Free the Web!

AfterbeeAfterbee ads Join Date: 2015-10-22 Member: 208677Members
in NS2 General Discussion
Is there anything against making webs free? I don't see the problem, it would make gorges a bit harder to hunt with JP/shotties and it would give the aliens something to counter JP rushes.

What do you think?
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Comments

  • MaxAmusMaxAmus UK Join Date: 2003-12-26 Member: 24779Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow
    maybe - Maybe not. I feel they are fine as they are, if and when used correctly, the cost makes it so they cannot be spammed like crazy every few seconds - off course if the gorge has a lot of res and aliens are on alot of RT's - Then the cost wont matter :confused:
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  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation
    I think it should be free 3rd hive tech. I think it should be spammed at this point. I think welders should cut them down.
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  • AfterbeeAfterbee ads Join Date: 2015-10-22 Member: 208677Members
    MaxAmus wrote: »
    maybe - Maybe not. I feel they are fine as they are, if and when used correctly, the cost makes it so they cannot be spammed like crazy every few seconds - off course if the gorge has a lot of res and aliens are on alot of RT's - Then the cost wont matter :confused:

    1 res per web is still quite a lot for what they do and how easily they are removed. It adds up and that's why people NEVER use them nowadays.
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  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited October 2015
    What makes them never used is being commander researchable. They have very low utility. Stab for fades is the same way.
    A commander is not willing to spend precious tres on webs or stab.

    Remove that limitation and then yes, the limiting factor is cost. It says a lot that webs are so useless people think they should be free.
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  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
    Webs ARE useless, mainly due to the research. But cost is also a factor.

    By the time you have webs, especially compared to more useful upgrades, the marines have either flamethrowers or grenades and its simply near pointless to use.
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  • AfterbeeAfterbee ads Join Date: 2015-10-22 Member: 208677Members
    DC_Darkling wrote: »
    Webs ARE useless, mainly due to the research. But cost is also a factor.

    By the time you have webs, especially compared to more useful upgrades, the marines have either flamethrowers or grenades and its simply near pointless to use.

    Then I propose they should at least be free (not Commander-free) and see if they get used more. They were very useful in NS1 and I think they could be interesting in NS2 too.
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  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    The best thing you can do to see this in game is to put your balance ideas into a mod and convince a server operator to try them
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  • RedSwordRedSword Join Date: 2006-12-07 Member: 58947Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter
    I never knew/noticed there was web p-res cost :o lol. I believe a commander t-res-only cost should be fine. If it is overpowered than nerf them (more easily weldable). As it stands it is sad to see a feature in the game that is useless more than 80% of the time in public games (and 80% is a safe number lol).
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  • MaxAmusMaxAmus UK Join Date: 2003-12-26 Member: 24779Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow
    I dont gorge alot, but when i do, i love having /asking for webs, they can be quite strong - Pushing a PG or an area that has no marines, drop a few webs around the floor and with a few skulks - you can clean up any returning marines. ITs great for also setting up traps etc.

    But i do agree that they can be to easily removed - have them so only a FT can remove them? as it stand you can Weld / FT / nade them.
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  • meatmachinemeatmachine South England Join Date: 2013-01-06 Member: 177858Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter
    edited October 2015
    1 pres per web sure does add up, but people seem to have differing opinions on whether they should be free.
    The tres cost maaaayy be a factor in web availability, but aren't they 10 res? That's really pretty cheap if you ask me.
    If they DID end up free, I would expect a limit of 3 per gorge and a HP reduction, maybe.

    Know what I'm thinking? Maybe we just need a meta change or something. I'm gonna start researching webs every time I khamm and see what happens.
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  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
    I loved webs in NS1 but they worked much better due to many reasons.

    * slower pace of game. So you had more time to build up a area. Less chance to encounter marines who could counter it.
    * Marine commander had to drop anything. Marines milage vs webs varied, hugely, if he did not drop.
    * Webs were much MUCH harder to see for marines in NS1, then in NS2. This made them much more useful. This is one thing the comp scene, in my own opinion, is holding back, with their complaints about gameplay restricting movement and control and all that stuff.
    * I think they were also easier to get but do not quote me on that, its been what.. 10 years?

    All in all the risk to encounter webs without stuff to counter it was greater then it is in ns2.
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  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation
    edited October 2015
    @DC_Darkling , Webs were game ending 3rd hive tech in NS1. As they should be in NS2.
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  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
    I can live with webs being game ending if they were ya know.. game ending. :P
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  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation
    They would be if combined with other game ending tech from the other lifeforms
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  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    DC_Darkling wrote: »
    I can live with webs being game ending if they were ya know.. game ending. :P

    You clearly haven't seen spider pig, it will be the end of us all... PSSSST just between you and me @DC_Darkling, that sounds "game" ending to me :o
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  • NeokenNeoken Bruges, Belgium Join Date: 2004-03-20 Member: 27447Members, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Playtester
    I'd prefer the cost to stay, but the tech to be available a lot earlier, like on biomass 3. Most of the times when webs are researched, the game is decided already anyway and you don't get much use out if it.
    Off Topic Disagree 2Agree Awesome
  • UncleCrunchUncleCrunch Mayonnaise land Join Date: 2005-02-16 Member: 41365Members, Reinforced - Onos
    Web could be fine like this with minor in-game changes

    say...
    • Harder to break/remove (more welding/flames needed).
    • Sending alerts like any structures but only if they get hurt. If a marine get webbed on purpose to remove it doesn't send alerts.
    • visible as units for the commander
    So the web aren't like NS1 (webbing/gluing marines for real) but more like slowing down them and 'snitching'.


    So...
    • It doesn't require any change in the economy. Only in-game changes
    • It can't help Aliens in other ways than gluing JP marine. If you know NS1 you know that a gorge with web is a black widow for JPers. Helping Alien like they can keep an eye (passive one) on key locations in the map.
    • Marines will have to plan their tactical /strategy moves better.
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  • turtsmcgurtturtsmcgurt Join Date: 2012-11-01 Member: 165456Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    I think the real issue is that webs reduce marine speed by something like 80-85% iirc which is broken and people are trying to balance around that. 85% is essentially immobilizing the marine. we already know removing character control from players is not good (see devour)

    here's what I think should happen to webs:
    biomass 4
    10 tres research
    limit 4 per gorge
    free pres
    reduce marine movement speed by 20-30% (hard to say without testing)
    can be destroyed with welders (even more incentive to buy them)
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  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
    I would argue removing control from webbing is perfectly fine and people complain to much.
    webs are already much easier to see then the old ns1 webbing.

    If you get stuck in ns2 webs, deal with it.
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  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation
    Just keep it OP and put it at biomass 7. Buff it if anything, then.

    If people is complaining about losing control, then they shouldn't have lost control of the game and let the aliens get 3 hives
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