<!--quoteo(post=2055477:date=Jan 3 2013, 02:56 PM:name=Soylent_green)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Soylent_green @ Jan 3 2013, 02:56 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2055477"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No, we do know. If you peek around a corner it will take up to 100 ms(next occlusion update) until players, props and other objects suddenly pop into existance.
Culling too little is just a performance problem, culling too much results in hideous graphical artifacts. I remember an anti-cheat server plugin for HL mods that would not send player positions of players that could not see each other on the server, improving upon the lax PVIS system used for this by default. Regardless of having latency <10 ms and interp set to 0.05 it's incredibly distracting. And this was just players, not models.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're right things <a href="http://http.developer.nvidia.com/GPUGems/gpugems_ch29.html" target="_blank">will pop into existence</a> when occlusion isn't done every frame. That's basically what the OP said. Time based throttling or a quick flip flop (on/off/on/off e.g. 50% execution per pass) would be a simple test that could yield new insights into the culling performance or any portion of the game logic for that matter, but I'd guess they've already considered/implemented it somewhere. Thread cooperation and execution time can be difficult to understand as a whole model running on shared computer hardware; profiling and throttling key points in the logic are just easy ways of finding your way through the complexity and exposing possible areas of optimization (from my now ancient experience in gamedev). I ended up using both because viewing the profiler stats while throttling portions of the logic can be useful.
<!--quoteo(post=2055483:date=Jan 3 2013, 03:03 PM:name=Soylent_green)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Soylent_green @ Jan 3 2013, 03:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2055483"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Ragdolls and some other such effects are client-side only since they don't hinder player movement and it doesn't matter if they behave slightly differently on every player's screen.
The physical effects that are important are player movement, bullets etc. Those are already interpolated/extrapolated or in the case that the client is causing them, predicted by the client.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sounds mostly right about the ragdoll physics and I should not have said ALL physics are done at the server as well as client (I have zero experience with Spark), however I *think* the dead bodies still have collision bounding boxes that need to be persisted by the server and agreed upon by all clients. Meaning even if a client did not witness the ragdoll effect it will still know about the dead body, so the server is still doing a simulation but probably to a lesser degree (throttling the same physics code as the client perhaps), maintaining the "true" game state and constantly keeping it in sync with clients.
I could be wrong and wouldn't mind if you pointed that out. You seem to have a lot of gamedev knowledge, PM me some of your projects.
IronHorseDeveloper, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributorJoin Date: 2010-05-08Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
<!--quoteo(post=2054147:date=Jan 1 2013, 05:42 AM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Jan 1 2013, 05:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2054147"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If only LUA code could be offloaded onto the GPU, this would fix a lot of problems.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Or if someone took the time to convert all performance demanding LUA into C. <a href="http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee" target="_blank">http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee</a>
LUA is useful for modding and for quick iterations during development.. but i think any end user /customer would be way happier with a faster compiled language yielding better performance. I wish there would be an easy convert button, so that you could keep modding beyond just a numbers table like balance.lua, and yet when it was time to publish your mod or next patch of ns2, you would convert to faster compiled code.
:shrug: Some of you here know enough about coding and optimizing that you should take some time and submit some patches :)
The simple response to this is NS2 engine is crap. After playing planetside 2 I'm not sure how any modern day game can have hit registration problems. I've gone into fights with probably 200+ people in Aircraft, tanks, and ground units all of which can be a different variant. The only thing I have noticed in PS2 is the rendering in huge battles is throttled down but seldom have I seen the hit registration problems I have seen in NS2.
<!--quoteo(post=2057182:date=Jan 6 2013, 07:47 PM:name=ironhorse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ironhorse @ Jan 6 2013, 07:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057182"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Or if someone took the time to convert all performance demanding LUA into C. <a href="http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee" target="_blank">http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee</a>
LUA is useful for modding and for quick iterations during development.. but i think any end user /customer would be way happier with a faster compiled language yielding better performance. I wish there would be an easy convert button, so that you could keep modding beyond just a numbers table like balance.lua, and yet when it was time to publish your mod or next patch of ns2, you would convert to faster compiled code.
:shrug: Some of you here know enough about coding and optimizing that you should take some time and submit some patches :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's kind of a cool utility you found there. I agree that the majority of the game doesn't need to be done in LUA though. It's kind of cool for modders, but really if you want modders to flourish it takes giving out the SDK. I played around with mods for HL1 and that was all C++ and it was fast. Other thing about it was it was damn near universal. Lua is kind of like the linux of programming languages to me. It's free and open source and it has potential but at the end of the day it's more of a hassle than windows.
<!--quoteo(post=2057192:date=Jan 6 2013, 08:28 PM:name=Lastdon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lastdon @ Jan 6 2013, 08:28 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057192"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The simple response to this is NS2 engine is crap. After playing planetside 2 I'm not sure how any modern day game can have hit registration problems. I've gone into fights with probably 200+ people in Aircraft, tanks, and ground units all of which can be a different variant. The only thing I have noticed in PS2 is the rendering in huge battles is throttled down but seldom have I seen the hit registration problems I have seen in NS2.
Ohh yea it is a free to play game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And to this... If only PS2 had 1/8 of the gameplay that NS2 does. PS2 is 0 fun unless you're in a big group and have a clue what you're doing. And even when you do it takes what 2 days to unlock 1 weapon for 1 character for 1 class?
<!--quoteo(post=2057182:date=Jan 7 2013, 02:47 PM:name=ironhorse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ironhorse @ Jan 7 2013, 02:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057182"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Or if someone took the time to convert all performance demanding LUA into C. <a href="http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee" target="_blank">http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee</a>
LUA is useful for modding and for quick iterations during development.. but i think any end user /customer would be way happier with a faster compiled language yielding better performance. I wish there would be an easy convert button, so that you could keep modding beyond just a numbers table like balance.lua, and yet when it was time to publish your mod or next patch of ns2, you would convert to faster compiled code.
