F0rdPrefect's questions on Spark (2 pending)

Vetinari

Formerly: Courtyard combat suggestion
First, let me say I have no idea of mapping/modding whatsoever.

I just think, the "new" (the update has been around for a while) courtyard would be an awesome place to fight in in combat.
Maybe someone could make a combat map out of it?

edit: This is now a thread for my silly questions about the editor. If you want to contribute to a combat map based on docking, see here.

WhiteDevil

Yes, courtyard.





what?

ObliviousSight

I'm guessing you mean Courtyard from Docking? It could make quite a good focal point for a combat map I guess, though there are mappers far better informed on combat than I.

Vetinari

ObliviousSight wrote: »

I'm guessing you mean Courtyard from Docking?

Yes, there aren't any other courtyards in the game^^

Probably should have mentioned it, though.

Howser

It's all very well posting an idea for someone else to do, but there's no excuses not to have a go yourself. Spark edit is super easy to learn and everyone on the mapping forums is helpful and welcoming.
You can open up official level files the editor. All map files are found in steamapps/common/natural-selection 2/ns2/maps/

Vetinari

Howser wrote: »

It's all very well posting an idea for someone else to do, but there's no excuses not to have a go yourself. Spark edit is super easy to learn and everyone on the mapping forums is helpful and welcoming.
You can open up official level files the editor. All map files are found in steamapps/common/natural-selection 2/ns2/maps/

Okay. Maybe I'll give it a go during vacation. Any tutorial-tips, or other tips to learn?

Howser

pretty much the whole mapping forums. there's a wealth of information scattered all over the forum. use search on the mapping sub forum for 'tutorial'.

ObliviousSight

A good place to start is in this thread here -->forums.unknownworlds.com/discussion/129290/ns2-mapping-guides-and-resources#latest But people will answer any questions you may have about the editor.

Edit: Because I'm bad at supplying links apparently. (Extra bad, link works now.)

Vetinari

I'll give it a read.

edit: Weird bug: If I click the link, it just reloads the page. Copy/Paste works, though.

edit2: If I want to create a rectangle, in a map which is completely empty, is there some way to create it not RIGHT IN MA FACE, but, say, 10 metres below

edit3: And how do I set the mouse sensitivity for right-click movement?

edit4: Guess I'm learning mapping now. My very first try is in the attachment. Performance sucks, neither locations nor minimap nor commander view work. Suggestions?

Vetinari

Meh. New post for file attachment.

edit: "Uploaded file type is not allowed"...

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/w2q52ydym0cbz2y/cfG3BIeyiC

Howser

keep at it. have fun and experiment. I wouldn't try a build a map at this point in your education. Just cut some shapes, drop some lights, play around. You wont be able to break much just be clicking stuff.
It'll take a few weeks of playing and watching tutorials to really get a good understanding of the editor, but its well worth it.

Vetinari

Just tried to get some working stuff^^

Do you need anything, apart from two techpoints and the ns2_rules entity, anything to open the map?

WorthyRival

You need.....

2 techpoints entites
ns2_gamerules entity
lights so you can see. Or ambient light.
A ready room off to the side of the map with at least one ready room spawn entity.



Not needed but help...

team join entities in your ready room.
OCC for map performance.
Mini-Map entity

If it's a combat map load the combat mod in the game menu under mods
click on combat mod change to yes on the far right click restart.
Do the same to disable.

Vetinari

Thanks for the tip!

I tried creating a minimap - the minimap entity has to include the whole map, except for the ready room, right?
Didn't work for some reason.
Also, commander view didn't work.
Any popular bugs/newbie errors/other that lead to this?

Howser

make sure you set this up and run it to run your map -http://forums.unknownworlds.com/discussion/119239/one-click-map-testing-within-spark/p1
Also commander_camera ent should be placed on the floor in the 3d view. It'll be floating high above the floor but thats fine. Leave at default settings.

Vetinari

I already use it :>

edit: Just took a look at ns2_sample. Neither minimap nor commander view are working there for me - I don't think it's due to to the map being outdated, as I get the same problem if I try to create a new map.
Do you need anything else apart from minimap extents to create a minimap?

WorthyRival

Your mini-map has to be a perfect square otherwise it's causes issues. easy enough to do just hold SHIFT when using the resize tool. this uniformly resizes the entity or prop and even geometry. A very handy feature to know.

