Balance

sahipx

Generally 5 hives/bases each map and i can tell you that if in 10 minutes marines don't have 3 of them %99 Aliens win the game. And when marines have 3 bases and aliens 2 hives then we watch balanced wars.

REASONS:

Problem-1: Marine sentries are really crap. Epic fail. 1 gorge or skulk can find blind point of battery and kill alone.
Suggestion-1: increase dmg/def for battery / sentry. Higher radius of battery.
Suggestion-2: Decrease price and structure value battery 5 res, sentry 3 res. Higher radius of battery.

Problem 2: What the hell is that whip ??? Sentry against Hydras okay. What the hell is WHIP ?? 2 gorges can destroy the marine base easily 10 seconds obs and pg down. But 5 marines no chance to kill some whips.
Suggestion-1: Remove whips forever. Seriously.
Suggestion-2: Add high power marine defending structure as whips hit to EXO!

Problem-3: Exo vs Skulk is funny. Many Exo die vs 1 skulk. Because skulk is too fast turning around exo and bite. And Marines lose a lot of games just cuz of that. Once i was going to sub from marine base in veil and 1 skulk jumped on me in the way. i could shot him when 90 armor i had. I back to base and repaired my exo and lost a lot of time. Tell me if 1 marine can do the it on Onos 1 vs 1. No way..
Suggestion-1: Exo walking has a killer dmg on skulks.
Suggestion-2: When exo click space, it should burn/dmg aliens under himself.

Problem-4: Gorges Bile bomb dmg on marine structures are terribly high. Marine obs and pg die and marines lose game too fast cuz of that. Sometimes 1 gorge can destroy a good game for marines if commander miss.
Suggestion-1: Decrease bile bomb damage by %50.
Suggestion-2: Increase Marine structures (obs, ip, pg) by +%200. 1 stupid skulk can kill pg or obs in seconds but 3 marines can't kill 1 gorge tunnel in 30 seconds.


All changes above make marine more powerful than aliens but some of them i believe i am right to complain.

Have a nice day everyone.

Zalamael

Did you know that the Flamethrower can be used to burn the bile off your structures and Exosuits? And it can also be used to shut down Whips, as well as draining the energy of Aliens.

sahipx

Zalamael wrote: »

Did you know that the Flamethrower can be used to burn the bile off your structures and Exosuits? And it can also be used to shut down Whips, as well as draining the energy of Aliens.

Marines are waiting to use flame for 20 minutes hold resources and buy it with jet pack then just lose the flamethrower that's all. When they back to rifle they become shit. But for aliens even you die from onos, skulk can kill exo alone ^^ Whips hit too much damage to Exosuits and marines dude.

maD_maX_

Well you seem new here, so ill be the first to say GL here are the responses your likely to get...

1. dont build sentrys
2. dont walk up to the whip, use those guns and shoot from accross the room
3. buy a JP
4. spread out structures, dont place in doorways, and beacons are useful


In all seriousness

1. Sentries can be built with overlaping fields of fire that cover themselves and the battery, but many coms chose to aim them all down the hallway that is most dangerous (expecting marines to cover them)
2. Whips have a very short attack radius that is defeated by ranged weapons, When you push into a hive DO NOT RUN UP TO THE HIVE!!! cant stand this, every PUB game half the players run right up to the hive get hit by whips skulks.. and die. stand on the far side of the room and shoot, positioning is everything for marines if your on the other side of the room skulks have to move to you exposing themselves giving you time to kill them. when you stand next to the hive you risk you take any postion advantage away, you allow aliens to heal during combat, and of coarse that whips going to B-slap you. Whips have relitivly low HP and can be shot down if there an issue
3. Skulk Vs Exo... again positioning, if your walking the map alone as an EXO if you dont have amazing aim your the biggest target the entire alien team is saying "lone exo in stability" and your going to die... so stick with a team if i go exo i go railgun B/C i can shoot through my team and kill the pesky skulks.
4. This is not an issue for good coms so unfortunately i have to say LTP I hate it when people say LTP, but really if 2 gorges with bile come in your base its ok to beacon, There are also little tricks to learn like beaconing from a remote location, nano shielding, and as always positioning (of structures in this case). The ninja attack goes both ways killing a shell, killing an OBs


In general this is another sale week, so there will be a higher number of Green Tags expect some silliness.

sahipx

Thanks for your answer madmax. But still 1 thing same. Aliens win game %100 when they have 3 hives. But Marines lose game %100 if they dont have 3 base in a game.