:shrug: Some of you here know enough about coding and optimizing that you should take some time and submit some patches :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll admit I didn't read everything on that page, but if I understand correctly, that program just converts LUA to C directly...why hasn't this been done yet.
<!--quoteo(post=2057198:date=Jan 6 2013, 10:46 PM:name=Davil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Davil @ Jan 6 2013, 10:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057198"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And to this... If only PS2 had 1/8 of the gameplay that NS2 does. PS2 is 0 fun unless you're in a big group and have a clue what you're doing. And even when you do it takes what 2 days to unlock 1 weapon for 1 character for 1 class?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Did you really just say 1/8 the game play. Please elaborate on all this game content you talk about. Aliens 5 classes, Marines 3 variants. LoL really any game above 6 v 6 are just lag fests beyond 10 mins. Ohh, you are right that infestation is defiantly worth 7/8 the game since it serves no purpose besides fancy scenery.
<!--quoteo(post=2057627:date=Jan 8 2013, 11:18 AM:name=Lastdon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lastdon @ Jan 8 2013, 11:18 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057627"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Did you really just say 1/8 the game play. Please elaborate on all this game content you talk about. Aliens 5 classes, Marines 3 variants. LoL really any game above 6 v 6 are just lag fests beyond 10 mins. Ohh, you are right that infestation is defiantly worth 7/8 the game since it serves no purpose besides fancy scenery.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually it ah...defines where aliens can build and when....*scratches head* sorry man.
<!--quoteo(post=2057627:date=Jan 7 2013, 04:18 PM:name=Lastdon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lastdon @ Jan 7 2013, 04:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057627"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Did you really just say 1/8 the game play. Please elaborate on all this game content you talk about. Aliens 5 classes, Marines 3 variants. LoL really any game above 6 v 6 are just lag fests beyond 10 mins. Ohh, you are right that infestation is defiantly worth 7/8 the game since it serves no purpose besides fancy scenery.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Defiantly, you keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means...
Anyway, let's see Planetside 2... It's F2P, so therefore plenty of bugs. The "many weapons" are all just the same model and you have to pay for different art or devote several days to unlocking it for 1 character, for 1 class, for 1 weapon, yea that seems fun. All the "customization" in PS2 is garbage, flat out garbage. I could pick up NS2 and play it and have fun without having to watch a youtube video on how to play it.
But tell you what why does PS2 only have 1/8 the gameplay? From the moment you start the game, you're going to be lost as ###### even if you're a veteran from the previous games. You pick a race, pick 1 of 3 heads and you're suddenly careening to the middle of a fight where you will just repeatedly die with no clue wtf is going on. At least UWE took the time to incorporate youtube videos into the game in case you are lost. With PS2 wtf are you really even doing? Running around shooting at ###### until you die is not fun in the slightest. NS2 actually has like a clear purpose that it states at the beginning of the game. How people sit there grinding kills for days upon days to unlock 1 stupid weapon that is barely better than the last is beyond me. But go have fun with that.
<!--quoteo(post=2057627:date=Jan 7 2013, 07:18 PM:name=Lastdon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lastdon @ Jan 7 2013, 07:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057627"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Did you really just say 1/8 the game play. Please elaborate on all this game content you talk about. Aliens 5 classes, Marines 3 variants. LoL really any game above 6 v 6 are just lag fests beyond 10 mins. Ohh, you are right that infestation is defiantly worth 7/8 the game since it serves no purpose besides fancy scenery.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lagfest beyond 10 minutes in servers greater than 6v6? I don't think so.
I play on 24 person servers just fine without any lag. Obviously, don't pick those 24 person servers that having a low performance percentage. My computer isn't that great and it handles that many people in NS2 just fine, even in late game.
Infestation serves a few purposes:
1) Obviously needed so Alien comm can place buildings.
2) Serves as a visual aid so people know which areas are alien or marine controlled.
3) Visuals. It's amazing to me to see a room basically transformed into something completely different. No other game can accomplish this.
4) Aliens have inreased health regeneration when around infestation.
5) The way infestation spreads makes it so that the Alien commander is forced to more strategically think about where he should expand.
6) Infestation can be used tactically by expanding into an area (such as a marine outpost/base, then shifting over a bunch of whips).
I played PS2 before I got NS2 and there are certainly a number of problems with that game and I wouldn't say the gameplay is any better than NS2'.
<!--quoteo(post=2057760:date=Jan 8 2013, 12:33 AM:name=Res)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Res @ Jan 8 2013, 12:33 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057760"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Lagfest beyond 10 minutes in servers greater than 6v6? I don't think so.
I play on 24 person servers just fine without any lag. Obviously, don't pick those 24 person servers that having a low performance percentage. My computer isn't that great and it handles that many people in NS2 just fine, even in late game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I have yet to see a 24p server maintain 30 ticks late game. The closest I've seen is National Gaming and a Wolf something server which dips into 12 or 15 as opposed to single digits for other 24p servers
<!--quoteo(post=2057182:date=Jan 6 2013, 11:47 PM:name=ironhorse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ironhorse @ Jan 6 2013, 11:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057182"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Or if someone took the time to convert all performance demanding LUA into C. <a href="http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee" target="_blank">http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee</a>
LUA is useful for modding and for quick iterations during development.. but i think any end user /customer would be way happier with a faster compiled language yielding better performance. I wish there would be an easy convert button, so that you could keep modding beyond just a numbers table like balance.lua, and yet when it was time to publish your mod or next patch of ns2, you would convert to faster compiled code.