So delete your old mini-map entity and create a new one so you start with a perfect cube again and resize it from there.

After getting it right I recommend adding the mini-map to a layer and then hiding it as you may accidently select it and move it or delete it as you continue to map.

Spark does not auto create the mini map for you. You have to open a silly DOS window and execute a silly .exe to run it.

Luckly a genius here in the community created a 1 click map testing shortcut that does all that work for you. I can't stress enough, If you map in spark how you need this great tool.

Found here: http://forums.unknownworlds.com/discussion/119239/one-click-map-testing-within-spark/p1

Commander view requires the mini-map and height-map overviews. Which when created using the tool above can then be found in the overviews folder in you map folder.

For commander views depending on the size of your map you need at least 1 commander camera entity.
Best placed in the centre of you map. Creating a second camera and moving it up or down creates a zoom feature when in commander view. So if you have differing heights in your geometry you may need to do this.

The commander camera entity is not required for combat.

Vetinari

Thank you!

I already figured something of this out by myself, but the square-necessity of minimap extents was the missing link.

Again: Thank you!

Vetinari

Okay, I ran into some problems here.

I'm on vacation and finally managed to get spark running. I am currently trying to "remix" docking to get some first results

I don't understand, how the create faces tool works.
I successfully swapped central access and try to reattach it to the rest of the map. Two lines are parallel on the floor, on both sides (the indepent part of the map and the rest of the map). I connected the ends of these lines using the line tool, creating a rectangle (parallelogramm). Selecting the lines (and the vertices) I could not use the create face tool to create a face.

I experimented some more. If I create a rectangle, using the rectangle tool, and delete the face, I can create a new one selecting either the lines around it or the lines around it and the vertices.
So this works fine.

Then I took some random (but simple) face from a different part of the map. I was not able to recreate it whatsoever.

Any help?

QwiXXeR

2 possibilities

1 ) Your joins where the vertices are (Points at end of line) are sitting on top of each other and you need to weld them together

2 ) You can only create a face etc when you have the "Select Tool" selected, default (Space)

Vetinari

I think I found the problem. When I connect the vertices with the line tool, it doesn't connect the vertices, but creates at least one new vertice for the line.

Is there any way to select vertices and generate a line between them, or another workaround for this issue?

Btw, I tried the same on some simpler geometries, and there it worked fine.

QwiXXeR

If your vetices are slightly off grid, when you draw your line it may be snapping to horizontal/vertical line, thus not actually snapping to your other vertice.
Drag select the vertices, snap to grid then weld together

Vetinari

What does coarsen/refine grid do exactly?
How do the different snap to options work?

ObliviousSight

Somebody will correct me if I'm wrong but I think:

- Coarsen/refine grid increases/decreases the size of the grid units allowing larger or finer snapping on the grid.
- Snap to grid snaps all selected geo to the grid you currently have set.
- Snap to grid x/y/z snaps all selected geo to the grid on that particular axis
- Snap to min. grid snaps all selected geo to the 1 unit grid (this is useful for when your verts are off grid and you don't want to distort your geo.)

Never used increase/decrease angle so can't really say about those.

Mendasp

Increase/Decrease angle is so they lock to X degrees while rotating (ie. increments of 22.5º, 45º, 90º, etc).

Vetinari

Should there be a sign next to the options when using the "advanced" snap-options? Because I only get one for "Snap to grid".

ObliviousSight

No there shouldn't be. That tick next to snap to grid just indicates that snap to grid is active. You can switch it off and go completely freehand and eyeball everything, but for me that way madness lies.

Edit: As an aside, down in the bottom right corner the editor displays and allows you to change your current snap settings.

Vetinari

Thank you, will try it later.

Vetinari

Is there a way to select/delete all elements of a layer at once?
edit: And is it possible to copy/paste from one instance of spark into another?

Also, can someone provide me with a download to docking, please? I accidentally saved over the original file X_X

This stuff usually doesn't happen to me.

Mendasp

1.- Click the layer then click the mouse cursor icon at the bottom of the layers list.
2.- Yes, open the editor twice, copy in one, paste in the other.
3.- Right click in Natural Selection 2 in Steam, Propierties, Local files, Verify integrity. This will recheck the entire game and restore (download) the correct version of docking.

Vetinari

Can't - the router on this campground won't open any ports except for those needed for surfing and emails...