Will A NS1 Mod Ever Happen?

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  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind youMembers Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    edited April 2014
    Define "serious" fps, because in my definition NS2 isn't 1. In my definition it's synonymous with twitch action shooters.

    UE3 is not the worst engine out there, it has it's pros and it's cons (I still have CryEngine as my fav tho).

    Read ironhorses examples please and you will see why source cannot handle it.
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • SebSeb Melbourne, AUMembers, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, WC 2013 - Silver, Retired Community Developer Join Date: 2013-04-01 Member: 184576Posts: 515 mod
    Grissi wrote: »
    A lot of the ns1 players didn't transition over to ns2. Most of the Icelandic players (Around 70-80 that was part of my community) actually pre-ordered the game. After they tried it out I saw the comments that they didn't like what became of ns and didn't stick around. Its a shame because they were really exited about ns2 until they saw the final product.
    Even though its just one small community I'm pretty sure there were a lot of similar cases, just checking the initial pre-order numbers vs the overall playersbase from the beginning shows it.

    @Grissi‌
    You pretty much described the exact same situation with AusNS. The NS1 community across Aus was absolutely massive, in fact, the whole western side of Australia (so not our most populated cities) had LANs with up to 150 people and their own community.

    In fact there were so many Aus players that 2 communities (similar to AusNS2) formed due to differences in admins. It is a shame I wasn't around to see it in its glory days but it would have been amazing. Shame it didn't carry over into this game.
    Soylent_greenelodea
  • xDragonxDragon Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2012-04-04 Member: 149948Posts: 1,954 Fully active user
    Serious FPS = people playing for money.
    And yea, source isn't perfect but its pretty much the best in terms of lag compensated modern engines.
    Source CAN handle high movement speeds if designed properly, with high tickrates and correctly designed hitboxes, I have seen it done.
    Soylent_greenLocklear
  • MuckyMcFlyMuckyMcFly Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2012-03-19 Member: 148982Posts: 616 Fully active user
    Reading this anyone attempting to port NS1 to any new engine better have thick skin... lol :P


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  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind youMembers Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    Hmm, I would like to know exactly what part of my post above some of you disagreed with.
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind youMembers Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    xDragon wrote: »
    Serious FPS = people playing for money.
    And yea, source isn't perfect but its pretty much the best in terms of lag compensated modern engines.
    Source CAN handle high movement speeds if designed properly, with high tickrates and correctly designed hitboxes, I have seen it done.

    You have seen it done? Please show me where.
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • VetinariVetinari Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Posts: 3,469 Advanced user
    coolitic wrote: »
    Hmm, I would like to know exactly what part of my post above some of you disagreed with.
    coolitic wrote: »
    Define "serious" fps, because in my definition NS2 isn't 1. In my definition it's synonymous with twitch action shooters.

    Nuff said.
    formerly known as F0rdPrefect

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  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind youMembers Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    So because I have a different definition of serious fps? Ok then.
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • HobocopHobocop Members, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2010-11-23 Member: 75226Posts: 130
    You're implying that Quake 3 isn't and never has been a serious FPS, and you've never even expressly stated what your definition of a 'serious' FPS is.
  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Posts: 4,269 Advanced user
    As far as I am aware, the only 'serious' FPS games have been Quake and CS. They are 'serious' because there was 'serious' amounts of prize money available. Neither of them are Twitch Action Shooters.
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  • Maxx11_v2.0Maxx11_v2.0 Members Join Date: 2012-11-18 Member: 172221Posts: 274
    edited April 2014
    Soul_Rider wrote: »
    As far as I am aware, the only 'serious' FPS games have been Quake and CS. They are 'serious' because there was 'serious' amounts of prize money available. Neither of them are Twitch Action Shooters.

    @Soul_rider
    Wait, what? So what exactly is your definition of a "Twitch action shooter" if Quake, a lightning fast game at competitive level, doesn't make the list?

  • Dictator93Dictator93 Members, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2008-12-21 Member: 65833Posts: 657 Fully active user
    Soul_Rider wrote: »
    As far as I am aware, the only 'serious' FPS games have been Quake and CS. They are 'serious' because there was 'serious' amounts of prize money available. Neither of them are Twitch Action Shooters.

    @Soul_rider
    Wait, what? So what exactly is your definition of a "Twitch action shooter" if Quake, a lightning fast game at competitive level, doesn't make the list?

    Twitch shooter actually used to mean Quake and UT. But ever since COD came along the term was appropriated for the "twitch" style nature of those games (aka, walk around map, do nothing, twitch by bringing up your sights to shoot a guy, move on.... )

    Stupid, but that is what it means these days.
  • VetinariVetinari Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Posts: 3,469 Advanced user
    coolitic wrote: »
    So because I have a different definition of serious fps? Ok then.

