Realistic water
The_Shark
USA Join Date: 2015-08-24 Member: 207433Members
USA Join Date: 2015-08-24 Member: 207433Members
So, I had a few thoughts about the water physics in Subnautica. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that they're... well, nonexistent. I'm not going to ask for a fluid-physics engine (trust me, I know the bounds of possibility), but it would be cool to add some sort of simulated water physics. At the moment, it's not an ocean, just a section of nothingness and dead space that you can swim in.
Firstly, splashing. I've seen Reapers rocket out of the sea as if their rear ends were attached to a Submarine-Launched Ballistic Missile, but despite them being considerably larger than even a Leuperodon, not a single splash was thrown. With all those head extensions, you can't pretend they're so aquadynamic that they can just slide out of the sea. The Cyclops and the SeaMoth both have a thing like that, but I'm wondering why nothing else does. Even a Peeper would make a small effect, but not none at all.
Second, wakes and personal currents. This would be a highly complex thing to put in fully, but there would basically be a few separate parts of it.
Thirdly, and to be honest finally only because I'm running short of time here, deflections. One of the most common reasons people think they see the Loch Ness monster out on... well, Loch Ness, is the unique geology of the area. many edges of the Loch are vertical walls, with a slight slope to make the bottom. If you've ever played around in the bathtub as a kid, you probably remember moving one way, the wave made by your motion deflecting off the wall and pushing you back. Oftentimes, boat wakes will bounce off the edges of the Loch, creating a random wake seemingly bound to nothing which people see as the monster. Having something like that underwater would actually be an interesting feature if the "wakes" thing above was added. The idea I commented about something slamming you into the wall could be changed to the personal current bouncing off the wall, forcing an instantaneous change in direction. In other words, whiplash (you ARE wearing a suit, it's possible underwater with one). Having a current of water deflect off geology to mess up your swimming plans would add a combination of challenge, realism, and the feeling of helplessness the game seems to be trying to create. Imagine swimming along, and suddenly moving the other way for a few seconds.
Anyway, as I mentioned a moment ago, I'm running short on time. The rest of my life, for what it's worth, calls, so that's really all I have to say on the matter. This is obviously not an exhaustive list, so much as something to get people thinking about possibilities.
Firstly, splashing. I've seen Reapers rocket out of the sea as if their rear ends were attached to a Submarine-Launched Ballistic Missile, but despite them being considerably larger than even a Leuperodon, not a single splash was thrown. With all those head extensions, you can't pretend they're so aquadynamic that they can just slide out of the sea. The Cyclops and the SeaMoth both have a thing like that, but I'm wondering why nothing else does. Even a Peeper would make a small effect, but not none at all.
Second, wakes and personal currents. This would be a highly complex thing to put in fully, but there would basically be a few separate parts of it.
- When a particularly large object or creature is moving towards the surface (Typhoon-class submarines, whales, and Sea Emperors), it creates a wake above the surface, because the sheer mass of the object essentially creates its own current. When I drive my Cyclops along, with the top of the scanner holder thing (not the antennae, the base), and nothing occurs above the surface like some missile of doom coming for whoever's in the way, I'm a sad panda. Now, with the Cyclops, it wouldn't matter because you can't see it. But a Reaper hurtling along three meters underwater would cause a small "bump" of water starting slightly behind the head.
- The effect of the personal current continues underwater, in less-visible but just as pronounced effects. Not only is the sheer mass of many things enough to create a detectable current, it can also "tow" certain things behind it due to the sheer force. Whale pods sometimes swim based on that principle, with smaller members saving energy by only having to swim a fraction as hard as usual, because the leader is tugging them along. Now, this is due to not only mass, but speed, so it's the kinetic force that does it, not just the size. With the speed Reefbacks move, their current would be noticeable (due to the sheer size partially counteracting the low speed), but not inescapable. But if a Sea Dragon decides to rocket by at Mach 10, it would only make sense to be pulled along at about Mach 9.9 with him. In fact, with that thought, I think it would be cool if some "boss" monster actually did that intentionally as an attack, yanking you along like a disobedient puppy on a leash, then suddenly stopping and letting your momentum slam you into a wall. Naturally, the SeaMoth would be affected a fair bit less than a player in open ocean, and a Cyclops almost not at all, but if you're exposed when a Reaper comes along, you've got something new to deal with now than just the teeth. Heck, Reefbacks could become mildly dangerous, making it harder to surface for air. In the original myths of the Kraken, it wasn't some tentacly squid thing, it was just a big, BIG monster that couldn't have cared less about our existence. The only danger it posed, like whales, was the whirlpool created when it sank into the sea. Reefbacks could be semi-similar, dangerous to some degree without being malevolent.
