I'm not sure the the point of this thread originally was entirely focused on what build order is the best. Without worrying about which order things should go up in, it's very annoying if the vast majority of the team works well under and would like to see a particular set of chambers and a single gorge ignores them or even yells at them and builds something contrary to their wishes. Should players be able to adjust their strategy to deal with a different set of chambers. But in a given game, they shouldn't HAVE to. It really isn't fair to a team to have a single player dictate the way they should go about the game, especially if it plays to their weaknesses. Well, maybe that's the case for a commander, but it's different for aliens.
So maybe most of the players on a public server are "n00bs". Maybe they should be able to go and run with any given order. Well, that's fine and dandy. But in the "real world" most people are more comfortable with DMS and will stumble if you, say, do something like SDM. Besides, going onto a server with a team that really wants something set up a certain way and just disregarding that is fairly rude.
As for the comment on Fades who rely on adreneline being hopeless idiots who are playing the "wrong way", I most certainly disagree with that. I can't say that I don't agree with the idea of making every shot count. However, I very much prefer to have more shots to make count. I, as many people do, use the Fade as a long-range peek-and-fire attacker. This has been proven to be brutally effective, especially when paired with a lerk's umbra support. Typically, I've found that the marine team has taken a hive by the time you have your second up and running (and if they haven't its usually a moot point because they're on the way out), and are either heavily defending it, or looking to sneak a siege base at one of your current hives.
Fades with adreneline take down turrets are range quickly. Moreover, the acid rocket allows you to target and kill marines who are defending an instalation while splashing their structures for some damage. Oftertimes while a phase gate running at a defended location, I will fire at the turret factory once every so often (about at the same rate my energy recharges so I'm always near full), wait to hear the phase gate go off, then fire a volly off at the phase gate, damaging it and killing the marine who has just stepped through. Even a lone fade can inflict considerable damage in this way.
Don't get me wrong, skulks can be absolutely brutal against enemy installations with cloaking. Using leap you can even stay cloaked and move up to and circle a turret factory. You can even slowly take it down while cloaked if its surrounded by turrets. However, retaking a fully built up hive location from the marines isn't exactly the sort of job that even a skilled cloaked skulk is really adept at, especially if reinforced by heavy marines via a phase gate.
While I'm sure that cloaked players could harass the hell out of the marines, it's a little tricky and most of the time not something that I want to demand of my teammates. Especially with the vulnerabilities of cloaking: the readily avaiable and mobile sensor sweep, the fact that observatories nuke cloaking at key locations, and the current little bug that a cloaked enemy's name pops up if you place your cursor over them.
However, this does go the other way, too. If the team was comprised by a vast majority of veteral skulkers and they wanted nothing else than to cripple the marines at the start with their cloaked antics, I'd fault any gorge who flew in his team's face and went ahead and ignored them. Sure they can't FORCE gorge X to listen to them and dictate how he plays, but he really should be trying to cooperate with them as a team.
<!--QuoteBegin--Silver Fox+Nov 25 2002, 05:35 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Silver Fox @ Nov 25 2002, 05:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->pft, anyone who thinks any one chamber type is better then the other is a fool.
Each of the three chamber types allow awesome upgrades and extra benifits.
If you think the sensory chamber is usless, play with it more. Flayra once built some sensory chambers during one PT while we were all yelling for defence (it was the first chamber). He pretty much said shut up and play.
It turned out to be one of the best games I've had. The sensory chamber is an awesome chamber. It gives advance warning of incoming marines, will parisite any marine who's stupid enough to touch it <b>and</b> it gives the abillity to cloak.
The other two chamber types only give 2 benifits, the sensory gives 3.
Never get upset because a Gorge places a type of chamber you didn't want. If you want that chamber first, play Gorge.
Don't give me that crap about "But if I do, there will be too many Gorges!". Aliens play for them selves - team play is only a benifit to them, not a requirement.
Go Gorge, build 3 chambers, go Skulk.