    Exactly. And I disagree with it. Apart from that, you never stated what your definition of serious fps is, but as it doesn't include NS2, I'm going to disagree with it either way.
    formerly known as F0rdPrefect

    I am good Onos
  • LocklearLocklear [nexzil]kerrigan Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, WC 2013 - Shadow Join Date: 2012-05-01 Member: 151403Posts: 1,337 Advanced user
    The derailing and retarded arguments are real.

    A NS1 mod already happened.. just on Spark. NS2c..
    "If great visuals brings players in, great gameplay gets them to stay." - Valve
    SamusDroid
  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Posts: 4,269 Advanced user
    @Maxx11_v2.0‌

    A twitch action shooter these days is just that, nothing else other than twitch and shooting.

    While I agree Quake and UT used to be known in that style, there came along games where the tactical elements of those shooters was removed, and the games are just running around and shooting.

    Quake has a very deep tactical level to the game at the highest level. As does NS2.
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  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind youMembers Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    Quake is "lightning" fast and I think I consider it twitch-action shooter. NS2 does indeed have deep tactics (and strategy) but it isn't exactly a "twitch-action" shooter.

    Quake - deep tactics + too much commercialization = Call of Duty
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • NordicNordic Long term camping in KodiakMembers, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Posts: 4,771 Advanced user
    Can anyone find that video comparing fun vs realism in quake vs COD? I can't find it anymore. I think it is relevant to discussion.
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Posts: 4,269 Advanced user
    coolitic wrote: »
    Quake is "lightning" fast

    Really? Are you old enough to have played Quake? Here you go, watch this, Rapha vs Evil quake live duel - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBqPIPT_UBk
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    Knowledge is gained through listening, Understanding is gained through discussion.
  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind youMembers Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    edited April 2014
    I have played a bit of quake live before. Nice game, I forgot why I stopped playing.
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • fanaticfanatic This post has been edited. Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Join Date: 2003-07-23 Member: 18377Posts: 1,727
    edited April 2014
    IronHorse wrote: »
    In any case, either would be such a monumental undertaking for anyone when what you want already exists right there with NS2c.
    The only thing needed to make it more like NS1 would be unlocking the server update rates.
    As much as I appreciate xDragon's monumental work on NS2c, it really wasn't anywhere close to NS1 quality. I don't think it's even physically possible to get there while using the Spark engine, the differences compared to goldsrc are simply too large. By that I don't mean qualitatively, I simply mean that the engines are very different and thus even if every other detail of NS1 was identically reproduced, it would still feel like playing a different game.
    Post edited by fanatic on
  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributorMembers, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Posts: 8,194 admin
    edited April 2014
    @fanatic‌
    Fair enough..
    Yea I suppose the exact "feel" couldn't be replicated on an entirely different engine, no matter what.
    If you compare CS 1.6 to source or GO, they share all the same recoil and spread patterns and gravity, and unit heights etc.. but you can still feel the difference.
    QUOTE (Techercizer @ Feb 3 2012, 10:47 AM) »
    Every time you ask for troubleshooting without providing system info, ATI adds a rendering bug for an upcoming game.

    When you feel you need to be rude or angry about a game, just read these links and remember what role you are playing:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_disinhibition_effect
    http://www.eldergame.com/2008/06/taming-the-forum-tiger/
  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind youMembers Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    There are cases when a game is ported to a newer engine that it goes very well. Ever heard of Black Mesa? It's basically HL1 ported to source engine.

    However, I would imagine it took quite a bit of work as they went above and beyond of just porting the game.
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Posts: 4,269 Advanced user
    @coolitic‌ - Black Mesa on Source feels nothing like Half-Life. Source is bogged down with lighting and feels sluggish in comparison. They do not feel at all like the same engine, and this is the point.

    Every engine is unique, it is a waste of time porting a mod, because at the end of the day, most people want the exact experience they had before but with better graphics, and that is just not possible. There will always be compromise.
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  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind youMembers Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    edited April 2014
    I didn't say it felt the same, but that it was a job well done.

    Metroid Prime 1 and 2 got updated gfx, new controls, and harder difficulty in metroid prime trilogy yet it still had the same feel as the gamecube versions.
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • HobocopHobocop Members, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2010-11-23 Member: 75226Posts: 130
    edited April 2014
    Black Mesa was a complete reimagining of the original HL1 campaign. I'm not sure why you'd use that as an example instead of HL1 Source, which is an actual port. Even then, HL1 Source has a distinctly different feel even though it's the same game as the original.

    Metroid Prime 1 and 2 on the trilogy feel very, very different compared to their original GC releases purely because of the controls.
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