Thirdly, and to be honest finally only because I'm running short of time here, deflections. One of the most common reasons people think they see the Loch Ness monster out on... well, Loch Ness, is the unique geology of the area. many edges of the Loch are vertical walls, with a slight slope to make the bottom. If you've ever played around in the bathtub as a kid, you probably remember moving one way, the wave made by your motion deflecting off the wall and pushing you back. Oftentimes, boat wakes will bounce off the edges of the Loch, creating a random wake seemingly bound to nothing which people see as the monster. Having something like that underwater would actually be an interesting feature if the "wakes" thing above was added. The idea I commented about something slamming you into the wall could be changed to the personal current bouncing off the wall, forcing an instantaneous change in direction. In other words, whiplash (you ARE wearing a suit, it's possible underwater with one). Having a current of water deflect off geology to mess up your swimming plans would add a combination of challenge, realism, and the feeling of helplessness the game seems to be trying to create. Imagine swimming along, and suddenly moving the other way for a few seconds.
Anyway, as I mentioned a moment ago, I'm running short on time. The rest of my life, for what it's worth, calls, so that's really all I have to say on the matter. This is obviously not an exhaustive list, so much as something to get people thinking about possibilities.
Comments
Unfornately the devs can't do it. They're indie devs, not a AAA company. And the base of most underwater effects would be distortions. Without them no
And the water has no distortions. Example of no distortions?
<img width="640" height="360" src="http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/268338039153311462/36993B111E3B688177B5A1B323F6EC4C110A76B7/"></img>
You can see small surface waves, lightrays, proper shading, but no underwater distortions.
And without this ability, how do you visualize any underwater wave based effects?
So, in answer to this:
Simple. We don't NEED the effects, I'm talking about physics. It's the difference between a computer-generated explosion that does nothing, and a shockwave in real life that can't be seen.
But a question: Do you really think implementing physics like this will be easier than visuals? (in general)
Don't you think that's hard to achieve? The object movement (including tail animation) would have to be linked to action to create force waves rendered physically correct in case of splashing and wakes (ok, it's cheaper for static subs). For currents the base forces would have to be aligned with the surface geometry and the end results rendered from this data. I haven't seen any realistic significant currents in the game so far.
Not to forget that the devs are more good at visuals than physics. They aren't engine specialists, but know how to design 3D games. If they could do good physics I think the game already would have current gameplay inside. You know ... swimming against a stream, dangerous cave currents, ... anything more than a current generator, showing they can do it locally limited.
But maybe you only thought of a simple motion solution. Mass & velocity create a limited force wave around the object. Still would need implementation time and I think the devs simply don't want to do it.
Although I would be the first to want it. Physically even more than optically. I just gave up any hope.
For the splashing, no physical version would really be needed, and it would be super-easy. As for the wakes, I admit, it would be easier to have it just be visual than have all the physical properties, but as I commented before, it could simply exist in the form of an "aura" of sorts with a radius being a direct function of velocity, with a coefficient based on the weight or shape of the entity in question.
Oooohh... the way you explained it, I thought you considered it just a generally bad idea. I think everyone would want something like that, but you're right, it'd be considerably harder to implement than it is to say (most things in coding are).
The only thing I really have to note, in that case, is this: I gave up hope once. It was the worst decision I ever made.
Don't ask.
I wouldn't mind improved graphics for splashes and flooding though, I cringe a bit every time I see a sub land in the water.