafe.
    What I believe is that it would be fatal is get back to a dead model, so better move forward than turning back.
    I'll find a way to tunnel your mom !

    'Though I know it's impossible to go living thru the past", Bob Marley, Natural Mystic.
  • WobWob Join Date: 2005-04-08 Member: 47814Members, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    Either marines need to be nerfed somehow in their insane pressure early game, or aliens need something to keep their territory more stable.

    You can either have earlier gorge tunnels, or better support gorges (more mobile).

    Also @IronHorse, I don't think marines should be letting gorges set up in club as a launch control start, at least not without aliens committing vast amount of lifeforms to it and leaving observation --> water treatment --> energy flow open and cyst chains neutered (thus no expansion)
  • StardogStardog Join Date: 2004-10-25 Member: 32448Members
    edited June 2016
    .trixX. wrote: »
    Stardog wrote: »
    Remove tunnels. Roll back to NS1.

    Piggies would lose an important ability... in NS1 they were the [:: Builders of Chambers ::]

    Restricting them to a fast builder and field medic would be boring. Maybe increase hydra + web limit?
    Make hydras and webs more powerful. They're useless right now. Hydras should be a large object you can't jump over, so 3 could block a corridor. Webs should work as they did in NS1 where you can tangle a marine semi permanently if one-on-one, because they couldn't shoot. A room with 3 hydras and 3 webs currently isn't a problem for even a lone marine.

    And add lerk lifting while you're at it. And let aliens run faster by default.
  • MoFo1MoFo1 United States Join Date: 2014-07-25 Member: 197612Members
    Stardog wrote: »
    .trixX. wrote: »
    Stardog wrote: »
    Remove tunnels. Roll back to NS1.

    Piggies would lose an important ability... in NS1 they were the [:: Builders of Chambers ::]

    Restricting them to a fast builder and field medic would be boring. Maybe increase hydra + web limit?
    Make hydras and webs more powerful. They're useless right now. Hydras should be a large object you can't jump over, so 3 could block a corridor. Webs should work as they did in NS1 where you can tangle a marine semi permanently if one-on-one, because they couldn't shoot. A room with 3 hydras and 3 webs currently isn't a problem for even a lone marine.

    And add lerk lifting while you're at it. And let aliens run faster by default.

    Agree that webs and hydras should be a little stronger... Maybe not something that could block marines from jumping over though (such things also block other aliens) plus hydras already block gunfire...

    When I gorge I use hydras rarely and I never rely on them for anything other than a momentary distraction or early warning system of sorts... They could stand to have just a little bit more damage or health. (not both)

    Webs are useless right now.. Basically just used for the brief parasite they offer.. They should slow by at least 50% imo.. After all they are webs....

    Lerk lift would be awesome even if it was just a biomass 9 ability for strafing gorge+lerk bile runs to serve as a game ender..

    And no to faster skulks. They're already fast enough (Especially with celerity)

  • NexZone30NexZone30 Join Date: 2013-06-27 Member: 185719Members
    Hydras aren't useless, it'd be cool if they buffed them. People really just need to learn how to use hydras effectively. :/ Webs definitely need a buff though...
  • The_Welsh_WizardThe_Welsh_Wizard Join Date: 2013-09-10 Member: 188101Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    NexZone30 wrote: »
    Hydras aren't useless, it'd be cool if they buffed them. People really just need to learn how to use hydras effectively. :/ Webs definitely need a buff though...

    Getting move speed decreased is not fun. Getting parasited by webs was a terrible idea. Webs do not need a buff but a complete redesign.
  • WakeWake Join Date: 2003-03-05 Member: 14351Members, Constellation
    Well, if you call it webs, it's gotta be sticky no ?
    It's useless and so clumsy to drop atm. If you intend to help the gorge delay their tunnel (back to OP?) , then it needs redesign
  • RevanCoranaRevanCorana Join Date: 2015-08-14 Member: 207125Members
    edited June 2016
    NexZone30 wrote: »
    Hydras aren't useless, it'd be cool if they buffed them. People really just need to learn how to use hydras effectively. :/ Webs definitely need a buff though...

    Getting move speed decreased is not fun. Getting parasited by webs was a terrible idea. Webs do not need a buff but a complete redesign.

    Complete redesign slightly too extreme perhabs though I agree that an overhaul would be welcome. In the form of an active soft counter (crowd control in fps should always have some form of counter).
    For example if looking around with the mouse and pressing a/d/a/d really fast sorta "breaks" the web (decreasing the slow intensity and duration) that would make it more fun, allowing an active way to counter it
  • AurOn2AurOn2 COOKIES! FREEDOM, AND BISCUITS! Australia Join Date: 2012-01-13 Member: 140224Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Forum staff
    NexZone30 wrote: »
    Hydras aren't useless, it'd be cool if they buffed them. People really just need to learn how to use hydras effectively. :/ Webs definitely need a buff though...