:shrug: Some of you here know enough about coding and optimizing that you should take some time and submit some patches :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We can't submit patches since none of the code involved in this is opensource. That's the engine source, not the game source. Well, Max did opensource Rocket, his Lua interpreter, but I doubt the code he put on github is all that similar to what's in NS2 anymore; the stuff on github hasn't been updated in 6 months.
<!--quoteo(post=2057808:date=Jan 8 2013, 12:10 AM:name=Makenshi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Makenshi @ Jan 8 2013, 12:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057808"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I have yet to see a 24p server maintain 30 ticks late game. The closest I've seen is National Gaming and a Wolf something server which dips into 12 or 15 as opposed to single digits for other 24p servers<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> KKG servers seem to run very good Not sure what tick rate they are running late game but I rarely have lag issues on them
<!--quoteo(post=2057808:date=Jan 7 2013, 11:10 PM:name=Makenshi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Makenshi @ Jan 7 2013, 11:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057808"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I have yet to see a 24p server maintain 30 ticks late game. The closest I've seen is National Gaming and a Wolf something server which dips into 12 or 15 as opposed to single digits for other 24p servers<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea I definitely haven't seen lag problems on most 24p servers i've been on. There was 1 or 2 I tried that shouldn't even be running 16 slots though.
<!--quoteo(post=2057752:date=Jan 7 2013, 11:24 PM:name=Davil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Davil @ Jan 7 2013, 11:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057752"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Defiantly, you keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means...
Anyway, let's see Planetside 2... It's F2P, so therefore plenty of bugs. The "many weapons" are all just the same model and you have to pay for different art or devote several days to unlocking it for 1 character, for 1 class, for 1 weapon, yea that seems fun. All the "customization" in PS2 is garbage, flat out garbage. I could pick up NS2 and play it and have fun without having to watch a youtube video on how to play it.
But tell you what why does PS2 only have 1/8 the gameplay? From the moment you start the game, you're going to be lost as ###### even if you're a veteran from the previous games. You pick a race, pick 1 of 3 heads and you're suddenly careening to the middle of a fight where you will just repeatedly die with no clue wtf is going on. At least UWE took the time to incorporate youtube videos into the game in case you are lost. With PS2 wtf are you really even doing? Running around shooting at ###### until you die is not fun in the slightest. NS2 actually has like a clear purpose that it states at the beginning of the game. How people sit there grinding kills for days upon days to unlock 1 stupid weapon that is barely better than the last is beyond me. But go have fun with that.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I asked you to please lay out all of this so called content you were talking about. While in all actuality I can think of far more content that was removed from the NS series then newly implemented content. Anyways, pretty sure my response to the OP was how the NS 2 engine is crap, which it is. Then i went on to state how I can play another FPS which has at least 10X the amount of people and not experience the hit reg problems that this game has. The NS 2 community has died down for a reason. The game is bland and has very little depth to it out side of all the hype/content you have made up in your head.
<!--quoteo(post=2057668:date=Jan 7 2013, 07:44 PM:name=Ghosthree3)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ghosthree3 @ Jan 7 2013, 07:44 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057668"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Actually it ah...defines where aliens can build and when....*scratches head* sorry man.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> LoL, no infestation just limits the aliens tactics, the same way the powernodes and tech points limit marine tactics. If it provided benefits, which was the original plan for it then it would add some depth but UWE removed the upgrade paths. This pretty much makes it nothing more the a drag on game performance.
<!--quoteo(post=2059186:date=Jan 11 2013, 09:33 AM:name=Lastdon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lastdon @ Jan 11 2013, 09:33 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2059186"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I asked you to please lay out all of this so called content you were talking about. While in all actuality I can think of far more content that was removed from the NS series then newly implemented content. Anyways, pretty sure my response to the OP was how the NS 2 engine is crap, which it is. Then i went on to state how I can play another FPS which has at least 10X the amount of people and not experience the hit reg problems that this game has. The NS 2 community has died down for a reason. The game is bland and has very little depth to it out side of all the hype/content you have made up in your head.
NS 2 engine is up there with the Doom 3 engine.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Planetside2 has its fair share of gameplay-breaking issues. I've personally had problems where the whole world to flick between visible and invisible few times per second and I had to close the game because I couldn't look at it any longer, players disappear right infront of me, players appearing to continue their last known movements off cliffs, the game almost locks up to <1 fps now and then, and I can't use air vehicles because the game stutters if you move around too fast.
<!--quoteo(post=2059190:date=Jan 11 2013, 11:40 AM:name=Lastdon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lastdon @ Jan 11 2013, 11:40 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2059190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->LoL, no infestation just limits the aliens tactics, the same way the powernodes and tech points limit marine tactics.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ye, the same way resource costs limit alien and marine tactics.
<!--quoteo(post=2059024:date=Jan 10 2013, 06:14 PM:name=flyjum)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (flyjum @ Jan 10 2013, 06:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2059024"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->KKG servers seem to run very good Not sure what tick rate they are running late game but I rarely have lag issues on them<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea I found this website that keep track of tickrates and such. <a href="http://ns2servers.devicenull.org/" target="_blank">http://ns2servers.devicenull.org/</a> From what I saw yesterday, only KKG, National Gaming, and Wolf Pack Roam sky is able to somewhat keep a decent tick late game with 1k+ entities. At that point though, even those servers dip down to teens for tickrate, which is better than most other servers crawling along at single digit ticks.
<!--quoteo(post=2059190:date=Jan 11 2013, 04:40 AM:name=Lastdon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lastdon @ Jan 11 2013, 04:40 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2059190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->LoL, no infestation just limits the aliens tactics, the same way the powernodes and tech points limit marine tactics. If it provided benefits, which was the original plan for it then it would add some depth but UWE removed the upgrade paths. This pretty much makes it nothing more the a drag on game performance.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why are you even here, Lastdon? You don't like the game? Don't play it and don't waste your time and ours posting unhelpful nonsense on these forums.