Or, just stfu and play.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I'd say that anyone who took sensory first in a pub game is a damn fool. Does the phrase "tried and true" mean anything to you? Who's the fool, the one who knows how to win and does it?
Again, it must have worked great on your one game. I'm happy for you.
On the pubs however, it dosen't for the vast majority of games. This fool has reasons, and I'm sure a lot of other fools think this way.
Parasites marines that touch it? What marine touches these things, as opposed to shooting it dead? What game would NOT have them placed amidst defences, which would also be shot and ring out a nice big "structure under attack" and a nice glowing red circle on hive sight? As far as "benefeits" go, those I can live without. As for "the enemy is approaching" message, it's vague, unspecific, and won't help you get rid of them once you find them. Besides, as soon as they shoot a building you'll know on hivesight.
The upgrades are fun, but not worth it compared to others. Enhanced sight is a joke, yes a JOKE. Complete waste of an upgrade. An upgrade that would enhance marine walking, reloading, and comm sounds for aliens would be a lot more useful. Scent of Fear is alright, but the Commander drops medpacks like rain. Not saying I haven't had it useful at least once, still not worth it in the face of other upgrades. Cloaking? Great. Won't help you take out a base, or kill marines. Only get the jump on them. And bases don't need to be surprised, as they don't move. And any victory by Aliens in a pub requires an assault on a marine base. And the sooner that is done, the better.
I guess those are useful for some small private games. But the average pub brawl sees those things as expendable. And yes, I'll take movement or Defence ANY DAY over sensory. Hell I wouldn't mind if they didn't build it at all. It's simply not effective enough. The upgrades are not worth it.
As for going gorge first? I often do. And I build Defence like the rest of the winning alien community <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Shrike30+Nov 24 2002, 01:08 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Shrike30 @ Nov 24 2002, 01:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I've seen it done where the gorge in question dropped a triplet of sensory towers in a place the marines usually expand to fairly early. Now, this might seem like a waste of resources... but it worked beautifully. Skulks cloaked EVERYWHERE, keeping the marines from leaving their base simply through attrition. Second hive up, kicks out some defense... Eventually, the marines expanded some (helped by sweeps, which the commander finally started doing), at which point they found the triplet, wiped it out... and whammo, we've not got any sensory towers anymore. "OK guys, i'm setting up movement now..."<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> This woudn't work, as the first Hive is still bound to "Sensory." The only way to unbind it would be to let it be destroyed. THEN defense chambers could be built.
Try building one of any tower outside the marine base. Build only one. That chamber will appear next to your Hive. Let the marines destroy it. That chamber still appears next to your Hive, and you cannot build different chambers.
-Ryan!
Advice is what we ask for when we already know the answer but wish we didn't. -- Erica Jong
<!--QuoteBegin--Catgirl+Nov 24 2002, 02:31 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Catgirl @ Nov 24 2002, 02:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The Kharaa are the OFFENSIVE team. They MUST expand, they MUST take over new ground.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Huh?
And so the marines are what...defensive?
The Kharaa are not the offensive team. The Kharaa already control the map. They are defensive. Their goal should be containment of the Frontiersman. Keep them contained and/or harassed long enough to allow your gorges to spread the infestation throughout the map. Once the second Hive is online, more agressive techniques may evolve.
But saying that the Kharaa are supposed to be hyper-agressive is a quick trip down respawn lane. The marines are the agressors, who must rush to take over that first Hive, and then fight for the second. Marines playing defensively allows the Kharaa to end the game with an Onos rush. If you are Kharaa, and see a fellow skulk waiting above the doorway of an oft-travelled hallway, don't admonish him for not contributing. He is doing his job, and quite effectively at that. He will surely take out more marines, and cause more stress, anguish, and paranoia for them than any skulk who chooses to continue rushing into the marine spawn area over and over and over again.
-Ryan!