I am not new dude. i am playing since a month and i am a ns1 player too.

Nordic

Aliens get their end game tech on three hives. Marines don't even need the third chair to fully tech up. The only reason they are holding that tech point is to deny aliens the third hive. The game is asymmetrical for the most part by design which seems to be the core of some of your complaints.

You may of been playing a month, and have played ns1, but you are still relatively new and based off your questions still have plenty to learn. I have 900 hours in Ns2 and I am still learning. That is one of the great things about ns2. You are never done getting better.



On a kind of side note. The type of thread you just made is not uncommon, by that I do not mean there is anything wrong with it. Here is another thread complaining marines are too strong from earlier this month. http://forums.unknownworlds.com/discussion/132576/i-can-t-understand-ns2-very-basics-not-getting-done-right/p1.

From that thread a comment about exos for contrast.

[/How for F sake can they gun you down at 0 range when you're climbing on their exo canopy? It makes freakin no sense. Exo is super deadly from far, but they should NEVER be able to gun you down when you're climbing on it. In that case only fist should kill the alien and if it's a dual exo, tough luck. You have dual the ranged power to make sure aliens don't even get up to you... but now you really have to be a super kick ass skulk master to take down an exo driver who isn't a total noob and keeps some of his range.quote]

Kamamura

Skulk being strong against exo is a good thing, because exo kills everything large and slow very fast (onos). Exos are supposed to work with a team.

joshhh

A few things to point out.
-Turrets are not meant to hold off aliens alone. They are 'support' structures to delay aliens till a marine gets to the point. NS2 is not tower defense.
- Whips. Don't even want to start talking about them.
- Exos should not be alone. They are extremely powerful against larger lifeforms (and technically against skulks too but that depends on aim.)
- Gorge bile. Well I read that you only played NS2 for a month or two. Gorge bile does a fraction of what it used to. It's in a pretty good spot too. P.S. I think if you shoot the gorges, the bile stops.

sahipx

Thanks for answers guys I respect you all and i accept the system how it is. I just shared my ideas about ns2. 1 Gorge can take 150 resources worth marine structures in some minutes and that's not balanced for me. And If alien have 2 hives in a map game has a balance. But When aliens have 3 hives, marines have NO CHANCE %100 they lose.

After everything i can tell that unknownworlds did awesome game after years. And they are working really good. Thanks for this game and have a nice work..

Have a nice day everyone

Melancor

"In some minutes" is plenty of time for marines to react. Also, 3 hives are by no means a 100% win quite yet. However, if one team dominates the map to the point where they can take 3 bases (and the enemy can't), they are likely to win. Seems normal to me.

Turbine

While I agree Exxos are weak now, although too easy to get, JP's have become OP since Reinforced. They doubled the fuel, and immediately upon touching the ground they recharge at a fast rate. Personally I'd have made them more powerful, but instead require resource being carried back to base, limiting the number of Exxos at a time.

Whip rushes, much like shotgun rushes, GL rushes & Gorge are all extremely destructive.

Gorge bile bombs are less destructive than a bunch of marines with jetpacks and grenade launchers. Gorge's are slow to run, they also have little adrenaline. Whereas marine's with jetpacks can fly around shooting where little can kill them and even land ontop of the hive to refuel and reload.

dePARA

If you see a red dot on the map walking to base use your mic and tell everyone that there is something in there.
Try your "OP bile rushes" against a good responding marineteam. No chance.
You do some damage for sure, but not enough to kill an base alone.