Shut the door on your way out.
(PS I played planetside 2 in the beta for a while, but since NS2 came out, I've only played PS2 once and found it very boring. I can satisfy my KDR needs in NS2 which, in addition to the FPS side, gives much more rewarding tactical and team-based play experiences - IMHO).
<!--quoteo(post=2059186:date=Jan 11 2013, 01:33 AM:name=Lastdon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lastdon @ Jan 11 2013, 01:33 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2059186"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I asked you to please lay out all of this so called content you were talking about. While in all actuality I can think of far more content that was removed from the NS series then newly implemented content. Anyways, pretty sure my response to the OP was how the NS 2 engine is crap, which it is. Then i went on to state how I can play another FPS which has at least 10X the amount of people and not experience the hit reg problems that this game has. The NS 2 community has died down for a reason. The game is bland and has very little depth to it out side of all the hype/content you have made up in your head.
NS 2 engine is up there with the Doom 3 engine.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> You're just trying to troll and I'm done feeding you.
I have a really hard time understanding why they wouldn't use a rooming or baked PVS system here. This is the HALLWAY game. It's perfect for that sort of setup.
In Max's forever old post he notes traditional culling solutions aren't ideal for outdoor rooms. There are what? TWO of those in NS2 (landing pad and crevice), and Crevice should get a serious edit so Lerks can't hang outside of draw range and invis-a-spike. This concern seems so unwarranted.
Clamping the cull update can work, but you have to add some fudge factor to what's getting drawn. So you draw more stuff but update less often to smooth out corners, etc. Will there be trouble spots? Yes, there always are (with any system) but the fixes aren't anything the level builder can't take care of.
If game object geometry is what's heavy (looking at you 10k vert cysts!) then those need lots of LODs so slow systems can work up to the high poly models if the camera is updating too fast (spinning around in combat where entire new vert list is getting rendered every frame). Unreal has been doing this sort of thing forever.
<!--quoteo(post=2059327:date=Jan 11 2013, 05:32 PM:name=AWhite)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AWhite @ Jan 11 2013, 05:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2059327"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I have a really hard time understanding why they wouldn't use a rooming or baked PVS system here. This is the HALLWAY game. It's perfect for that sort of setup.
In Max's forever old post he notes traditional culling solutions aren't ideal for outdoor rooms. There are what? TWO of those in NS2 (landing pad and crevice), and Crevice should get a serious edit so Lerks can't hang outside of draw range and invis-a-spike. This concern seems so unwarranted.
Clamping the cull update can work, but you have to add some fudge factor to what's getting drawn. So you draw more stuff but update less often to smooth out corners, etc. Will there be trouble spots? Yes, there always are (with any system) but the fixes aren't anything the level builder can't take care of.
If game object geometry is what's heavy (looking at you 10k vert cysts!) then those need lots of LODs so slow systems can work up to the high poly models if the camera is updating too fast (spinning around in combat where entire new vert list is getting rendered every frame). Unreal has been doing this sort of thing forever.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think the advantages of this occlusion system are: <ul><li>You can have dynamic occluders</li><li>No time spent compiling VIS data</li></ul>
A good way to address any current issues would be to have the mappers fix the bugs in their occlusion geometry (Mezzanine and Crusher have significant bugs) and I wonder if simplifying the occlusion geometry helps at all (removing pillar-type structures in Refinery). Things like the automatic blast-doors and the server racks in Server Room for Tram are really high-poly.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think the advantages of this occlusion system are:
•You can have dynamic occluders •No time spent compiling VIS data<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
1) I agree dynamic occlusion is a potentially worthwhile goal. Rooming occlusion can easily get tied to whatever gameplay triggers might be needed, weldable doors, etc.
2) Compiling an occlusion pass isn't complicated, its an overnight project in extreme cases, and more typically a lunch-break project if you have a machine dedicated to it.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->...I wonder if simplifying the occlusion geometry helps at all...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This would be a good spot to do some tests. Some objects may need to be cut into multiple objects as well. You mentioned the Tram doors and those are really heavy, its possible the entire door (both sides) is a single object so if either side is drawn you're rendering all the backfaces too. But from Max's post it sounds like they're just drawing polys independent of objects so this shouldn't factor but it does mean there are potentially a lot more polys per calculation.
<!--quoteo(post=2059378:date=Jan 11 2013, 08:59 PM:name=AWhite)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AWhite @ Jan 11 2013, 08:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2059378"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->1) I agree dynamic occlusion is a potentially worthwhile goal. Rooming occlusion can easily get tied to whatever gameplay triggers might be needed, weldable doors, etc.
2) Compiling an occlusion pass isn't complicated, its an overnight project in extreme cases, and more typically a lunch-break project if you have a machine dedicated to it.
This would be a good spot to do some tests. Some objects may need to be cut into multiple objects as well. You mentioned the Tram doors and those are really heavy, its possible the entire door (both sides) is a single object so if either side is drawn you're rendering all the backfaces too. But from Max's post it sounds like they're just drawing polys independent of objects so this shouldn't factor but it does mean there are potentially a lot more polys per calculation.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I was talking generally about polycounts on a couple of assets being really high and separately about some places where there are bugs (holes) in occlusion brushes. The occlusion algorithm (a big <i>I think</i> here) does a visibility test on every object's bounding box (in the area) against the rendered occlusion geometry for your view.