All legislation, all government, all society is founded upon the principle of mutual concession, politeness, comity, courtesy; upon these everything is based...Let him who elevates himself above humanity, above its weaknesses, its infirmities, its wants, its necessities, say, if he pleases, I will never compromise; but let no one who is not above the frailties of our common nature disdain compromises. -- Henry Clay
<!--QuoteBegin--Inexorable+Nov 24 2002, 03:30 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Inexorable @ Nov 24 2002, 03:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Just to be clear on this, <i>I</i> didn't call the Kharaa defensive. Fam did.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> As did the developers.
The only time the Kharaa take on an offensive role is when they are taking back a Hive.
And that's because they didn't play a good enough defensive role in the early game.
As a Kharaa, the marines are coming to you. Your job is to hold them back. I'd call that pretty defensive. If you fail, then the roles are switched, but for only one area. If the Kharaa succeed in taking the Hive back, then roles are again switched back until end game, fighting marines off until you have enough organization to destroy their main base.
-Ryan!
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. -- John Kenneth Galbraith
ShockehIf a packet drops on the web and nobody's near to see it...Join Date: 2002-11-19Member: 9336NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
edited November 2002
Guys, I never called the Fades who use Adren & shooting lame. Or any other slur against their playing (unlike those who critisized the cloakers) but you just <b>play Fades differently to us</b>
I don't NEED acid rockets very much. I blink. A LOT.
So, to wheoever said it. YES, I do take on those 4 LMG's down the end of the hall, regularily. I do it all the time, and get cries of "n1" & "gj" from my side & "OMFG YOU CHEAT!" from the 4 I just butchered. Because I didn't shoot them, I blink all the way to their end of the corridor & butcher them all while they panic. Which they ALWAYS do.
As for bases, yeah, it takes me longer to deal with them, but I can still do it. I just always go for turret factories. The Fade with either Regen or Cara, has enough survivability for me to keep dashing in with Blink, and slicing it up about 5-8 times, that I can still get out again in time.
Edit : Oh, and if you're gonna say "Well, then they repair it & you do nothing" No I'm not. I'm keeping Marines, Welders and probably some nice kit they coulda used tied up defending a base from just me. If you can't build 3rd hive now (and get the Adren you're all crying for) with no opposition, well, why are you playing again? And if they don't repair it, I've just killed a Marine base on my own. With no Adren, so shh.
As for those who said that Sensory chambers actually ability (warning/parasite) is useless, how often do you really use a Movement chamber? And to good effect? Err... not a lot, is the answer I know most people would say <i>when they're being honest</i> (Oh, and I agree that Sensory first is a deathtrap. I just don't see why it should be third)
So, I suppose the Adren/Cloak debate hinges a lot on how you play the Fade, and how much you blink. (This gets more confusing when I say I generally take Celerity as my Movement skill anyway. That much better for chasing backpedalling marines)
The difference in opinion here is I'm saying, that Movement is valid (and good), but don't **obscenity** if you get Sensory, it doesn't cripple the Fade, just learn to play different, whilst people are telling me in reverse that Sensory is "OMG END OF GAME! GG MARINE! [retard has quit the game]" material.
<!--QuoteBegin--Shockwave+Nov 25 2002, 03:08 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Shockwave @ Nov 25 2002, 03:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->As for those who said that Sensory chambers actually ability (warning/parasite) is useless, how often do you really use a Movement chamber? And to good effect? Err... not a lot, is the answer I know most people would say <i>when they're being honest</i> (Oh, and I agree that Sensory first is a deathtrap. I just don't see why it should be third)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Hear, hear.
Sometimes, a Hive will be under attack, and I will see people spawn, and then run out of the Hive room towards the red circle on their Hive sight, when two or three movement chambers are sitting right in front of them.
Putting sensory chambers around corners and under ladders will often result in at least one parasited marine. Many other places on maps, you can put them in places a marine doesn't normally check. Dead-end hallways, dark corridoors, and above their heads, for example. And placing them at the entrance to each Hive is a cheap and effective warning. Experienced marines will not fire on Kharaa chambers, resource towers, even offensive chambers. Merely run by them, as firing on them basically puts a nice big "Eat Me" sign up for anything lurking around nearby. Then, upon reaching the Hive room itself, proceed to tear the Hive to shreds unimpeded, the Kharaa scrambling to get there in time. Unless you are attacking or under attack, you should be spinning your view in circles looking for yellow the second you hear the "The enemy approaches" sound.