    Getting move speed decreased is not fun. Getting parasited by webs was a terrible idea. Webs do not need a buff but a complete redesign.

    Complete redesign slightly too extreme perhabs though I agree that an overhaul would be welcome. In the form of an active soft counter (crowd control in fps should always have some form of counter).
    For example if looking around with the mouse and pressing a/d/a/d really fast sorta "breaks" the web (decreasing the slow intensity and duration) that would make it more fun, allowing an active way to counter it

    You already can counter it. Buy a welder. Welders kill webs. You shouldn't leave base without one anyway.

    ..unless you're on a heroic suicide mission for the good of humanity.
    Heroes don't need welders.
  • WakeWake Join Date: 2003-03-05 Member: 14351Members, Constellation
    AurOn2 wrote: »
    ...unless you're on a heroic suicide mission for the good of humanity.
    Heroes don't need welders.

    Or unless you're a rookie, and already spend 45 Pres on welders
  • zeepzeep Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 3367Members
    Long time player here, pubs.

    I don't know all the ins and outs but do i understand correct that Gorges can't make a tunnel now at the start of a game because tunnels are a nuisance to Marines overall?
  • aeroripperaeroripper Join Date: 2005-02-25 Member: 42471NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
    Webs still aren't all that useful in their current implementation. I think they should tangle marines for a bit longer like they used to, and be cloaked unless scanned by the comm or within range of an obs.
  • TriggerHappyBroTriggerHappyBro Ohio Join Date: 2016-05-23 Member: 217383Members, NS2 Playtester
    Zavaro wrote: »
    I don't really like the cloak idea, but I think it'd be better if they were partially transparent, harder to see.

    I concur. You should miss them unless you're looking for them, like real spider webs.
  • The_Welsh_WizardThe_Welsh_Wizard Join Date: 2013-09-10 Member: 188101Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    Zavaro wrote: »
    I don't really like the cloak idea, but I think it'd be better if they were partially transparent, harder to see.

    I concur. You should miss them unless you're looking for them, like real spider webs.

    Cloaking upgrade for aliens is already annoying enough.
  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation
    Webs aren't usable in combat because thy are on a build menu which is unusable as far as I'm concerned. If there was more per lifeform customization available it might be ok.

    As is the ability MIGHT be strong. But we wouldn't know because no one can use it to capacity
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver
    Frozen wrote: »
    Webs aren't usable in combat because thy are on a build menu which is unusable as far as I'm concerned. If there was more per lifeform customization available it might be ok.

    Suggestion: What if you were able to shot web?
  • WakeWake Join Date: 2003-03-05 Member: 14351Members, Constellation
    Gorges ain't spiders.
    How about replacing it by ... by some muddy glowy puddle kind of a gorge vomit like thing (if I was not at work, I would illustrate lol) sticking unfortunates marines that rely on their feets to move (i.e.: JP and Exo don't care) and having a total capacity of stickyness or just decay in time.
  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation
    Wake wrote: »
    Gorges ain't spiders.
    How about replacing it by ... by some muddy glowy puddle kind of a gorge vomit like thing (if I was not at work, I would illustrate lol) sticking unfortunates marines that rely on their feets to move (i.e.: JP and Exo don't care) and having a total capacity of stickyness or just decay in time.

    For real. We need something to do with sticky shoes.
  • .trixX..trixX. Budapest Join Date: 2007-10-11 Member: 62605Members
    edited June 2016
    Wake wrote: »
    Gorges ain't spiders.
    How about replacing it by ... by some muddy glowy puddle kind of a gorge vomit like thing (if I was not at work, I would illustrate lol) sticking unfortunates marines that rely on their feets to move (i.e.: JP and Exo don't care) and having a total capacity of stickyness or just decay in time.

    Inspiration from nature: Northern Fulmar :D
    “It’s a less-than-charming defence tactic that not only smells hideous, it’s also dangerous: the blast of vomit is highly acidic…”
    “…the feathers which had been hit by the oil became wet during bathing. The waterlogged birds sank deep into the water, were unable to fly and finally died of exposure or drowning. “
    fulmar-spitting-oil-anneleeuw-flickr-Mar-2012-tiny.jpg
  • WakeWake Join Date: 2003-03-05 Member: 14351Members, Constellation
    @.trixX. (you dirty lil' hacker)
    Well sometimes, when I read something here and there, it kinda triggers the same defensive reflexes ... and now my screen is full of holes.
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