For a completely useless post on some of the OP's hardware;
An AMD FX chips aren't the greatest, in CPU intensive games, they lose to X4's and are left for dust by the Intel SB/IVY lines. They aren't really six cores in a traditional sense, more like a 3 core with 6 threads, it really is quite complicated, the best way I'd hope to describe it is like each module is made of a floating point unit, some cache and 2 integer units. So this module acts as 2 "cores" but they share resources and its only as good as one real core at floating points ops. A traditional core has an integer unit and a floating point unit and some cache.
4.3 Ghz for this chip isnt exactly a monsterous overclock either? Despite the leap from stock.
None the less, it does show that I'd have to agree the game is CPU limited. However, anyone in possession of a 2500k or up should have zero problems, and considering how affordable the i5 lines are, it really shouldn't be too much for most gamers.
I myself am using an i5 2500k, granted it's at 5 Ghz, but the performance in games is basically zero after 4 + which is basically effortless to achieve. I'm also using a GTX 680. I run the game at maximum settings including AO at 1920 x 1200 and get on average 110 fps early game, 80 mid game, and if it's a big server with exos, and crags and jetpacks with onos and skulks blastin in as a hive is going down, i might dip into the 40's. Otherwise, I'm never below 60 at any other point.
My biggest gripe with performance, and granted I'm in the minority with a system like this, would be that the game doesnt scale back very well, the hit from low to high just isn't that much. The game should perform better at lower settings.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->An AMD FX chips aren't the greatest, in CPU intensive games, they lose to X4's and are left for dust by the Intel SB/IVY lines. They aren't really six cores in a traditional sense, more like a 3 core with 6 threads, it really is quite complicated, the best way I'd hope to describe it is like each module is made of a floating point unit, some cache and 2 integer units. So this module acts as 2 "cores" but they share resources and its only as good as one real core at floating points ops. A traditional core has an integer unit and a floating point unit and some cache.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have an old rig 'AMD A64 FX6000+radeon 5870'/ Lowest settings. If i go in the training map and fill it with lot of Cyst and stuff. I got no FPS drop. If i go on a server with an average ping like 60-80 and start a game; no lag until i cross one or two enemy. Suddenly thing go weird. Even in early game which tends to be a little empty...
I do believe it is not only bound to the "machine power" you have. More of an awkward programming that puts together the rendering engine and the game engine so that they are inter-dependant.
<!--quoteo(post=2059491:date=Jan 12 2013, 11:59 AM:name=Tom-R)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom-R @ Jan 12 2013, 11:59 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2059491"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->For a completely useless post on some of the OP's hardware;
An AMD FX chips aren't the greatest, in CPU intensive games, they lose to X4's and are left for dust by the Intel SB/IVY lines. They aren't really six cores in a traditional sense, more like a 3 core with 6 threads, it really is quite complicated, the best way I'd hope to describe it is like each module is made of a floating point unit, some cache and 2 integer units. So this module acts as 2 "cores" but they share resources and its only as good as one real core at floating points ops. A traditional core has an integer unit and a floating point unit and some cache.
4.3 Ghz for this chip isnt exactly a monsterous overclock either? Despite the leap from stock.
None the less, it does show that I'd have to agree the game is CPU limited. However, anyone in possession of a 2500k or up should have zero problems, and considering how affordable the i5 lines are, it really shouldn't be too much for most gamers.
I myself am using an i5 2500k, granted it's at 5 Ghz, but the performance in games is basically zero after 4 + which is basically effortless to achieve. I'm also using a GTX 680. I run the game at maximum settings including AO at 1920 x 1200 and get on average 110 fps early game, 80 mid game, and if it's a big server with exos, and crags and jetpacks with onos and skulks blastin in as a hive is going down, i might dip into the 40's. Otherwise, I'm never below 60 at any other point.
My biggest gripe with performance, and granted I'm in the minority with a system like this, would be that the game doesnt scale back very well, the hit from low to high just isn't that much. The game should perform better at lower settings.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
my 2500k is at 3.8ghz at most because i'm a poor guy and can't afford better cooling or buy anymore i5 2500k's if this one spoils. i get framerates like yours, but i dip below 60 fps starting from mid-game.
personally, i think if you're at 5ghz and the game STILL drops below 60fps at any point in the game, it's simply unacceptable. just my opinion. i think it's really up to the dev team now to improve the performance instead of us upgrading/overclocking/replacing pc components to keep up with this game.
ps. <a href="http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/" target="_blank">http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/</a> <- good read.
Comments
Culling too little is just a performance problem, culling too much results in hideous graphical artifacts. I remember an anti-cheat server plugin for HL mods that would not send player positions of players that could not see each other on the server, improving upon the lax PVIS system used for this by default. Regardless of having latency <10 ms and interp set to 0.05 it's incredibly distracting. And this was just players, not models.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're right things <a href="http://http.developer.nvidia.com/GPUGems/gpugems_ch29.html" target="_blank">will pop into existence</a> when occlusion isn't done every frame. That's basically what the OP said. Time based throttling or a quick flip flop (on/off/on/off e.g. 50% execution per pass) would be a simple test that could yield new insights into the culling performance or any portion of the game logic for that matter, but I'd guess they've already considered/implemented it somewhere. Thread cooperation and execution time can be difficult to understand as a whole model running on shared computer hardware; profiling and throttling key points in the logic are just easy ways of finding your way through the complexity and exposing possible areas of optimization (from my now ancient experience in gamedev). I ended up using both because viewing the profiler stats while throttling portions of the logic can be useful.
<!--quoteo(post=2055483:date=Jan 3 2013, 03:03 PM:name=Soylent_green)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Soylent_green @ Jan 3 2013, 03:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2055483"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Ragdolls and some other such effects are client-side only since they don't hinder player movement and it doesn't matter if they behave slightly differently on every player's screen.