I think it's wonderful that many people playing the Kharaa have found something that they enjoy and works for them. But too many are either scared or too stubborn to innovate, and try new techniques. Blithely firing acid rockets over and over again from down a hallway usually works, so why bother trying anything new? Too often I don't see Fades using Blink effectively. This weapon is a tool you can use, quite effectively, to surprise, confuse, and escape. Spamming acid rockets is fine, but with the finesse of a surgeon using a hatchet.
The current accepted building order is all well and good, but I hope that in some game, I find a team willing to try innovation and new things. Because the game has so much to offer without us trying "what works." Just because one order works does not mean any other order does not work as well, as few people have given it an honest chance.
In other words, don't be afraid to try new things. If something doesn't work, figure out why, and if it can be fixed. If something does work, file that away, and move on to something new. Perfecting only one technique for doing something is breeding in weakness.
-Ryan!
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -- Voltaire
Comments
" before NS went public."
So maybe most of the players on a public server are "n00bs". Maybe they should be able to go and run with any given order. Well, that's fine and dandy. But in the "real world" most people are more comfortable with DMS and will stumble if you, say, do something like SDM. Besides, going onto a server with a team that really wants something set up a certain way and just disregarding that is fairly rude.
As for the comment on Fades who rely on adreneline being hopeless idiots who are playing the "wrong way", I most certainly disagree with that. I can't say that I don't agree with the idea of making every shot count. However, I very much prefer to have more shots to make count. I, as many people do, use the Fade as a long-range peek-and-fire attacker. This has been proven to be brutally effective, especially when paired with a lerk's umbra support. Typically, I've found that the marine team has taken a hive by the time you have your second up and running (and if they haven't its usually a moot point because they're on the way out), and are either heavily defending it, or looking to sneak a siege base at one of your current hives.
Fades with adreneline take down turrets are range quickly. Moreover, the acid rocket allows you to target and kill marines who are defending an instalation while splashing their structures for some damage. Oftertimes while a phase gate running at a defended location, I will fire at the turret factory once every so often (about at the same rate my energy recharges so I'm always near full), wait to hear the phase gate go off, then fire a volly off at the phase gate, damaging it and killing the marine who has just stepped through. Even a lone fade can inflict considerable damage in this way.
Don't get me wrong, skulks can be absolutely brutal against enemy installations with cloaking. Using leap you can even stay cloaked and move up to and circle a turret factory. You can even slowly take it down while cloaked if its surrounded by turrets. However, retaking a fully built up hive location from the marines isn't exactly the sort of job that even a skilled cloaked skulk is really adept at, especially if reinforced by heavy marines via a phase gate.
While I'm sure that cloaked players could harass the hell out of the marines, it's a little tricky and most of the time not something that I want to demand of my teammates. Especially with the vulnerabilities of cloaking: the readily avaiable and mobile sensor sweep, the fact that observatories nuke cloaking at key locations, and the current little bug that a cloaked enemy's name pops up if you place your cursor over them.
However, this does go the other way, too. If the team was comprised by a vast majority of veteral skulkers and they wanted nothing else than to cripple the marines at the start with their cloaked antics, I'd fault any gorge who flew in his team's face and went ahead and ignored them. Sure they can't FORCE gorge X to listen to them and dictate how he plays, but he really should be trying to cooperate with them as a team.
Each of the three chamber types allow awesome upgrades and extra benifits.
If you think the sensory chamber is usless, play with it more. Flayra once built some sensory chambers during one PT while we were all yelling for defence (it was the first chamber). He pretty much said shut up and play.
It turned out to be one of the best games I've had. The sensory chamber is an awesome chamber. It gives advance warning of incoming marines, will parisite any marine who's stupid enough to touch it <b>and</b> it gives the abillity to cloak.