The key is to have some "phase-gate hopper". They stay near the gates to defend stuff.
On most pub games you see a lemming horde of marines walking in ONE direction.
Teamplay isnt to stay in a large group as possible, teamplay is to have attacker, defender and builder.
And its communication. A team that talk and coordinate attacks has a better chance to win

The problem is that:
- most Marines didnt use the map
- didnt use the mic to warn players

The game has a good balance in my opinion
It was an long way and some things the OP mentioned where in the game ages ago, like the turretstalemates. Thank god they are gone.
If an Exo is getting killed by one single skulk, no balance change on earth can help this marine.

DC_Darkling

welcome..

* Problem-1: Marine sentries are really crap. Epic fail. 1 gorge or skulk can find blind point of battery and kill alone.
- They are ment to do chip damage and help the marines, not be fully automated 'dont ever check here' defenses.

* Problem 2: What the hell is that whip ??? Sentry against Hydras okay. What the hell is WHIP ?? 2 gorges can destroy the marine base easily 10 seconds obs and pg down. But 5 marines no chance to kill some whips.
- A whip does nothing if not on infestation, kill the cyst close to it first. Also what they said, shoot from afar or run past on full health. A whip does nothing if you wont let it stop you.

* Problem-3: Exo vs Skulk is funny. Many Exo die vs 1 skulk. Because skulk is too fast turning around exo and bite. And Marines lose a lot of games just cuz of that. Once i was going to sub from marine base in veil and 1 skulk jumped on me in the way. i could shot him when 90 armor i had. I back to base and repaired my exo and lost a lot of time. Tell me if 1 marine can do the it on Onos 1 vs 1. No way..
- No marine should ever be alone. Exo's are glass canons. High damage, low survival rate. You would be surprised how fast a onos dies if a weapon3 weapon is getting emptied into one.

* Problem-4: Gorges Bile bomb dmg on marine structures are terribly high. Marine obs and pg die and marines lose game too fast cuz of that. Sometimes 1 gorge can destroy a good game for marines if commander miss.
- Dont get base rushed & spread structures. (It is a commander error). For comparison.. a Exo with a minute of 'me time' on a hive ALSO means that the hive will be byebye.

reeql

From alien side i see diffrent problems:

1. Jetpack madness - after Reinforced they seem to be op because of "infinity" fuel bar, its huge recharge and low cost. It feels like marines dont need to land. Killing an pro sg+jp rine is pain in the ass for any life form.

Solution:
- Reduce fuel bar or recharge rate of fuel ... or
- Make fuel to start refiling after some time on the ground (lets say 3-5s) ... or
- Tweak the gorge web mechanics to make them useful in the game. Now its almost never used because of late tech and high cost.

2. Onos survivability - onos has huge troubles to get close to marines without getting killed. Focus fire on onos is consumigh hp so fast... They have to hide around corners and wait for their victims like skulks. Problem evolves on bigger servers and when exos and jp appears. Killing even single exo without suport 1v1 is huge problem. Anyway its hard to see lone exos. Anyway bone shield works now like: "hey i will use bone shield and i will stay here and you will focus fire me later after you will reload". Come on!

Solution:
- Change exos damage type vs onos to normal (now is heavy) ... or
- Allow onos to move slowly while using bone shield ability

3. Fade stamina management - Do i have to say anything is this case? Every fade action consumes huge ammount of energy. Fades play without adrenalin perk is damn hard even for moving and just swiping. How about later abilities? Forget about it, no stamina for it. Ok you dont want to overpower fades, but now lerk seems to be more useful than fade. Fade now cant destroy structures, has power management problems with moving and killing, even fades blink vanish ability was removed. Thats too much for lifeform that costs 40res + 5 per up. Fade needs more love from balance tweakers ...

Solution:
- Reduce stamina cost of vortex and stab ability to make them useful without adrenalin up ... or
- Raise fades stamina regen ... or
- Add metabolize ability that recharges your energy and hp on use (from ns1)

... or ... do nothing ... and let the flame war Begin ! ...