The physical effects that are important are player movement, bullets etc. Those are already interpolated/extrapolated or in the case that the client is causing them, predicted by the client.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sounds mostly right about the ragdoll physics and I should not have said ALL physics are done at the server as well as client (I have zero experience with Spark), however I *think* the dead bodies still have collision bounding boxes that need to be persisted by the server and agreed upon by all clients. Meaning even if a client did not witness the ragdoll effect it will still know about the dead body, so the server is still doing a simulation but probably to a lesser degree (throttling the same physics code as the client perhaps), maintaining the "true" game state and constantly keeping it in sync with clients.
I could be wrong and wouldn't mind if you pointed that out. You seem to have a lot of gamedev knowledge, PM me some of your projects.
Or if someone took the time to convert all performance demanding LUA into C.
<a href="http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee" target="_blank">http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee</a>
LUA is useful for modding and for quick iterations during development.. but i think any end user /customer would be way happier with a faster compiled language yielding better performance.
I wish there would be an easy convert button, so that you could keep modding beyond just a numbers table like balance.lua, and yet when it was time to publish your mod or next patch of ns2, you would convert to faster compiled code.
:shrug:
Some of you here know enough about coding and optimizing that you should take some time and submit some patches :)
Ohh yea it is a free to play game.
<a href="http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee" target="_blank">http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee</a>
LUA is useful for modding and for quick iterations during development.. but i think any end user /customer would be way happier with a faster compiled language yielding better performance.
I wish there would be an easy convert button, so that you could keep modding beyond just a numbers table like balance.lua, and yet when it was time to publish your mod or next patch of ns2, you would convert to faster compiled code.
:shrug:
Some of you here know enough about coding and optimizing that you should take some time and submit some patches :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's kind of a cool utility you found there. I agree that the majority of the game doesn't need to be done in LUA though. It's kind of cool for modders, but really if you want modders to flourish it takes giving out the SDK. I played around with mods for HL1 and that was all C++ and it was fast. Other thing about it was it was damn near universal. Lua is kind of like the linux of programming languages to me. It's free and open source and it has potential but at the end of the day it's more of a hassle than windows.
Ohh yea it is a free to play game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And to this... If only PS2 had 1/8 of the gameplay that NS2 does. PS2 is 0 fun unless you're in a big group and have a clue what you're doing. And even when you do it takes what 2 days to unlock 1 weapon for 1 character for 1 class?
<a href="http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee" target="_blank">http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee</a>
LUA is useful for modding and for quick iterations during development.. but i think any end user /customer would be way happier with a faster compiled language yielding better performance.
I wish there would be an easy convert button, so that you could keep modding beyond just a numbers table like balance.lua, and yet when it was time to publish your mod or next patch of ns2, you would convert to faster compiled code.
:shrug:
Some of you here know enough about coding and optimizing that you should take some time and submit some patches :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll admit I didn't read everything on that page, but if I understand correctly, that program just converts LUA to C directly...why hasn't this been done yet.
Did you really just say 1/8 the game play. Please elaborate on all this game content you talk about. Aliens 5 classes, Marines 3 variants. LoL really any game above 6 v 6 are just lag fests beyond 10 mins. Ohh, you are right that infestation is defiantly worth 7/8 the game since it serves no purpose besides fancy scenery.
Actually it ah...defines where aliens can build and when....*scratches head* sorry man.
Defiantly, you keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means...
Anyway, let's see Planetside 2... It's F2P, so therefore plenty of bugs. The "many weapons" are all just the same model and you have to pay for different art or devote several days to unlocking it for 1 character, for 1 class, for 1 weapon, yea that seems fun. All the "customization" in PS2 is garbage, flat out garbage. I could pick up NS2 and play it and have fun without having to watch a youtube video on how to play it.
But tell you what why does PS2 only have 1/8 the gameplay? From the moment you start the game, you're going to be lost as ###### even if you're a veteran from the previous games. You pick a race, pick 1 of 3 heads and you're suddenly careening to the middle of a fight where you will just repeatedly die with no clue wtf is going on. At least UWE took the time to incorporate youtube videos into the game in case you are lost. With PS2 wtf are you really even doing? Running around shooting at ###### until you die is not fun in the slightest. NS2 actually has like a clear purpose that it states at the beginning of the game. How people sit there grinding kills for days upon days to unlock 1 stupid weapon that is barely better than the last is beyond me. But go have fun with that.
Lagfest beyond 10 minutes in servers greater than 6v6? I don't think so.
I play on 24 person servers just fine without any lag. Obviously, don't pick those 24 person servers that having a low performance percentage. My computer isn't that great and it handles that many people in NS2 just fine, even in late game.
Infestation serves a few purposes:
1) Obviously needed so Alien comm can place buildings.
2) Serves as a visual aid so people know which areas are alien or marine controlled.
3) Visuals. It's amazing to me to see a room basically transformed into something completely different. No other game can accomplish this.
4) Aliens have inreased health regeneration when around infestation.
5) The way infestation spreads makes it so that the Alien commander is forced to more strategically think about where he should expand.
6) Infestation can be used tactically by expanding into an area (such as a marine outpost/base, then shifting over a bunch of whips).
I played PS2 before I got NS2 and there are certainly a number of problems with that game and I wouldn't say the gameplay is any better than NS2'.
I play on 24 person servers just fine without any lag. Obviously, don't pick those 24 person servers that having a low performance percentage. My computer isn't that great and it handles that many people in NS2 just fine, even in late game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have yet to see a 24p server maintain 30 ticks late game. The closest I've seen is National Gaming and a Wolf something server which dips into 12 or 15 as opposed to single digits for other 24p servers
<a href="http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee" target="_blank">http://lua-users.org/wiki/LuaToCee</a>
LUA is useful for modding and for quick iterations during development.. but i think any end user /customer would be way happier with a faster compiled language yielding better performance.