The other two chamber types only give 2 benifits, the sensory gives 3.
Never get upset because a Gorge places a type of chamber you didn't want. If you want that chamber first, play Gorge.
Don't give me that crap about "But if I do, there will be too many Gorges!". Aliens play for them selves - team play is only a benifit to them, not a requirement.
Go Gorge, build 3 chambers, go Skulk.
Or, just stfu and play.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'd say that anyone who took sensory first in a pub game is a damn fool. Does the phrase "tried and true" mean anything to you? Who's the fool, the one who knows how to win and does it?
Again, it must have worked great on your one game. I'm happy for you.
On the pubs however, it dosen't for the vast majority of games. This fool has reasons, and I'm sure a lot of other fools think this way.
Parasites marines that touch it? What marine touches these things, as opposed to shooting it dead? What game would NOT have them placed amidst defences, which would also be shot and ring out a nice big "structure under attack" and a nice glowing red circle on hive sight? As far as "benefeits" go, those I can live without. As for "the enemy is approaching" message, it's vague, unspecific, and won't help you get rid of them once you find them. Besides, as soon as they shoot a building you'll know on hivesight.
The upgrades are fun, but not worth it compared to others. Enhanced sight is a joke, yes a JOKE. Complete waste of an upgrade. An upgrade that would enhance marine walking, reloading, and comm sounds for aliens would be a lot more useful. Scent of Fear is alright, but the Commander drops medpacks like rain. Not saying I haven't had it useful at least once, still not worth it in the face of other upgrades. Cloaking? Great. Won't help you take out a base, or kill marines. Only get the jump on them. And bases don't need to be surprised, as they don't move. And any victory by Aliens in a pub requires an assault on a marine base. And the sooner that is done, the better.
I guess those are useful for some small private games. But the average pub brawl sees those things as expendable. And yes, I'll take movement or Defence ANY DAY over sensory. Hell I wouldn't mind if they didn't build it at all. It's simply not effective enough. The upgrades are not worth it.
As for going gorge first? I often do. And I build Defence like the rest of the winning alien community <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
This woudn't work, as the first Hive is still bound to "Sensory." The only way to unbind it would be to let it be destroyed. THEN defense chambers could be built.
Try building one of any tower outside the marine base. Build only one. That chamber will appear next to your Hive. Let the marines destroy it. That chamber still appears next to your Hive, and you cannot build different chambers.
-Ryan!
Advice is what we ask for when we already know the answer but wish we didn't.
-- Erica Jong
Huh?
And so the marines are what...defensive?
The Kharaa are not the offensive team. The Kharaa already control the map. They are defensive. Their goal should be containment of the Frontiersman. Keep them contained and/or harassed long enough to allow your gorges to spread the infestation throughout the map. Once the second Hive is online, more agressive techniques may evolve.
But saying that the Kharaa are supposed to be hyper-agressive is a quick trip down respawn lane. The marines are the agressors, who must rush to take over that first Hive, and then fight for the second. Marines playing defensively allows the Kharaa to end the game with an Onos rush. If you are Kharaa, and see a fellow skulk waiting above the doorway of an oft-travelled hallway, don't admonish him for not contributing. He is doing his job, and quite effectively at that. He will surely take out more marines, and cause more stress, anguish, and paranoia for them than any skulk who chooses to continue rushing into the marine spawn area over and over and over again.
-Ryan!
All legislation, all government, all society is founded upon the principle of mutual concession, politeness, comity, courtesy; upon these everything is based...Let him who elevates himself above humanity, above its weaknesses, its infirmities, its wants, its necessities, say, if he pleases, I will never compromise; but let no one who is not above the frailties of our common nature disdain compromises.
-- Henry Clay
As did the developers.
The only time the Kharaa take on an offensive role is when they are taking back a Hive.
And that's because they didn't play a good enough defensive role in the early game.
As a Kharaa, the marines are coming to you. Your job is to hold them back. I'd call that pretty defensive. If you fail, then the roles are switched, but for only one area. If the Kharaa succeed in taking the Hive back, then roles are again switched back until end game, fighting marines off until you have enough organization to destroy their main base.
-Ryan!
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
-- John Kenneth Galbraith
I don't NEED acid rockets very much. I blink. A LOT.
So, to wheoever said it. YES, I do take on those 4 LMG's down the end of the hall, regularily. I do it all the time, and get cries of "n1" & "gj" from my side & "OMFG YOU CHEAT!" from the 4 I just butchered. Because I didn't shoot them, I blink all the way to their end of the corridor & butcher them all while they panic. Which they ALWAYS do.
As for bases, yeah, it takes me longer to deal with them, but I can still do it. I just always go for turret factories. The Fade with either Regen or Cara, has enough survivability for me to keep dashing in with Blink, and slicing it up about 5-8 times, that I can still get out again in time.
Edit : Oh, and if you're gonna say "Well, then they repair it & you do nothing" No I'm not. I'm keeping Marines, Welders and probably some nice kit they coulda used tied up defending a base from just me. If you can't build 3rd hive now (and get the Adren you're all crying for) with no opposition, well, why are you playing again? And if they don't repair it, I've just killed a Marine base on my own. With no Adren, so shh.
As for those who said that Sensory chambers actually ability (warning/parasite) is useless, how often do you really use a Movement chamber? And to good effect? Err... not a lot, is the answer I know most people would say <i>when they're being honest</i>
(Oh, and I agree that Sensory first is a deathtrap. I just don't see why it should be third)
So, I suppose the Adren/Cloak debate hinges a lot on how you play the Fade, and how much you blink. (This gets more confusing when I say I generally take Celerity as my Movement skill anyway. That much better for chasing backpedalling marines)
The difference in opinion here is I'm saying, that Movement is valid (and good), but don't **obscenity** if you get Sensory, it doesn't cripple the Fade, just learn to play different, whilst people are telling me in reverse that Sensory is "OMG END OF GAME! GG MARINE! [retard has quit the game]" material.
(Oh, and I agree that Sensory first is a deathtrap. I just don't see why it should be third)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hear, hear.
Sometimes, a Hive will be under attack, and I will see people spawn, and then run out of the Hive room towards the red circle on their Hive sight, when two or three movement chambers are sitting right in front of them.
Putting sensory chambers around corners and under ladders will often result in at least one parasited marine. Many other places on maps, you can put them in places a marine doesn't normally check. Dead-end hallways, dark corridoors, and above their heads, for example. And placing them at the entrance to each Hive is a cheap and effective warning. Experienced marines will not fire on Kharaa chambers, resource towers, even offensive chambers. Merely run by them, as firing on them basically puts a nice big "Eat Me" sign up for anything lurking around nearby. Then, upon reaching the Hive room itself, proceed to tear the Hive to shreds unimpeded, the Kharaa scrambling to get there in time. Unless you are attacking or under attack, you should be spinning your view in circles looking for yellow the second you hear the "The enemy approaches" sound.
I think it's wonderful that many people playing the Kharaa have found something that they enjoy and works for them. But too many are either scared or too stubborn to innovate, and try new techniques. Blithely firing acid rockets over and over again from down a hallway usually works, so why bother trying anything new? Too often I don't see Fades using Blink effectively. This weapon is a tool you can use, quite effectively, to surprise, confuse, and escape. Spamming acid rockets is fine, but with the finesse of a surgeon using a hatchet.
The current accepted building order is all well and good, but I hope that in some game, I find a team willing to try innovation and new things. Because the game has so much to offer without us trying "what works." Just because one order works does not mean any other order does not work as well, as few people have given it an honest chance.
In other words, don't be afraid to try new things. If something doesn't work, figure out why, and if it can be fixed. If something does work, file that away, and move on to something new. Perfecting only one technique for doing something is breeding in weakness.
-Ryan!
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.
-- Voltaire