I wish there would be an easy convert button, so that you could keep modding beyond just a numbers table like balance.lua, and yet when it was time to publish your mod or next patch of ns2, you would convert to faster compiled code.
:shrug:
Some of you here know enough about coding and optimizing that you should take some time and submit some patches :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We can't submit patches since none of the code involved in this is opensource. That's the engine source, not the game source. Well, Max did opensource Rocket, his Lua interpreter, but I doubt the code he put on github is all that similar to what's in NS2 anymore; the stuff on github hasn't been updated in 6 months.
KKG servers seem to run very good
Not sure what tick rate they are running late game but I rarely have lag issues on them
Yea I definitely haven't seen lag problems on most 24p servers i've been on. There was 1 or 2 I tried that shouldn't even be running 16 slots though.
Anyway, let's see Planetside 2... It's F2P, so therefore plenty of bugs. The "many weapons" are all just the same model and you have to pay for different art or devote several days to unlocking it for 1 character, for 1 class, for 1 weapon, yea that seems fun. All the "customization" in PS2 is garbage, flat out garbage. I could pick up NS2 and play it and have fun without having to watch a youtube video on how to play it.
But tell you what why does PS2 only have 1/8 the gameplay? From the moment you start the game, you're going to be lost as ###### even if you're a veteran from the previous games. You pick a race, pick 1 of 3 heads and you're suddenly careening to the middle of a fight where you will just repeatedly die with no clue wtf is going on. At least UWE took the time to incorporate youtube videos into the game in case you are lost. With PS2 wtf are you really even doing? Running around shooting at ###### until you die is not fun in the slightest. NS2 actually has like a clear purpose that it states at the beginning of the game. How people sit there grinding kills for days upon days to unlock 1 stupid weapon that is barely better than the last is beyond me. But go have fun with that.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I asked you to please lay out all of this so called content you were talking about. While in all actuality I can think of far more content that was removed from the NS series then newly implemented content. Anyways, pretty sure my response to the OP was how the NS 2 engine is crap, which it is. Then i went on to state how I can play another FPS which has at least 10X the amount of people and not experience the hit reg problems that this game has. The NS 2 community has died down for a reason. The game is bland and has very little depth to it out side of all the hype/content you have made up in your head.
NS 2 engine is up there with the Doom 3 engine.
LoL, no infestation just limits the aliens tactics, the same way the powernodes and tech points limit marine tactics. If it provided benefits, which was the original plan for it then it would add some depth but UWE removed the upgrade paths. This pretty much makes it nothing more the a drag on game performance.
NS 2 engine is up there with the Doom 3 engine.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Planetside2 has its fair share of gameplay-breaking issues. I've personally had problems where the whole world to flick between visible and invisible few times per second and I had to close the game because I couldn't look at it any longer, players disappear right infront of me, players appearing to continue their last known movements off cliffs, the game almost locks up to <1 fps now and then, and I can't use air vehicles because the game stutters if you move around too fast.
Ye, the same way resource costs limit alien and marine tactics.
Sometimes you need limits in order to feel free.
Not sure what tick rate they are running late game but I rarely have lag issues on them<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea I found this website that keep track of tickrates and such. <a href="http://ns2servers.devicenull.org/" target="_blank">http://ns2servers.devicenull.org/</a>
From what I saw yesterday, only KKG, National Gaming, and Wolf Pack Roam sky is able to somewhat keep a decent tick late game with 1k+ entities. At that point though, even those servers dip down to teens for tickrate, which is better than most other servers crawling along at single digit ticks.
Why are you even here, Lastdon? You don't like the game? Don't play it and don't waste your time and ours posting unhelpful nonsense on these forums.
Shut the door on your way out.
(PS I played planetside 2 in the beta for a while, but since NS2 came out, I've only played PS2 once and found it very boring. I can satisfy my KDR needs in NS2 which, in addition to the FPS side, gives much more rewarding tactical and team-based play experiences - IMHO).
NS 2 engine is up there with the Doom 3 engine.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're just trying to troll and I'm done feeding you.
In Max's forever old post he notes traditional culling solutions aren't ideal for outdoor rooms. There are what? TWO of those in NS2 (landing pad and crevice), and Crevice should get a serious edit so Lerks can't hang outside of draw range and invis-a-spike. This concern seems so unwarranted.
Clamping the cull update can work, but you have to add some fudge factor to what's getting drawn. So you draw more stuff but update less often to smooth out corners, etc. Will there be trouble spots? Yes, there always are (with any system) but the fixes aren't anything the level builder can't take care of.
If game object geometry is what's heavy (looking at you 10k vert cysts!) then those need lots of LODs so slow systems can work up to the high poly models if the camera is updating too fast (spinning around in combat where entire new vert list is getting rendered every frame). Unreal has been doing this sort of thing forever.
In Max's forever old post he notes traditional culling solutions aren't ideal for outdoor rooms. There are what? TWO of those in NS2 (landing pad and crevice), and Crevice should get a serious edit so Lerks can't hang outside of draw range and invis-a-spike. This concern seems so unwarranted.
Clamping the cull update can work, but you have to add some fudge factor to what's getting drawn. So you draw more stuff but update less often to smooth out corners, etc. Will there be trouble spots? Yes, there always are (with any system) but the fixes aren't anything the level builder can't take care of.
If game object geometry is what's heavy (looking at you 10k vert cysts!) then those need lots of LODs so slow systems can work up to the high poly models if the camera is updating too fast (spinning around in combat where entire new vert list is getting rendered every frame). Unreal has been doing this sort of thing forever.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think the advantages of this occlusion system are:
<ul><li>You can have dynamic occluders</li><li>No time spent compiling VIS data</li></ul>
A good way to address any current issues would be to have the mappers fix the bugs in their occlusion geometry (Mezzanine and Crusher have significant bugs) and I wonder if simplifying the occlusion geometry helps at all (removing pillar-type structures in Refinery). Things like the automatic blast-doors and the server racks in Server Room for Tram are really high-poly.
•You can have dynamic occluders
•No time spent compiling VIS data<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
1) I agree dynamic occlusion is a potentially worthwhile goal. Rooming occlusion can easily get tied to whatever gameplay triggers might be needed, weldable doors, etc.
2) Compiling an occlusion pass isn't complicated, its an overnight project in extreme cases, and more typically a lunch-break project if you have a machine dedicated to it.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->...I wonder if simplifying the occlusion geometry helps at all...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This would be a good spot to do some tests. Some objects may need to be cut into multiple objects as well. You mentioned the Tram doors and those are really heavy, its possible the entire door (both sides) is a single object so if either side is drawn you're rendering all the backfaces too. But from Max's post it sounds like they're just drawing polys independent of objects so this shouldn't factor but it does mean there are potentially a lot more polys per calculation.
2) Compiling an occlusion pass isn't complicated, its an overnight project in extreme cases, and more typically a lunch-break project if you have a machine dedicated to it.
This would be a good spot to do some tests. Some objects may need to be cut into multiple objects as well. You mentioned the Tram doors and those are really heavy, its possible the entire door (both sides) is a single object so if either side is drawn you're rendering all the backfaces too. But from Max's post it sounds like they're just drawing polys independent of objects so this shouldn't factor but it does mean there are potentially a lot more polys per calculation.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I was talking generally about polycounts on a couple of assets being really high and separately about some places where there are bugs (holes) in occlusion brushes. The occlusion algorithm (a big <i>I think</i> here) does a visibility test on every object's bounding box (in the area) against the rendered occlusion geometry for your view.
An AMD FX chips aren't the greatest, in CPU intensive games, they lose to X4's and are left for dust by the Intel SB/IVY lines. They aren't really six cores in a traditional sense, more like a 3 core with 6 threads, it really is quite complicated, the best way I'd hope to describe it is like each module is made of a floating point unit, some cache and 2 integer units. So this module acts as 2 "cores" but they share resources and its only as good as one real core at floating points ops. A traditional core has an integer unit and a floating point unit and some cache.
4.3 Ghz for this chip isnt exactly a monsterous overclock either? Despite the leap from stock.
None the less, it does show that I'd have to agree the game is CPU limited. However, anyone in possession of a 2500k or up should have zero problems, and considering how affordable the i5 lines are, it really shouldn't be too much for most gamers.
I myself am using an i5 2500k, granted it's at 5 Ghz, but the performance in games is basically zero after 4 + which is basically effortless to achieve. I'm also using a GTX 680. I run the game at maximum settings including AO at 1920 x 1200 and get on average 110 fps early game, 80 mid game, and if it's a big server with exos, and crags and jetpacks with onos and skulks blastin in as a hive is going down, i might dip into the 40's. Otherwise, I'm never below 60 at any other point.
My biggest gripe with performance, and granted I'm in the minority with a system like this, would be that the game doesnt scale back very well, the hit from low to high just isn't that much. The game should perform better at lower settings.
I have an old rig 'AMD A64 FX6000+radeon 5870'/ Lowest settings.
If i go in the training map and fill it with lot of Cyst and stuff. I got no FPS drop.
If i go on a server with an average ping like 60-80 and start a game; no lag until i cross one or two enemy. Suddenly thing go weird. Even in early game which tends to be a little empty...
I do believe it is not only bound to the "machine power" you have. More of an awkward programming that puts together the rendering engine and the game engine so that they are inter-dependant.
An AMD FX chips aren't the greatest, in CPU intensive games, they lose to X4's and are left for dust by the Intel SB/IVY lines. They aren't really six cores in a traditional sense, more like a 3 core with 6 threads, it really is quite complicated, the best way I'd hope to describe it is like each module is made of a floating point unit, some cache and 2 integer units. So this module acts as 2 "cores" but they share resources and its only as good as one real core at floating points ops. A traditional core has an integer unit and a floating point unit and some cache.
4.3 Ghz for this chip isnt exactly a monsterous overclock either? Despite the leap from stock.
None the less, it does show that I'd have to agree the game is CPU limited. However, anyone in possession of a 2500k or up should have zero problems, and considering how affordable the i5 lines are, it really shouldn't be too much for most gamers.
I myself am using an i5 2500k, granted it's at 5 Ghz, but the performance in games is basically zero after 4 + which is basically effortless to achieve. I'm also using a GTX 680. I run the game at maximum settings including AO at 1920 x 1200 and get on average 110 fps early game, 80 mid game, and if it's a big server with exos, and crags and jetpacks with onos and skulks blastin in as a hive is going down, i might dip into the 40's. Otherwise, I'm never below 60 at any other point.
My biggest gripe with performance, and granted I'm in the minority with a system like this, would be that the game doesnt scale back very well, the hit from low to high just isn't that much. The game should perform better at lower settings.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
my 2500k is at 3.8ghz at most because i'm a poor guy and can't afford better cooling or buy anymore i5 2500k's if this one spoils. i get framerates like yours, but i dip below 60 fps starting from mid-game.
personally, i think if you're at 5ghz and the game STILL drops below 60fps at any point in the game, it's simply unacceptable. just my opinion. i think it's really up to the dev team now to improve the performance instead of us upgrading/overclocking/replacing pc components to keep up with this game.
ps. <a href="http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/" target="_blank">http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/</a> <- good read.